Worrying situation

greenockgran the news report said 1 in 3 Germans would avoid crowed places at the moment, but the square in the centre of Cologne is as busy as usual. A woman was interviewed said as long as you could defend yourself, you'd be OK. Not sure what that means tbh.

Not thick or pissed. Just giving my opinion.

Very emotive subject. I heard some high up German police chappy saying that the latest thinking is that criminals known to the police are finding likely recruits among some of the young males refugees.

There were other long term immigrants being interviewed who expressed disgust at the behaviour of the gangs and worry that they'd all be tarred with the same brush.

Suppose the simplest solution is to react hard and fast and sent out a message that this will not be tolerated. And that applies to the gang masters too.

Yup. These young men need to be set to hard work to occupy their time and tire them out. Alongside that there should be compulsory attendance at social integration classes. If they don't like it then they should be assisted to return from whence they came. Just leaving them sitting around in ghettos without the normalising humanising function of their families around them is asking for trouble. Which some poor women certainly got last week.

Iam64 I simply don't understand why you think I have linked the two when I started my post with "Talking about what happens here as the post has widened to include that". It is clear that I was not linking them!

I think the fact the German government is looking at how they can change their law to make it easier/quicker to make 'expulsions' from their country is showing the major concern German people and it's government are aware of the problems they are facing.

I know this may be a very naive comment on my part but I haven't been to Germany for decades. I was just watching Russia Today (who have been reporting on this for days!) and their report was mentioning how the sale of personal safety goods , such as pepper spray had gone through the roof since the New Year. Whilst that is a fairly obvious occurence I was surprised to see the reporter simply saunter into a large 'gun shop' to purchase the pepper spray and ask the assistant if there had been an increase in sales. It just seems so weird for us in the UK to see guns on display at all. Obviously I knew that America has numerous gun shops but my naivity about the rest of Europe is obviously acute.

Am I being unreasonable having watched one little report , is there such an open , easily availability to purchase guns in Germany I would appreciate any feed back.

Greenockgran. Your reference to 'our protection' were you referring to the fact that in time these huge numbers of young men will be given their residence papers and will be free to travel to the UK.
WE all know that we won't be leaving the EU so this is a strong possibility

POGS Germany has some of the strictest gun-control laws in Europe, but reports are saying the demand for non-lethal self-defence weapons (including pepper sprays) has shot through the roof. Germans are also applying for gun licenses in record numbers, but self defence is not amongst the criteria for owning a gun and it can take about a year to go through the strict process.

Here in the UK though, it's illegal to carry anything for use as a weapon, including pepper spray and it's a serious offence if you are caught. The sprays approved for use are the kind that spray a dye that won't come off.

Jane10 these young men would willingly work given the chance. There is no work for them to do. All work these days especially in Germany is at least semi skilled and there are enough to do these jobs. The men have to keep their places clean and carry out waste and recycling waste etc but the day is long.
What they see on TV - the private broadcasters - is not likely to show them the good well behaved Germans but is full of brutal police stories and jungle camps etc etc where women are treated like dirt and seem to enjoy it and dress to fit the role they play in these awful TV shows. Pornography is available 24/7
Only yesterday I saw in the local paper a report of a Freundschaft Tag
(friendship day) there on the front a girl dressed in Brasilian Carneval fashion with everything hanging out or scantily covered. That is the reality these young men see day after day. I am not condoning their actions. it was wrong but trying to explain how it may have come about.

I can quite see the problem Margaret. The German govt is going to have to come up with some big projects to gainfully occupy them. New motorways? Re landscaping previously industrial areas? Just meaningful things to do for the benefit of local people.

It did cross my mind it will be difficult to deport asylum seekers or refugees because of the dangers they would face in their own country.

But if they use that as an excuse for breaking the law and making cowardly attacks on women . . . .

If a country finds that it has been nurturing vipers in its bosom, they are under no obligation to be self-sacrificing enough to keep them there.

Work of some kind would certainly help to keep these young men occupied part of the time, but the real problem is the gender imbalance in the migrants. I understand tht 70% are single men without their families.

Part of the answer will be to only take in as many young unattached men as women and give priority to family groups. This will cause some problems but will solve others. Many men will choose to come in as a part of a family group, others will need to stay in refugee camps close to their home country.

One cause for concern already is that when the Syrian situation is resolved and the many Syrian refugees in camps along the countries borders return home they will have the reverse of the problems European countries are now, by having too few young men. The rebuilding of the country after the war will require the young and fit and those with professional qualifications, the ones most likely to make it to Europe. The refugees going back will be disproportionately, the old, the very young and women.

I think it would be against the UN Human Rights Convention and all that could be done at the moment would be to put them in prison or something. They could be sentenced to be deported and it could happen later when it's safe in their own country. Merkel probably dare not mention this.

Angela Merkel is getting the law changed so that the offenders can be sent back. I doubt if anyone will care whether they have a pleasant homecoming or not. Why should they? You break the rules, you pay for it.

I don't see how she can get the law changed to make it legal to send asylum seekers back to their land or origin if they're likely to be persecuted or worse.

land of origin

There needs to be cultural education about the way relationships between men snd women work in a western cultural society. If you come from a society where women are expected to completely cover their body, act in a modest way, and have little or no personal contact with men outside of their family, then the way we behave in a social context must throw into confusion the men from such societies.

I think it probably goes somewhat further than that - remember the girls used by men from a similar tradition in Sunderland? and Oxford?

Look at the problems we have had getting shut of people who have caused us problems. The chap with one eye and a hook. And it's genetic. His son is a problem too.

ask the Guardian

So I assume that if Merkel changes the law, we can do the same? Then our home office will be in a quandary, won't they? They'll have to think up some more reasons why we can't kick the scum out.

Human rights? What about our rights? Are women's rights somehow less important than these mens'.

I see the Germans have turned water cannons on people protesting against these crimes. Shame they didn't use them on New Year's Eve!!!

Indeed, but then they'd probably have been accused of all sorts of non-PC-ness.

Merkel can't change the law just like that. We're probably talking Geneva Convention type stuff.

And Jane10 that's the problem. In Germany it looks to many women like immigrant rights are being given priority over women's rights.