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Three Girls

(38 Posts)
suzied Thu 18-May-17 04:31:11

Anyone watching this? It's about the child grooming gang in Rochdale. Makes for uncomfortable viewing in many respects, but I think the 3 girls are well portrayed. Last one tonight( 3 part series)

Grannyknot Sun 21-May-17 09:55:52

I've finished watching this series. Harrowing indeed. I'm finding it difficult to get my head around Amber. Holly spoke out. Amber didn't, she became a ringleader and involved other girls, including her young sister. She didn't protect Ruby, you'd think she would have kept her out of it. I understand that she thought Tariq was her boyfriend, and that she was a victim too and had been groomed into that role, but still. I'd genuinely appreciate it if those who understands better than me could explain her behaviour.

The other thought I had was that the police in a sense then also subsequently "groomed" Amber to build trust, albeit for a different reason.

It is horrifying that it is still going on. What a God awful mess.

durhamjen Mon 22-May-17 21:34:03

www.change.org/p/3-girls-sexual-health-worker-sara-rowbotham-to-be-recognised-for-her-services

Iam64 Tue 23-May-17 09:32:55

There is an interview on line, between a reporter from the Manchester Evening News Maggie Oliver, the detective portrayed in the drama. I was impressed by her, she described the efforts she made to get CSE properly investigated and perpetrators charged with rape, rather than "sexual activity with a child". She says she believed in the system but now feels she was naive. She followed all the correct procedures because she fully understood them. The suggestion from the chair of Rochdale's safeguarding board was that Sara R and her team hadn't followed 'correct procedure' to escalate their concerns. It's dreadful to see good workers like Maggie and Sara forced to leave the work they love and are so good at because they challenge the status quo. The accusation of being emotionally involved is such an easy one to make and such a derogatory way to speak of professionals who have learned the hard way to manage their own emotions at work.

Granny knot - children who have been as neglected and exploited as Ruby and Amber often behave inconsistently. Amber did speak out, she detailed her experiences to Maggie Oliver but because she was critical of Holly in that first video interview, it was decided not to use the interview as evidence against the abusers. There were 9 barristers involved, all attempting to discredit the child witnesses. We say what happened with Ruby, she agreed when leading questions like "he was your boyfriend, you said you had nice sex with him" were put to her. She had learning difficulties, the barrister no doubt had a first from Oxbridge.
Amber also had learning difficulties and that made it easier for the abusers to manipulate and abuse her. These groups of abusers usually understand the criminal justice system and their own "rights" only too well. They would have known that the girls, especially Amber, would be viewed as unreliable witnesses and done all they could to muddy the waters to their own ends.

Grannyknot Tue 23-May-17 10:10:35

Thank you iam. I didn't realise that Amber had learning difficulties too, she came across as quite sharp in the film. I guess I'm a bit naive.

Thank you for the explanation.

trisher Tue 23-May-17 10:16:54

I think Amber was probably more typical than Holly of the girls who were involved. Holly was obviously exceptionally bright (she managed to keep up her school work and passed her exams in spite of the lifestyle she led). Amber was more emotional and the cross examination by all the barristers involved would probably have made her very angry and upset. I was amazed at how well Holly coped. It is dreadful that not only are these girls abused by the men involved but the criminal justice system then subjects them to such rigorous questioning. I thought the portrayal of how the questioning brought back Holly's experiences and disturbed her even more was brilliant. Unfortunately there are probably many other instances where there isn't a Holly involved and more girls like Amber. Girls who can be bullied and manipulated to involve other girls the men want.

Jane10 Tue 23-May-17 13:03:14

I wonder how they are these days. How can people recover from this start to ? Those poor girls.

Azie09 Tue 23-May-17 14:21:10

A couple of years ago I was on a jury which heard a case where a young man was charged with grooming and rape. He was a young man from a rich and notable family, she a young woman in foster care who hung out with other youngsters in care outside of the flats where the young man lived. He naively I think let the kids in for drinks and to play on his computer and she in particular began to spend more and more time in his flat and inevitably in his bed. She was obviously immature and vulnerable and inarticulate when giving evidence.

The family engaged a hot shot London lawyer for the defence, the judge slapped him down at every chance. What shocked me especially was the jury room - 8 men, 4 women, immediately the men began to say she was asking for it and two of the women agreed. Myself and another woman tried to argue but we were ridiculed and one of the men had looked at the girl's Facebook page and so knew 'she was fine now'! We gave in, the judge looked annoyed at our 20 minute deliberation and not guilty verdict and the man walked out scot free.

The attitude of many men towards girls needs thinking about and the way our legal system favours those with money and an education. I always wonder how men can use women in this way, especially if they are very young and possibly crying, it's beyond perverted.

MiceElf Tue 23-May-17 15:21:01

If a member of the jury looked at a witness's FB page that would make the entire trial invalid and there should have been a retrial.
What a pity you didn't know this and report him to the judge.

Iam64 Tue 23-May-17 19:43:45

That is correct MiceElf, what a pity no one from the jury reported that to the Judge.
Someone close to me had the misfortune of being called to jury service on two rape trials. One failed because of a "technicality". The other seems to have been similar to the experience Azie09 had. No one looked at a Facebook page but the rape was perpetrated by an ex boyfriend. The jury foreman took a bigoted misogynist approach to the evidence, the women on the jury followed his lead. The verdict was 10 = 2 with my friend and a female jury member amongst the two who believed the allegations made.
Granny knot, I'm sorry if my post seemed preachy. I spent almost 40 years working in this kind of area and have more experience than I'd have expected, or wanted, or vulnerable children being further hurt by judicial processes (or lack of prosecution)

Grannyknot Tue 23-May-17 20:36:05

iam no need to apologise (but thank you) - your post did not seem preachy to me.

petra Tue 23-May-17 22:51:41

Did anyone see Sarah ( the sexual health worker) on First Dates, she was really lovely. Unfortunately her and her date didn't have a 'spark'. What a shame.

Jane10 Wed 24-May-17 07:59:16

What a shame she was reduced to having to be on shows like that rather than her real job!