BREXIT? Am I just plain stupid?

Bizarrely, the areas of Britain that voted in favour of Brexit seem to be most likely to suffer a downturn as a result. They were miserable already, they clutched at the straw of a Brexit and now they'll be even more miserable. See:
www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/brexit-heartlands-want-someone-else-to-pay-pthzgl35g

quote
Take Grimsby. It’s one of the most deprived areas of Britain; it hasn’t flourished in the decades since we joined the EU and it voted by 70 per cent to 30 per cent for Leave. Two weeks ago the anxious representatives of one of the town’s biggest remaining industries, seafood processing, went to Westminster to petition MPs to grant Grimsby the exceptional status of a free trade port when we leave.

Grimsby is desperate to avoid the imposition of post-Brexit tariff barriers, delays and customs checks on its fish business, because it imports 90 per cent of its fish fresh from Europe. It is also worried about losing the 20 per cent of its workforce that comes from abroad. If Brexit goes ahead without any special concessions to Grimsby then an industry that includes Young’s and The Saucy Fish Co, and that employs 5,000 people, fears it will lose its competitive edge to rival centres in Germany and France.

In South Tyneside, which backed Leave by 62 per cent to 38 per cent, the local council is also seeking protection from the results of Brexit. Last week the think tank IPPR North revealed that leaving will hit the north much harder than London; in an area that’s already substantially poorer than the south, more than 10 per cent of the region’s goods and services are dependent on EU trade, compared with 7 per cent in London.

It’s the same pattern in care homes or hospitals, where the elderly who voted 64 per cent to 36 per cent to leave are going to be worst affected by the fact that the flow of EU nurses has fallen by 90 per cent in 12 months. Before the vote they made up a third of new nurse registrations.

Or take the waste-management firm in the Midlands, located in a sea of Leavers, that now can’t get European firms to renew their five-year deals on taking unrecyclable waste to use as fuel, because nobody knows what the post-Brexit trade terms will be.

end quote

Seems a bit rich to expect them to pay for all the new infrastructure needed, when they didnt want it in the first place. I assume some of that will be taken into account in the divorce bill?

OK, so it seems that by consensus it been agreed to use the letter C on GN for the upcoming celebrations. Now, how about the current subject being referred to as B for the purposes of future postings on GN. Just a suggestion, what do you think folks? The B letter seems so appropriate for what is swiftly becoming such a really over discussed subject on which few of us are likely to change our view. (Hard hat on and ducking down to avoid flack).

Interesting dj your "infacts" article about Dyson when interviewed on Andrew Marr last Sunday. I was sure Dyson was talking nonsense but did Marr pull him up? No.
In the past I've used the BBC as a reliable source of unbiased news. But no longer is it unbiased. The Today programme also seems to be staffed by Tories and Brexiters.
The Government has made sure that the BBC is only impartial as long as it fits in with the Government line.

Bluegal is right. There is no impartial source of Brexit news now.

Re sentient beings - tell that to my dog. He’s full of himself have just come back from a hair cut.

I can think of numerous reasons to stay in the EU and none to leave - can Lemon or anyone else add to that?

mostly that’s why it is so important to have political threads that can be informative and tested/questioned. This makes for a much more knowledgable gran population.

infacts.org/minister-forced-correct-claim-article-50-reversibility/

Lord Callanan telling porkies now. He retracted it when made to three days later.

"Callanan, a pro-Brexit peer who this year attacked the “ayatollahs” in the EU, only came into his Dexeu post on October 27, after Joyce Anelay became the third minister to leave the department in four months. His primary role is shepherding Brexit legislation through the House of Lords, an unenviable task made more challenging by his apparent failure to get on top of the facts.

The government refuses to release legal advice on whether Article 50 can be revoked. But Callanan’s retraction, and the government’s failure to rebut Kerr’s opinion, speaks volumes. It is not too late to change our minds."

I like Infacts, mostly harmless. It isn't unbiased, but then it doesn't pretend to be.
Anyone who can refute their arguments is welcome to try.

