Emotionally abusive son

I realise that small children suffer separation anxiety when/if parents part company and also the trauma that goes with it. Their lives begin to be mixed up at such a young age and they can't understand disharmony in a household.
It can and does in a lot of cases carry on through their adult life. What your son has is a form of PTSD for which he should have been counselled for in the years he was being physically abusive.
None of us know what goes on in a child's mind when they're so young and they're too young to explain.
For someone especially a man to be on a short fuse isn't good so an appointment with a GP wouldn't go amiss with a view to a session of counselling before it really gets out of hand.

Happily I have not. But looking at it from an outside perspective I’m wondering why you conitinue to support this man?
You’ve done more than enough. Yes, you probably love him, after all he is your son, but I would cut the umbilical chord once and for all and only meet him on your terms.

You have another son I see. I hope your relationship with him is happier and healthier. I feel for you.

I agree that he would benefit from some sort of therapy but every time I have brought it up he shuts down and point blank refuses. He can't see that his behaviour has made everyone in his family have nothing to do with him. He just wants to blame me for everything that has happened.

My life is easier when he's not in it but now he has a child it's another story.

I agree Anja and that's where I'm at right now, I have tried in every way with him, I just feel sad though by cutting him off I am cutting off my GC.

You have tried your best , he walked away from counselling twice , he is still your son but maybe he needs to grow up and take his troubles to a counsellor by himself , step back , I feel sorry for the children but it is up to him to calm down and take a good look at himself

Have you been able to start some sort of relationship with the gf - the mother of your grandchild? She may suffer from his abuse too, or may do so in the future, and perhaps you could join forces to get him to go to therapy. She needs to hear your side of the story.

I have got on well with her so far but she has kept quiet since me and Ds have fallen out. Ds told me not to bother contacting her as she agrees with him that I am being selfish in not offering full time child care.

Interesting that he told you not to contact gf and that "she agrees with him." That rings alarm bells with me. Judging by his previous behaviour, he likes to control people and situations.
Everyone dances to his tune and if you don't, you obviously don't love him. He's a 32 year old with the mindset of a 14 year old.
Perhaps it's time to let him go until he grows up.
So sorry you are going through this.

Alice. You most certainly are not being selfish. I can’t think anyone with even the best relationship could or would offer full time care, and if another child comes along a precident has been set and you will probably be expected to do that too.
While you want to have a relationship with your grandchild it sounds likely that regular say weekly contact willl leaVe you open to more stress. You are entitled to enjoy retirement and using children in this situation is
Unacceptable. Your son is an adult, many of us hVe had trauma in our early lives but there is a point when we have to stop blaming others for things that happened and get on with our lives trying not to repeat cycles. You are not his emotional punch bag. I am sorry you are having to put up with this.
Does he have a relationship with his brother? Coukd/would he intervene ?

Thank you everyone for your wise words.

I agree it's time to put a stop to this abusive cycle, if it wasn't for my GC I would do so without hesitation. It's never going to stop.

His brother has little to do with him because of his treatment to me, he's a very different person and thankfully we are very close.

This is so hard for you songForAlice, especially now there is a GC. However, I think your son is using emotional blackmail to try to make you take on far more than you should do or even be able to do. The child is his, not yours, after all. (Im sorry, that sounds rather brutal, but what I mean is that as a grandparent it is not your role to take on full time child care whilst he and his gf live a life as if they didn’t have a child to fit into the equation. He is being extremely unreasonable). He is not a child anymore. He is 32 and it’s high time he shouldered his responsibilities rather than demand that you shoulder them.
I think you already know the answer from things you have posted, but I understand it is no easy matter. for you.

I always hesitate with thread like this because it is a problem I have not had to face, but the title you give this thread Emotionally abusive son, shows that you are aware of what is being done to you and what action you need to take.

Five day childcare is an unreasonable demand to make, unless there are exceptional reasons why this help is necessary. I cannot see anything exceptional in this case based on what you have said.

I think you should say 'no' and stick to it. It may mean a period of no contact, but I think if you show yourself strong on this issue and on any other demand that may arise and he realises that acting like 2 year old doesn't work anymore, he may grow up and start to respect you.

I've had a slightly similar experience, with my younger son. When I split from my ex he could never accept it. It tore him apart. And me. We could hardly speak for many years.
The others adjusted better.
He's in his 50s now, lives abroad. We're a little closer now, and I think feelings have healed. His Dad, my ex, died in Jan.
So, you obviously understand the background. Try to be patient , say you'll always love him, but he's asking too much from you. Offer what you can.

It’s time you showed the low life the door.
There is only so much a person can take and expecting you to mind the child for five days plus school runs is a demand that is impractical.
The word parasite comes to mind.
You deserve far better than what he is bringing to your life.
Be strong and protect your personal wellbeing.

I wonder if contacting Women’s Aid may give you some support to get your emotional strength together to cope with this abusive relationship. Good luck. ?

Oh yes, I know your situation only too well when it comes to expectations of free childcare and the result of saying NO.
I believe that if you can't afford to have children, then you shouldn't, but rather wait until you can, or until you have reached that time when the old biological clock is ticking and time running out.
My youngest son and his partner decided to have a baby, even though they knew she would have to go back to work almost straightaway to help keep them afloat financially.

