Another traveller illegal traveller site, poor neighbours.

There is a site up by our local cemetery. Wall up & gates. I think they are more like statics.
You know what they are because of the horses heads stuck to on top of the wall.
My mum’s friend lives at the top of the street, she said they very respectful towards her when passing.

I know it’s a shame for these people, any one of us could find our circumstances changing, & end up in one.
I remember the crash in the 80s which started in America. Families having to live in tents.

Yes I hope it all stays quiet for your family.

Peacelilydilly

One rule for them another rule for the rest of us. Human rights again

<www.travellerstimes.org.uk/features/build-first-ask-later-what-englands-new-planning-rules-really-mean-gypsies-and-travellers>

quote

“Everyone should play by the same rules” is often heard in this debate. Fine — but equality before the planning system cannot mean only enforcing rules against Gypsies and Travellers.

If families are expected to use authorised sites, councils must genuinely plan for authorised sites. If Travellers are expected to respect the development plan, the development plan must include them."

Cossy

Having said that, anyone renting should treat their properties with respect.

Yes. Most don’t though.
My mum when first married said the woman next door wouldn’t put a brush to the floor as it was rented.
Did they call it a let back in the 60s

If the one of the travellers owns the land it's very hard to move them, they move in over a holiday weekend when the council is closed with diggers, lay the tarmac and erect gates. It's all orchestrated

Next week they put in a retrospective planning application, and fight it all the way legally, the chances are they will win because the council hasnt got anywhere else to put them.

After a few years of being bad neighbours the actual owner applies for planning permission for development, all the locals back the application and he makes millions. Then the travellers move to the next unfortunate locality.

Sarnia

Casdon

Sarnia

Smileless2012

It would take days to lay tarmac, even longer if the area was the size of a field .

They are shrewd. The larger fields are often tarmacked over a Bank Holiday weekend when offices are shut for 3-4 days.

They have recently taken over several sports sites in Wales, but they don’t tarmac, they go in at night, and park their vans on the carpark, which is already tarmac or gravel, using the pitches as overflow for the dogs, washing, etc. I’m surprised to hear they have actually put tarmac down elsewhere, because of the cost when they know they will be moved on.

Where I live it takes forever and a day to move them on. My county has no travellers sites so they use that to their advantage saying they have to provide for themselves as they cannot move on for various reasons.
Like many other things it is the minority who cause the problems then tar the others with the same brush. Some fields have been trashed and strewn with rubbish while some they have been on you wouldn't know they had been there.

There is something in what you say about the permanent sites I think, certainly since we’ve had one, which poses no issues locally, we have had much less of a problem with other travellers occupying lay-bys etc. it’s a settled camp for one group only, so other travellers can’t pitch up there, but the group that are there have historic links to the area, which maybe means that others have less of a claim to come here, so they don’t bother.

I’ve heard these landlords get offered large sums of money to turn these rented houses into HMOs. Also that they get new appliances as well.
I don’t know how true that is.
If it is, maybe that’s why you see a lot of old appliances dumped on the back street.
If they are getting permission to turn into these into an HMO, maybe the council needs to go up & down in their cleansing trucks and pick up this crap that’s being left lying outside.
Not only that, I would have thought it is a danger to young kids playing out.

My dear friend, 80s, now terminally ill has 4 HMOs on her street, either side of her. Rest are normal rented properties.
Her gated back street was always well looked after. Plants pots & wall grown flowers, a View right over the town & countryside, stunning.

Blokes next door constantly smoking weed- I kid you not permeates through her walls.
HMOs next door but one, burn stuff in a large oil drum, yanking away in their native tongue into the early hours.
Council don’t want know.
She said she would be tempted to commit suicide if she wasn’t on her way out, as she said she just feels trapped.
I could cry for her.
Every little street around her way is like that.
I can see a huge change in as little as 18 months.

MT62

I think the people living in the HMOS are just as bad with the amount of crap they leave on the back & side streets.
They all want leaflets on how to dispose, recycle their rubbish.
Could add to that list how to hang a pair of curtains.

If you move into an HMO chances are the previous occupants have left stuff there.
More than likely your landlord won’t help to dispose of this unwanted property. That would cost him 🤬
Chances are you have no transport to take said stuff to the tip.
Now the offending curtains.
More than likely if you end up in a HMO you’ve never been shown how to hang them.
Opposite me there are 2 teachers. Obviously nobody has shown them how to hang curtains or clear the crap from the front garden.

Casdon

Sarnia

Smileless2012

It would take days to lay tarmac, even longer if the area was the size of a field .

They are shrewd. The larger fields are often tarmacked over a Bank Holiday weekend when offices are shut for 3-4 days.

They have recently taken over several sports sites in Wales, but they don’t tarmac, they go in at night, and park their vans on the carpark, which is already tarmac or gravel, using the pitches as overflow for the dogs, washing, etc. I’m surprised to hear they have actually put tarmac down elsewhere, because of the cost when they know they will be moved on.

Where I live it takes forever and a day to move them on. My county has no travellers sites so they use that to their advantage saying they have to provide for themselves as they cannot move on for various reasons.
Like many other things it is the minority who cause the problems then tar the others with the same brush. Some fields have been trashed and strewn with rubbish while some they have been on you wouldn't know they had been there.

sundowngirl

Getting a tenant evicted takes so long and if they are not paying rent during that time, extremely costly. Some landlords are finding it cheaper to pay thousands to the tenant to leave.
The pendulum has swung too far the other way

That needs to be dealt with. Maybe an independent tribunal could be set up so that if a landlord wants to evict someone a neutral body can adjudicate? They should have powers to get compensation from rogue tenants if they damage property, and also to protect them from rogue landlords.