Fake news/facts everywhere. Even in Parliament - Theresa May in just about every PMQ.

The BBC's Brexit bias was obvious from the moment David Dimbleby announced "we're out". We're not out. I conceed that the pressures exerted on our politicians by the leave lobby are so strong that we are likely to end up going out, but it should not be taken as a fait-a-complis.

Even before the vote the BBC insisted on giving equal time to sensible informed comments from the remain side and lies from the leavers.

If the BBC ever decides to discuss the shape of the earth, no doubt the flat-earthers will be given equal billing with those experts who can tell us the earth is spherical.

I have every sympathy for places like Grimsby, Cornwall, Tyneside and Wales. They will lose out badly post Brexit. Why wasn't this made clear to them before the Referendum?
Not sure about Brighton's claims though ww?

I think even Farage is recognising that we will need to pay about 60bn. If we don’t the rest of the world will look very poorly on us for not respecting contracts etc.

The EU has Brexit totally mapped out line by line - the next activity will be to begin to look at trade. This is planned for two weeks time, which is why they are pressurising Davis to move his ass.

Contrary to what Brexiters are saying on here, the EUs primary concern are the people and the consequences.

But in my view the most intractable problem is Northern Ireland.

Head of Goldman Sachs calling for second referendum.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42014209

most I don’t know - dj can you enlighten us?

Everyone seems to be a remainer in Brighton though.

We are special of course so that is probably all you need to know?

Am I the only person on Gransnet who voted to leave. Never mind the whole of Cornwall did. I do not want to be governed by unelected officials from a country who does not understand the UK. I want Parliament to make our laws and my elected MP to vote for them. I do not want a European army, etc, etc.

Oh no dogs there are quite a few but they never seem to have anything positive about Brexit to say, except quoting verbatim the stories they’ve been spun, which are so wrong and Ill informed

I think you'll find we're actually governed by a group of people [eg ReeMogg/Gove/Johnson/Redwood] who have no idea about the lives of ordinary people in this country. Oh, and they're the ones that make the rules, too. And their is not going to be a European Army; it's fake news and even if it wasn't we'd still have been able to veto it.

Too right tegan

I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but the situations you describe in the UK are strikingly similar to what's happening here in the US and to varying degrees in places like Spain, Latin America and elsewhere around the world.

Like many of you here, I too have trouble understanding the 'why's and wherefores' of everything that's going on. I can't make any sense of all the 'unsuitable' appointments, surprise electoral outcomes and irrational decisions made by new leaders. For the most part, they all have little or no accreditation or experience to carry out the responsibilities they have been entrusted with.

I did not vote for our current President and was surprised and dismayed when we lost what seemed like a free and fair election. I couldn't help wondering if someone had deliberately interfered with our electoral process in order to undermine our Democracy and destroy our way of life.

I now know that I was not alone in that assessment. We have since learned that the US election was deliberately manipulated by Russian hackers. If the other side of our government continues to shed light on this, we may be able to learn how far this really goes.

New policies and decisions over healthcare, budgets, taxes and education don't make much sense when they run counter to preserving a sound way of governing and to preserve the ordinary things we all value in life. More dangerous still is the threat of nuclear proliferation or climate change and making policy changes that now threaten our planet and our survival as a species.

So, for whatever it's worth, I often find myself asking, "What manner of people are these, what is it they seek and who are 'they'?" Really!

Dogsjj you are not alone. I agree with your sentiments.

I have been following debate and progress but it seems the EU have not presented an itemised bill that their own EU lawyers agree. Davis gets told different amounts at each meeting but no item for item bill. They appear to give he general areas which he attempts to go through line by line to check if we agree we owe money. Our lawyers calculate we owe much less than EU is demanding. We should pay what we legally have to not a penny more or less. The reason EU are dragging out negotiations is when we leave they will have black funding hole with only 3 out of 27 making net contribution.

willa; yes, the similarities are frightening. I am on an American political facebook page and sometimes I have to read things twice to see which country is being referred to.