Mrs, Miss or Ms

Mad isn't it Gagagran?

My DH was in hospital and they had his "real" name written above his bed with "to be known as XXXX" written underneath !

I think it started because his first name was the same as his fathers and became confused with his (and now mine) very long winded stupid surname.

I mean if you were calling a child say for example David Stephen Smith call him that......

If you want him to be known as Stephen David Smith , DO IT THE OTHER WAY AROUND !!

SIMPLE ISN'T IT???????

for the record my DH is not called either David or Stephen

I like to be addressed as Ma'am. Puts feet up and adjusts crown

have been both Miss and Mrs. and now Ms for many years; seems only logical . Also reverted to maiden name (what a daft expression that is) many years back, after end of final disastrous partnership.

I am going back to mine, after many years divorced under a different name (a freedom name!).
I didn't used to like it, but now I know about my family history and I am proud of them.

PS - Re the OP - I have never met any feminists that militant!

Me neither.

I haven't met them in RL but I find them online.

Where Leticia - on forums for militant feminists

I don't think I'm a feminist...well part of me isn't. I believe in equal pay and opportunities in education and work but....

....women tend to be nurturers and men protectors/providers. I think we're two halves of a whole.

Depends what you call a feminist. I support women's rights and equality. However, I don't hate or even dislike men - I have two great sons and three grandsons, all brought up to respect women as equal partners. My ex called himself a feminist but if I brought feminism into the home, he went off in a hissy fit!

I'm with you VQ we each have our perfect place in the world.

I can't help thinking feminism has gone too far. At the beginning it had a cause. Wrongs needed to be righted but now if we're not careful it will be used to emasculate men. Just as it was wrong to show women as little housewives who virtually orgasmed as the prospect of owning a Kenwood Chef or not too bright secretaries simply waiting for Mr Right to come along it's also wrong to portray men as fools who need a woman to help them switch on the washing machine or sex objects (the diet coke advert). In fact if the diet coke advert was the other way round with men leering at a fit young girl all hell would break loose.

I prefer Ms and feel strongly Miss is for under 18s, to me it sounds silly. It's a bit like addressing an eighteen year old man as Master.

Many married women use Ms, it's not just for divorced or single women. If married or single women prefer Mrs I don't see that as a problem either.

I fear it will always be that way no matter what VQ. Although we have moved on considerably since I first began working in engineering. In those earlier days various reps brought in topless calendars that the "lads" put up in various places around the factory. It was a case of put up and shut up. Thankfully the calendars these days tend to be a lot more tasteful.

Pretty girls will always parade at the Grand Prix/BTCC etc.

Pretty girls will always sell clothes, aftershave, cars to airheaded men.

I was pretty excited when I got my first Kenwood mixer a few months back, after wanting one for about 20 years but not being able to afford the real thing. DH was very excited when he got the motor mover fitted to our caravan, so I guess it's horses for courses.

I think the definition of feminism has changed with time. To be a feminist used to be to want women to catch up with men in so many fields where they were disadvantaged, and it was a proud name. It led to women getting control of their own money, access to their children if a marriage broke down, the vote, improvements in how women were educated and their subsequent careers.

In the UK and part of the world we have all these, so there is a degree of complacency and the belief that there is no longer any need for women to fight for them, so they should shut up about another inequalities they can still see.

It is not helped by some people now who call themselves feminists but are really misanthropists - "Feminism" is now another word in some ears for "strident ball-breaker"

And of course there are still some misogynists who to this day would rather women stayed in the kitchen murmuring, "Yes, dear"

With Ms vs Mrs or Miss, the inequality is that s formal address a man is a Mr whether he is a callow youth of 18 with no history behind him or a sage old grandfather. A women is instantly labelled - she is either a Miss - a young girl or an embittered spinster schoolteacher - or a Mrs - a matron with a committed male partner who will see off a seducer.

I am happy to be Mrs (though my other half is no more) but that is my choice. There is no need for anyone else to assume that I am a doormat because I don't insist on being a Muzz.

I am a Equalforall person.and I too have never met a staunch feminist .(my that would be fun)
Some of you people seem to have had a turn around in your opinions.
Your either feminist or you believe in equality.
NO,you can't be both.Feminist want special treatment.Your right Vampire queen.Anything belittling women,the feminist would be right on their soapbox.but are quite happy to do it to men.
No like you, I believe we are the same,but different .We each have something to contribute to a better world.
In fact if you think of all women or all men,they will each be different to each other.

That is where I think the definition has shifted. Now feminism is seen as women against men. It used to be that women are as good as men.

Feminism wants women to be valued, whether they choose to be engineers or stay-at-home mums or anything else.
It's not an either/or.

I do think it's backfired somewhat, though. OK so the official line is that women must be valued as women whatever they choose to do, but behind the scenes some men are even more anti-women than they ever were because they feel 'got at'.

Do you believe they actually are 'got at'?

I believe they think they are.

It seems that women who are stay at home mums are not really valued though. They seem to be looked down on by many women who go out to work and the gov seems to be pushing them to work too.

Men go to work. Women go to work then take care of the children, do the housework, shopping, washing, iron and a host of other tasks. What's wrong with simply being a mother? Why does a woman have to do so much more? I know in some cases it's the need for money....my mum had to work because my dad was blacklisted and could never get overtime.

There is a joke in Addams Family Values when Gomez talks to Fester about the 'joy of having children, and of paying someone else to raise them.' That seems to be what mothers are being encouraged/forced to do.

I know what you mean vq. True equality should be about having choices - whether to work or whether to stay at home and raise your children yourself. If a woman chooses to be a full-time homemaker and mother she shouldn't have to feel that she is somehow inferior, or not making a worthwhile contribution to society. I can't think of an occupation that is more worthwhile than raising the next generation.