Single mother by choice - is it ethical?

If there are other supportive and consistent males (or females) around then that mitigates the problem of 'singleness'. It's those without good support networks who have the problem.

There will always be some, I think, whether the society is of humans or of some other social animal. An advanced society will try to minimise the number of 'losers'.

Thus the cultural rules or 'norms'. But these will keep changing, developing, evolving, like everything else.

JessM I totally agree with your post of yesterday. I just cannot imagine having grown up without my father- and I know our girls would say the same. Sometimes, through tragedy, it is unavoidable- but to deliberately set out to bring up a child wihout a dad seems selfish in the extreme to me- even with a solid extended family. Adults can make choices- but should not impose them on their children in that way.

There are some communities, in this country, where there almost a culture of missing fathers. Boys growing up without a good, male old model, in an environment where that is almost the norm. Despite strong matriarchs, these young boys so often turn to gang culture to provide something they see as mssing from their lives.

Male role model..

Not saying copulation is not normal - but we are now able to de-couple it from the consequence of pregnancy. Animal "cultural" patterns - the ones I can think of involve food and getting food.
I have met women who are very alone and elected to have a child without any family support. I also know of one woman in her 40s, without much of a career herself, who had IVF twins. I think the assumption was that her parents who had been retired many years would support her. This has been the case while the girls have been under school age. But with her parents both now in poor health I don't know how she will manage the coming years.

Some of us can decouple copulation from the consequence of pregnancy. I know you're talking about our (British) society, but there are millions of people who can't do that uncoupling yet. In those (human) cultures I don't suppose there is much opportunity for women to choose to be a single mother. It is probably frowned upon, as it used to be here, sometimes with very nasty consequences.

I don't know anyone who has chosen to be a single mother though I do know several people who became single mothers for various reasons. I don't think it is all that common, is it?

Perhaps it is selfish but so are a lot of other things people do. It's not a choice I would make (at least I don't think I would have done; too late now) but I don't feel like condemning others for it. We cannot know what has made them make that choice. In some cases, if we did understand the whys and wherefores, we might feel quite sympathetic.

Other apes, elephants, whales and cetaceans have more cultural mores than are just to do with food, I think. There could well be other species too – wolves and wild dogs, lions..... The food ones are important, as they are for humans, but they are not all there is.

It doesn't need to be, and should n't be labelled 'ethical' or 'non-ethical'. It's an individual and private choice. Focussing on labels here is archaic. And small minded.

I don't think I would have started such a such a judgemental thread.

Oh right jings LOL

<Bernard Woolley moment> Can it actually be judgemental to ask a question?

Perhaps if you suggest that it may be unethical, you introduce an element of judging. But maybe I am overthinking it. Quite possibly.

Who is Bernard Woolley?

Don't you remember 'Yes Minister' and 'Yes Prime Minister', jingl?

I know three women who chose to have children without a long term partner. One women chose to get pregnant by a casual lover/good friend and the guy is involved both financially and caring, he is known to the child as Dad but does not live with the mother. She works f/t and her mum helps with childcare, her brother and other male friends are about. Her child is lovely and well-balanced!

Another woman had an arrangement with a chap to father her kids but no involvement . She had 2 kids by him. She was a fairly reclusive woman and they were a tight knit trio... I think both kids ended u with lots of problems.

Another woman deliberately became pregnant through casual sex. She works and her child was with a childminder. She has a wide socail circle and loyal and good friends. The child is a happy and apparently well balanced young person.

I do not think it is about ethics per se but about how well thought through it all is... not just the finance but the emotional support for mother and child. Some kids will be 100% fine and others won't but that's the same for kids born to couples too!

Is it better or worse that a couple in their 50s+ have a child via IVF?

I grew up with a distant stepdad who was not unkind but distant and unemotional. The effect of this was brought home to me when a close friend remarked that I was only attracted to father figures. When I thought about my past marriage and subsequent relationships she is probably right. My brother's children are disappointed that while he undoubtedly loves them he finds it difficult to show emotion or hug them. I guess this is because he had no father figure role model so the effects of single parenthood can be far reaching. We also came from an era when being a b*****d was something to be ashamed of!

The posts on this thread show just how complicated human relationships are, and how varied and complicated people and people's motives are, and how varied the 'results' of all kinds of child rearing. The non-constants of personality and environment (all the environments we live in, including each of our 'personal' environments) are also complicated and produce a huge variety of results.

For me, all this says just shrug and get on with life and stop trying to invent or imagine an ideal that will work for everyone. Variety. Spice....

LIFE is complicated.

Being a bastard is nothing to be ashamed of now, thank goodness. A child does not get to choose its parents.

Interesting thread. Also interesting 're stigma - although being a bastard is nothing to be ashamed of now - do you think that the child still feels "different" and perhaps ashamed? How do children feel about being in a minority group?

I grew up in a loving single parent family. But because my mother was "the only divorcee in the village" I dreaded the day each year at school where all the children had to give both their parents' initials and address in class, because I knew I would have to explain. I'd often be in tears by the time my turn came. Of course things have probably changed now, that was 1950s South Africa.

My sister on the other hand didn't mind. People are different, I was a sensitive child

Are they in a minority group any longer?

Surely the word "bastard" can now be considered extinct. Except as a useful swearword to be applied to some men.

Agreed, jings.

I grew up in the 50s with my mother who was unmarried. I don't think that it was untll my late teens that I understood the implications of this. I now realize what a brave thing this was for her to do and also my grandparents who stood by her. My Mother never discussed any of this with me and to this day i know very little about my Father.

When I was pregnant with my first child and was asked about family illnesses I confidently answered that there were none. It was much later that I realized that I did not really know.

Things are so different today and mostly for the better although I sometimes wonder if they have gone too far the other way.

My DD1 (8) would love her parents to marry. Not sure if she sees it as more secure or she just wants a party!