'Of course', my son said, 'we know you will help out'. I asked what he meant. 'Looking after the baby for us'.

I was truly gobsmacked. I have health issues, and have had for quite a while now, had them when this baby was expected. Some problems with balance being amongst the issues. I had given up driving, hadn't a car, to get to them by bus would have meant two separate bus trips. I had my own life, a part time job which I loved, and now with no dependants at home, a little spare cash and freedom. I was in no way a suitable person to look after a baby/toddler, which is what they were expecting of me, even though they knew about the health problems,that some days I just felt too rotten to do anything.

So, knowing he could be a bit touchy and impatient at times, likely to run off at the mouth without thinking, I wrote to him, saying I wouldn't be looking after the baby, physically wouldn't feel safe or comfortable doing so, and that they would have to make other arrangements.

I got a very rude, hurtful letter back. That was over ten years ago, and despite my best efforts to heal the breach, he has made it perfectly clear I am an unfit mother/grandmother, don't deserve a family - blah blah blah. He hasn't spoken to me in all that time. We did see our granddaughter a couple of times, but not since she was 18 months old. Yes it is sad that this child, and her younger sister, are being deprived of two loving grandparents, don't even know of our existence. But I am not going to carry on beating myself up about this. It is their loss. I have moved on. Bur Christmas can be hard, as you might imagine.
I hope you get your situation sorted before it escalates like mine did, though I have to say, and sorry if this offends, but it doesn't sound like he had much respect for you in the first place, and frankly, I think you were a saint to put up with his shenanigans as long as you have done. Be strong.

Oh ditzyme that is such a sad story. Did your son not realise the safety of the baby was paramount and that was what you were thinking of. Anyone who is unsteady on their feet cannot look after a baby or small child.
You are right not to beat yourself up about this as it seems your son and his wife were totally insensitive to your needs. It's still hard though isn't it when heart says one thing and head another.

So sorry to hear of your experiences * ditzyme*.
It appears that it is now expected by our children that the grandparent will take over day time care.
The fact that he expected you to get two buses to reach him and more importantly your health problems, cutting you off, speaks volumes for his utter disrespect for you and a selfish despicable personality.
I wish you well.

At the end of the day he is going to use whatever methods he thinks fit to get his own way. It has worked in the past and how he has the GC to use too. If you go along with him the peace will hold until the next time. So I guess it's up to you to decide whether you will stick to your guns. Perhaps a compromise of 2 days a week, just to give him some wriggle room?

There seems to be a tendency in the younger generation/ our children to expect us to carry on giving to them.
They expect us to babysit while they work. They also expect us to supply them with money (or goods) even though they are adults now and they often have adult partners.
When we need help or support they don't help. They don't care about our dodgy health situations. Despite knowing our health problems they still expect babysitting. They will not accompany us to medical appointments. Mine only ever came to my house to drop off DGC for babysitting, they never had time to sit and talk.
They employ the No Contact in an effort to control grand parents. It is emotional abuse and unpleasant to both the older and younger generations.
It says more about the younger generation than us in my opinion

westerlywind Well said, though it is probably partly our fault for giving them too much as we raised them.
I grew up in poverty and overcompensated by giving my children a very loving and well provided existence.
Took pleasure in it but I often wonder whether it set them up able to cope with adult life.
I am a soft touch for my grandchildren too, taking pleasure seeing their faces when given their latest requests.

I think before undertaking childcare grandparents need a good relationship with the parents. From what you say this is not going to happen because your son is abusive if you don't agree to his demands. I wonder why his girlfriend and the mother of the 2 children was not present when this conversation took place?
IF your son gets professional help and learns to accept his past, to control his anger and to treat you with respect then that might be a better time to offer some childcare. In the meantime you need to protect yourself from abuse.

Songforalice may I say I feel for you and can see how hard this is for you. You love your son no matter what your practical head says and I think the poster who calls him a lowlife and a parasite has no understanding of how useless and hurtful that sort of comment is

Your son may well be mentally ill he has self medicated his hurt with drugs in the past and may still do so
However I can also see how what he has asked of you is too much and he has taken your hesitation as yet another rebuffal His emotions are totally out of his control now
The unfortunate thing is he won’t work with a professional
So you are stuck between a rock and a hard place
I think you should approach the girlfriend with what you do feel you can do maybe a note if you don’t see them offer one or two days and then leave it
Your sons emotions through childhood rejections are totally uncontrollable so he is desperately controlling what he can and that is you, he has never emotionally got past the young abandoned boy and without professional help he won’t

Carry on loving him however unlovable his actions are and offer what you can There is nothing else you can do but please understand these are not the actions of a normally functioning man he is mentally very damaged

Song for Alice - my heart goes out to you. I hope you will take on board the advice given here. Time to put your foot down and bring an end to this abuse now, otherwise the cycle will just continue. Stop feeling guilty, you have a right to enjoy your retirement without being blackmailed by an adult who should know better. Someone needs to stand up to him - I fear for the girlfriend if he doesn't accept some counselling.