Are we seeing the demise of Christmas?

I totally agree with durhamjen. The turn of the year, the passing of the shortest day, the gradual, but visible, lengthening of daylight hours was celebrated for obvious reasons long before Christianity. These celebrations naturally involved feasting and the giving and receiving of gifts. For this reason I cannot understand why we honour the same event twice in one week! (I mean Christmas and New Year).

sarahellenwhitney I do not recognisant the Christmas you describe. As a child, in the 1960s, Christmas always involved adults getting drunk. Visiting friends and family was impossible because very few owned a car and the complete lack of public transport. Home made 'goodies' were scorned as home made cakes were normal everyday fare, and shop bought was special.

My Gp's surgey has a lovely tree. I complemented the staff on it. A pleaseure to look at when waiting for a prescription.

I hope this is allowed,its my local ministers christamas msg in the local newspaper :Hi Pat, Is this any good? In those days Donald Trump was about to take the reins of office in Washington while Theresa May held sway in Britain. Brexit was about to happen, many things were in doubt. There was the ever present threat of terrorism. Monopoly money was to be spent on Trident Mark 2 while services at the local hospital continued to be sliced.
At that time Joseph from Bellsymyre was out of work. He and his wife Mary piled all of their belongings into their 15 year old Skoda and set off for Sunderland. Joseph’s cousin promised him work there. The journey was not a comfortable one for Mary, the heater was not working and the car shook with every bump on the road. Joseph also knew the MOT was out of date.
Late that night she started into labour. They decided to try to reach Newcastle When it looked as if she was not going to make it Joseph turned quickly into a Premier Inn parking lot just outside the town. It was there that she gave birth to her first child, assisted by Magda a waitress, just off duty. They wrapped the child in towels with the company emblem on it.
I have taken some liberties with the story but more or less that is it. Government legislation in first century Palastine coupled with an accident of birth forced a young couple to make an unnecessery journey. There search for a room was met with a litany os similar responses….NO ROOM and so she was forced to give birth in a cow shed. 21st Century Britian can also be a place where for some, through accident of birth or disadvantage there is still no room….
As I watched the children of Christie Park School a few nights ago sing Christmas songs with such joy and enthusiasm I was touched, and uttered a silent prayer that the light in their eyes and hope in their hearts may never be dimmed. For them may there always be room and a meaningful future. We owe it to them.
I wish you peace and joy at this special time.

Excellent Message Paddyann

the minister who wrote it is in my and thousands of others view a true christian,his church is always standing room only EVERY week,he fights for the people who cant fight for themselves and will help anyone who needs it,His sermons are renowned for being topical ....and true .Glad you liked it Granny23

Our two grandkids in this country have a Pagan grandmother (me!), Pagan parents and a Hindu grandfather, and they all celebrate Christmas with all the usual stuff - carols, angels, Jesus in the manger, etc. None of us object, and it would be pretty hard to avoid the nativity story if your kids go to school, (in our little girls' case, it is a Monetessori group run by two devout Christians), watch tv or receive Xmas cards. Sometimes, when they're belting out "Away In A Manger" at the top of their voices, their mum and I look wryly at each other and say "Christian brainwashing..." but it just makes us smile. I think that it's the same for most people of other faiths. Certainly all the younger Hindu families I know have to do Xmas, with presents and all, because their children expect it!

We live in an extremely multi-cultural city and we've got a huge Xmas tree in the city centre and another outside the football ground, and there is always a crib alongside the other decorations in Town Hall Square.

Anyway, the Christian Church nicked the winter celebration from the Pagans and today is Yule, so Happy Winter Solstice!

JUST FOR YOU Bluecat,https://youtu.be/9-aic4qHQWA

sorry didn't know youtube links dont work here ,its the beautiful Sol Invictus by Thea Gilmore

I have worked with Muslims & Hindus who always sent Christmas cards & celebrated Christmas - the children pick it up at school, they do however often have only small gifts as they save larger celebrations for their own Festivals.

I live in a small Town, lights are all up & tree - big switch on was 3rd December with Santa present. Churches have Carol Services, don't know about schools but last week at our monthly Lunch (Farm Shop & Cafe) a local school choir, all Primary age, came & sang Christmas Carols, very good they were

youtu.be/9-aic4qHQWA

(They do work, you just have to be careful to leave a clear space before and after!)