I don't know if that would work, but equally, I still can't see how the government has made it impossible for landlords to refurbish or sell their properties.

Getting a tenant evicted takes so long and if they are not paying rent during that time, extremely costly. Some landlords are finding it cheaper to pay thousands to the tenant to leave.
The pendulum has swung too far the other way

Was all for more rights for tenants because of rogue landlords, but not all landlords are the same and am afraid some tenants do treat their living space with scant regard for where they plonk their old mattresses and fridge freezers etc., goodness only knows how the interiors of their living space looks like.
Then I presume the landlord has to completely refurbish the place or sell it. But the government has made it harder for them to do this now.
How has the government made it harder for landlords to refurbish or sell?

I agree that tenants should treat the property with respect, but they can still be evicted if they don't.

Sarnia

Smileless2012

It would take days to lay tarmac, even longer if the area was the size of a field .

They are shrewd. The larger fields are often tarmacked over a Bank Holiday weekend when offices are shut for 3-4 days.

They have recently taken over several sports sites in Wales, but they don’t tarmac, they go in at night, and park their vans on the carpark, which is already tarmac or gravel, using the pitches as overflow for the dogs, washing, etc. I’m surprised to hear they have actually put tarmac down elsewhere, because of the cost when they know they will be moved on.

Having said that, anyone renting should treat their properties with respect.

MT62

I think the people living in the HMOS are just as bad with the amount of crap they leave on the back & side streets.
They all want leaflets on how to dispose, recycle their rubbish.
Could add to that list how to hang a pair of curtains.

Some people in some HMO’s.

We have a fair amount of HMOs partially I think due to being a big seaside town and there’s been “bedsits”, as we used to call them, for decades and decades.

My DD and DiL’s very recently purchased home, is a nice semi, with the half attached to them being an HMO.

Driveway pretty clear, front of the house needs painting, curtains not very thick, but no rubbish and little noise and no one out the front gathering.

Let’s hope this stays this way.

Many people now living in HMOs simply cannot afford the ridiculous private rents the South East now commands and are working.

MT62

I think the people living in the HMOS are just as bad with the amount of crap they leave on the back & side streets.
They all want leaflets on how to dispose, recycle their rubbish.
Could add to that list how to hang a pair of curtains.

I do agree with that.
Was all for more rights for tenants because of rogue landlords, but not all landlords are the same and am afraid some tenants do treat their living space with scant regard for where they plonk their old mattresses and fridge freezers etc., goodness only knows how the interiors of their living space looks like.
Then I presume the landlord has to completely refurbish the place or sell it. But the government has made it harder for them to do this now.

Going off at a tangent here as I am prone to doing but can I just say my partner has new neighbours ( semi detached house so there is an adjoining wall). Both retired doctors. And they are a complete nightmare. Ever since they moved in we’ve said we’d be better off with neighbours that seemed a bit rough round the edges. I do understand peoples concerns about traveller sites though; I know the crime rate goes up in my area when there are travellers around. One of my dearest friends is a traveller. There are good and bad in all parts of society.

I think the people living in the HMOS are just as bad with the amount of crap they leave on the back & side streets.
They all want leaflets on how to dispose, recycle their rubbish.
Could add to that list how to hang a pair of curtains.

There are law breakers in every walk of life, but travellers cannot cite their lifestyle as good enough reason to break the law. As with those who build extensions etc., without planning permission, the council will in flagrant cases demolish the building, in which case the council should be able to go in and demolish the hard standing the caravans are on and with the help of the police evict the travellers.
It is not fair if the majority of us have to obey the law and pay our dues that some - not all - travellers just do as they please.
Some caravans shipped up on a piece of spare land near us that once housed a supermarket, in London that is prime real estate, so the police soon showed up and evicted them but they left a horrible mess behind that didn’t get cleaned up for ages because it was private land.

Smileless2012

It would take days to lay tarmac, even longer if the area was the size of a field .

They are shrewd. The larger fields are often tarmacked over a Bank Holiday weekend when offices are shut for 3-4 days.

We have a common near us. One neighbour decided to remove all the surrounding bushes. He’s even put new grass down & signs up deterring dog walkers of not leaving their dog muck.
There is now nothing to stop travellers settling on this common.
I am surprised the council allowed it.
TBF, he’s done a cracking job.

Yes of course there are respectful law abiding travellers but I don’t adhere to the romantic notion of them travelling around the country shearing sheep, picking apples and sharpening knives.

They have had to adapt as “the old ways” have disappeared.

My SIL was threatened by one, she told him “ we have different rules to you and ways of dealing with people like you”.
She was employed by typical council as a Romany advisor and educator, her specialism was conflict resolution.

A good friend opened a business, travellers appeared on his land and car park then demanded £20,000 to leave.

I personally believe that they have got away with too much for too long and it needs to stop.

greyfur16

It doesn't seem much of a life in the 21st Century.

They have a great life. All the latest mod cons.

Luckygirl3 Thanks for your balanced post, this has been my experience too. Like all communities there's good and bad. I was chair of governors of our local school which generally has one or two traveller children in class. They have never, to my knowledge been a problem and the local site is also not a problem. A friend has a property which is adjacent to another local site. She has expensive dressage horses and the travellers have coloured horses and ponies on their land. There is mutual co-operation and respect of boundaries. Last year there was a big traveller gathering over a weekend on the site, my friend was told in advance and reassured there would be no trouble and no mess left. It was noisy but once they had gone, life was absolutely normal again. Of course not all travellers behave well and we have had recent hare coursing activity on land adjacent to mine. It's not only illegal it is, in my view, extremely cruel. We keep out field gates locked and neighbours always warn us if there are travellers on the move in the vicinity as I would not welcome an illegal site.