Effective strategies, please

Wow janerowena - that's impressive.

I asked mine what jobs they were prepared to do. I said I needed help. They had never thought of it that way, that I was the one who needed a bit of help. I made a list of everything that drove me mad and asked them to choose something from it, and made them promise to keep it up. I told them that if they didn't help me and I had to do those things, then I wouldn't have time to do other things that they really needed and wanted me to do.

So on the second day of DS returning from Uni after having been on various trips and stuff, there was still over a month to fill up so I sat him down and we worked out a new rota. His sister used to take over the ironing - sadly he hates it. But when he's at home, he vacuums his room, gets in all the logs, clears the table after meals, empties the bins and sorts the recycling, prunes all the plants I can't reach and cooks once a week. His choice. He has always cleared the table, vacuumed his room, picked the fruit and emptied the dishwasher since he was 12 - and changed his own bed. I think the choice part is important. His sister chose to do the ironing, Hang out and put away all the washing, (DS does it sometimes) change the beds, cook twice a week and stack the dishwasher.

Been thinking about this. It's a simple task you're asking to be completed, but take seriously the reason why that's so. A chat about respect is a good (and non-shaming) way of dealing with it.

I read something the other day that came to mind when mulling this over. Not altogether sure whether it's relevant or not, but found it an interesting statement.

"Maintaining simplicity requires a robust approach" .

I assume you do quite a lot of things for her - perhaps she would notice if you weren't so accommodating re her expectations. How would she feel if you, for instance, forgot to stock up on her favourite cereals/snacks/drinks, etc.; left the bathroom in a mess - wet towels on the floor and no clean ones to be found, maybe something soaking in the sink, no toilet paper in the holder; didn't get round to doing her washing, etc.?

But perhaps I'm being childish and the short, calm talk that you have said you're going to have with her is the best route. Who knows with teenagers!

I'm glad you mentioned repsect, ga. That's really what it's all about as far as I'm concerned. Her not clearing up after repeated requests (over several years; I've been patient enough!) shows disrespect towards me. I don't like it. I will tell her this today.

crumbsaway.co.uk/

What about a passive aggressive stance? Make her a place mat carefully appliquéd with clear up in bold lettering. Lay the table for her brekkie and if she doesn't look after it can you do a reproachful face.. Don't let them grind you down. We had battery driven animal crumb sweeper uppers but two DGCs are French and the breakfast table was always a bomb site. Les cochons ont mangés was the cry.

ambiguous post above: I mean I dumped the stuff which she had left lying all around the house into her bedroom!

Leave the mess and the dirty bowl and serve her dinner in it.

I used to dump everything of DD2's left lying around in her bedroom. When it got to the stage of nearly breaking your ankle when you went in there I would yell and shout at her tell her firmly to clear it up. We would re-discover a load of mugs we thought had gone missing and she would re-discover a whole new wardrobe of clothes.

Mishap that's exactly what I used to do with my daughter - clear up and put the stuff in or on her bed. She would leave things for me to clear up out of carelessness rather than deliberately, but when I got fed up of reminding her to clear up after herself I told her that I would do it for her, but the consequence was that the mess would be put in her bed. After the first time (and the ensuing explosion from her, which I still remember to this day) she would slip up occasionally, but very quickly came to realise that in the public areas of the house she had to be respectful and clear up after herself or face a bedtime clear up.
My children's bedrooms were their responsibility to clean or not from the age of 14, but every three months or so they were required to have a thorough clean. All of my children now have immaculate homes - including the youngest who is at university.

sherish

It probably isn't even about the breakfast mess, but a mum/teenager power game. I would make observations that I expect she'll be leaving the usual mess and imply she's a typical, predictable teenager. That'll confuse her into tidying the table up!

Or put the dirty bowl etc in her schoolbag! Failing that put her up for adoption.

Transfer the empty dirty bowl to her pillow and leave it there for her for when she returns from school. Then the same again next day ad infinitum. Nothing said, but I am sure hint will be taken.

I have some sympathy with her as she is probably thinking about her homework, whether she's got her PE kit or whether she will get to sit next to that handsome sixth former on the bus!

Or a discussion of dutles and responsibilities that she can contribute to and sign up to - I'm sure you've tried that.

Being a teenager can be grim - I am sure the breakfast bowl is bottom of the list of her priorities.

I'm not sure about allowing them to be as slobbish as they like in their own rooms.
The room may be theirs, but it's still part of your house.
Children aren't born understanding that if they leave bits of food under their beds, eventually things will grow on them and there will be an unpleasant smell, and the food might even attract vermin.
Similarly they don't automatically know that life is easier, simpler and altogether less stressful, if you don't have to spend hours looking for things because there is 'a place for everything, and everything in its place'.