Sadly Christmas has absolutely nothing to do with religion any more. It's just a huge shop/gorge fest. I detest Christmas now with all the hype. There seems to be little festive spirit when your out and about shopping or trying to park your car. People are just head down and focused on things they have to buy.
Mad thing is every year we all get dragged into it.

It depends, doesn't it.
Christmas is everything to do with the birth of Jesus for some people.

Christmas is whatever you make it. Churches and cathedrals have services, radio and TV have services. Radio and TV also have Christmas music of all sorts and "Christmas editions" where the regular presenters act daft, retailers sell as much as they can. Families get together and celebrate according to their own wishes.

No-one can force you to buy what you can't afford, laugh at non-funny jokes, get pissed enough to fall over or fall out with your relatives.

There was surely a Midwinter festival here before the country became Christian. So it seems to me that Christmas has always been part pagan. The holly and Ivy, Yule log, etc. all date back to pre Christian times I think. In Sweden they still call it Jul (Yule).

It's noticeable that in Mediterranean countries, where presumably they didn't have so much need of a big feast and knees-up to cheer up the bleak Midwinter, Christmas is not nearly such a big thing as it is in colder Northern Europe.

As for Nativity plays, etc., from all I hear, a good many schools still do these.

Speaking as a non-christian ..
I wish you all a very Happy Hanukkah .. and when I light the 1st of my 8 menorah candles on the 24th and say the lighting prayers , i will wish you all Health and Happiness for the coming year and a blessing on all your family's for a safe future.

Shalom Gillyanne!

All christians do not celebrate...eg Jehovah Witnesses.

Thank you Gillyanne from a Christian who has a Muslim DDiL and GDs.

DGC are performing in a nativity play at church this year, but in previous years they have performed in them at their state school, which also had a carol concert. I went to a carol concert last Saturday, in a deconsecrated church, now used as a stained glass centre. The place was full. I have had a card from my parish church informing me of service times at Christmas.

DD is a television subtitle. Recorded programmes can be subtitled in advance, but news, Christmas services and a range of other services need to be subtitled as they happen so they are another group who work over Christmas. Fortunately she is always willing to work Christmas Eve until required, usually midnight or slightly later. Her car sits ready and the moment her shift is over, she drives over to us arriving about 1.30am. She will also work New Years Eve and New Years day and a s a result she has managed, so far to always get Christmas Day, but there is no guarantee whether this will continue.

I can still remember my little speech when I was in a Nativity play aged 5.
" May we peep and see Jesus asleep"?
Happy Days

I wrote an erudite post yesterday about early Christians hi-jacking the winter solstice and how, as a 'newly aware' teenager, I couldn't make the dates add up between Advent at the beginning of December and Jesus' birth on the 25th, then the arrival of the 3 wise men 2 weeks later. My computer crashed as I pressed 'Send', unable to cope with my further wisdom about how the Bible was based on hearsay then used verbatim by the rich to dominate the poor

A lady got on the same busy bus as me today and and was talking to anyone who would listen about how Christmas in the cold and dark was all wrong. Jesus was born in September she asserted, and the Christians had stolen Hannukah from the Jewish people to confuse and convert them to Christianity.

An earlier post (maybe on another thread?) echoed my feelings of envy of those who have unquestionable trust in the actions of their God, of whichever religion. However, I cannot accept an all-seeing, all-powerful entity who causes to happen such atrocities in the world. God of love? Not in my eyes.

As Witzend says, there has been a mid-winter festival for such a long time before Christianity, and so many of the Christmas traditions come from then too- both the date and traditions were adopted by Christians to make it more 'acceptable' to non-Christians. Most Christians know now that it is more than higly unlikely Jesus was born on 25th December!

and the Wise Men may not have visited for about two years after the birth

But, unlike Easter, it is not a moveable feast

Shalom... Lewlew and BBbevan
Enjoy you festivities

I don't recognise anything from OP. Shops have nativity scenes in the window, if they want them- a couple have lovely knitted ones. All the children that I know have been in a traditional nativity. I am going to community carol singing in a town square tomorrow night. We have a huge Christmas tree in the market square.
I went to London a couple of weeks ago and walked miles especially to see all the Christmas sights.
Christmas is only commercial if you let it be.