It was always an uphill struggle for me to be self-disciplined enough to follow my own advice, but I came to realise that an untidy house actually makes me feel quite stressed and not at ease with myself, mainly because I eventually got a cleaner and it felt so wonderful when she'd been, that I was motivated to maintain those standards.

So I don't really agree with leaving the mess for minibags to come home to, as that will reinforce the idea that actually it's normal and ok.

You don't say what you do at breakfast time bags. I always used to set the table the night before, mainly to save time in the mornings, but it sort of set the scene for an orderly day too.

In your position, I would sit with her, make sure she uses a plate (there'll be fewer crumbs that way). You say she would do it if you ask her - so ask her. Teenagers do need reminding on about things (training!) and eventually it will become a habit. What you need to avoid is normalising the bad habit!

Ho, Ho, Ho, Jingle.

Bags I think this is one battle you are going to lose in the short term. If it is any help - when my 5 and 7 year olds want to make their own lunch I supply them with a tray to work and eat from. This contains any mess and when they are happy to take the tray outside to shake out the crumbs for the birds. However they are biddable CHILDREN -trying to civilise a teenager is like trying to organise a cat.

then threaten her with one of these

Buy her this and tell her to use it.

shysal and printmiss, she can be (and is) as slobbish as she likes in her own room and when she has a home of her own. Shared spaces are another matter.

No, when. During the summer hols I got her to do various household chores (no more than one a day) such as vacuuming, cleaning the bath, helping in the garden. She did these willingly and well and I was impressed. I told her that. I let up during school terms for obvious reasons but I regard this task as part of learning how to be a helpful and considerate human being, and part of a family team. It's not a big deal in itself but her refusal to do it (or to remember to do it) feels like disrespectfulness to me.

jings' point that it is part of the washing up is a valid one. If she or anyone else would therefore like to suggest other ways I can try to teach my daughter to be a helpful and considerate person at home, then I'm all ears and very happy to try alternatives. I was taught that helping to clear up after a meal was just part of polite family life, and something you offer to do at other people's houses too if invited for a meal, whether one does the rest of the clearing and washing up or not.

Like you Shy, my daughter is just as bad as she always was, my strategy worked sometimes, but not others, so I did find that really it was easier to go with whatever flow happened at the time. She used to get into the bed the same way it was when she got out, BUT she was always very clean and tidy in herself, and well-presented, kind and good mannered. Still the same, and still my daughter. Fortunately she has a husband who only works three days a week from home, and is quite the house-husband which he enjoys. Just as well.

I suppose its a positive that she eats breakfast at all my DD used to have a Mars bar and a diet coke!! I'm a bad mother I'd usually gone to work by then.

Depends on what else she doesn't bother doing. I managed to persuade my four to wash and iron their own clothes when they reached 13 - I laundered their bedding. The irritation of finding clothes they'd only worn for an hour then thrown in the washing basket vanished and they started hanging some clothes up (never jeans). Are there other tasks minibags does regularly that could offset your irritation about breakfast things, bags?

I used to employ Primtmiss's tactics with lazy teenagers and husband, as well as leaving old newspapers and empty envelopes on the floor to be tripped over. They never noticed!
When DDs left clothes and possessions all over the floor, I used to confiscate them and charge 5p per item to get them back. It worked as long as I could be bothered to enforce it. DD2 (44) is still the same, yesterday's dinner dishes etc always on table and worktops. I don't usually have to see the mess, so it is up to her, although I can't resist tacking the washing up if babysitting.
Good luck Bags

I like mice's last suggestion too but I'm not a good enough actor. Will keep it in mind though...

I've tried the "letting her get on with it" with the occasional gentle reminder for months and months.

No, we don't eat breakfast together. DH goes out without breakfast (he's an adult; his choice). DD wants breakfast and gets her own. She can't be arsed getting a plate out so her bread and spread leaves crumbs on the table. It has an oilcloth so no big deal to sweep or wipe up crumbs and any stickiness.

Yes, I know she's a lazy teenager! I just don't think lazy teenagers should be allowed to be slobbish in areas they share with other people. It's selfish. It's my job to teach her not to be selfish.
To be fair, if I was there in the room and asked her to do it each day, she would, but I don't feel I should have to do that over and over again. It would take her half a minute. She is not rushed—gets up at half past six, leaves the house back of eight.