Preparation for war

I cant see Russia being a huge threat in the likes of WW111, personally.

Russia is already a huge threat, but wars like WW2, are like wwars with bows and arrows they are out of date ineffectul and belong in the past.

Do not underrate the war we are already fighting. Putin is an old ill man and he wants to go down in history as being as great at Peter the Great. Time is running out for him and he is getting desperate.

I cant see Russia being a huge threat in the likes of WW111, personally.

I can see things like, cables being cut, weather happenings, some bombs here and there[not meaning at all necessarily Russia], intellegence going wrong[MI5 and MI6 doing good work so far], more IT disruptions, for whatever reason. etc.

China. Hmm.

I hope not, for the sakes of our sons and grandsons. Escalating the war would help nobody.

Also, we have to bear in mind that Russia is no closer to ending the war in Ukraine than we are, four years in.

MaizieD

David49

friendlygingercat

I blame various UK governments for dragging us into this position by supporting Ukraine. We should have kept out of it and not become involved with a third world country on the fringes of Europe with whom we have nothing culturally in common.

One day someone will calculate how much the Ukraine war has cost Europe, cost to the UK alone will be frightening

Are you looking forward to the rise of Russia as a great power, then, David? Or do you just always see things in terms of ‘monetary cost?

What would have been the consequences of letting Russia overrun Ukraine?

I don't see Russia rising as a great power, but Putin would like to regain Ukraine and probably the Baltic states, he has just "re elected" himself so will be emboldened to continue. We are no closer to ending the Ukraine war than 4 yrs ago, our response has been very poor, the US has been very lukewarm warm, drip feeding weapons to them instead of backing them fully.

Now that we have Trump confirmed as a fool by attacking Iran and expending most of US reserves I do not see hostility in Europe getting less. Do I see the UK willing to fight alongside Ukraine or the Baltic states - NO, are we willing to suffer in the way that Ukraine is.?

Are we?

Shinamae

IF anything catastrophic should happen I should be taking myself away to a green and pleasant land……..😇

Where’s that? I want to come too 😊

What would have been the consequences of letting Russia overrun Ukraine?

In the last week we have heard of Russian 'accidental' incursions into Poland and measures to build up forces in Russian regions around the borders of the Baltic states, total population of the three countries, less than 6 million. If Russia chosed to invade them they could walk in and reach the coast in an hour or so. Ukraine's population is around 38 million.

Friendlygingercat I suggest you go and revise your history of the lead up to WW2 and our decision to essentially give czechoslovakia away as no one had heard of it.

Then I suggest you reread . 'I did not speak out' by Pastor Martin Niemoller (look him up)

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

David49

friendlygingercat

I blame various UK governments for dragging us into this position by supporting Ukraine. We should have kept out of it and not become involved with a third world country on the fringes of Europe with whom we have nothing culturally in common.

One day someone will calculate how much the Ukraine war has cost Europe, cost to the UK alone will be frightening

Are you looking forward to the rise of Russia as a great power, then, David? Or do you just always see things in terms of ‘monetary cost?

What would have been the consequences of letting Russia overrun Ukraine?

friendlygingercat

I blame various UK governments for dragging us into this position by supporting Ukraine. We should have kept out of it and not become involved with a third world country on the fringes of Europe with whom we have nothing culturally in common.

One day someone will calculate how much the Ukraine war has cost Europe, cost to the UK alone will be frightening

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Thank you petra for the BBC Sounds link to the podcast ‘Radical’ interviewing prepped Mike Chappell (who apparently lives here in urban Manchester in a 3 bed townhouse with his family).

Interesting listen to be honest.

I liked near the end when he said “we are all peppers to some extent”. He asked the interviewee “do you have a box of plasters at home?”
“Yes”
“Yet you’re not bleeding right now are you? And that box would cover quite a few bleeds”.

“That’s all prepping is. Get tins of food tgat you could eat from cold - corned beef, Spam, potatoes, macaroni cheese - stuff you would actually eat in your own pantry - and just increase your stocks a bit to cover 14 days. I don’t live in a mansion. I don’t have an underground bunker. We’re talking about an un under the stairs cupboard with a few shelves. If I can do it, anyone can”.

It was a very thought provoking programme (40 minutes).
Thank you petra for the link.

I am permanently prepped. My cupboards are filled to the brim with tins, lentils, wet wipes, loo rolls since Covid.
All need now is extra pad locks on my doors so no buggers can break in & steal it.

M0nica

It isn't a question of preparing for war, we are already at war. Not a traditional guns and bombing war but a shadow war, fought through computers, through disinformation, through recruiting useful idiots (disaffected young men on their computers obsessed with violence,) to commit crimes that will, they hope, cause civil unrest, industrial sabotage (cutting undersea pipelines and cables), sending out drones to to buzz air bases and navy ships at sea.

Putin knows that if he commits any act of violence against a NATO nation, he will be precipitated into a war he can only lose, so he is running a shadow war, working to precipitate civil violence whether through agent provocateurs, encouraging lone wolf acts of violence, or infiltrating groups, like those new well organised balaclava wearing mobs we have seen recently or, if he could do it, taking out major industries or sections of the economy by infiltrating their computers and putting in 'kill' software.

I know this sounds like the stuff conspiracy theories are made of but DD works in one of the key industries that Putin or any other hacker would love to crash because of the damage it would do to the economy and the inconvenience, to put to mildly, it would cause millions of people.

In her opinion, what he would like to do, is something like disrupt the electricity in a region, say East Anglia, when I say disrupt, I mean totally stop all power supply in the chosen region so completely that water supply would be compromised(pumps not working), mobile phones would cease operating as the masts would have no electricity. Obviously within a few days everything would gradually get back to normal, but just think of the chaos, and the anger that it had happened.

We have seen in the last 2 weeks the chaos that can be caused by a minor glitch in air traffic control, no, not the Russians - this time, but imagine a major computer failure and the system is down for days. Or the banking industry have their core systems crashed?

Those leaflets about preparing for extreme weather conditions are actually asking us to be prepared for what may happen to us during this shadow war. Major shutdowns and disruption to that invisible network of computers systems that now run our lives. None will last more than a few days, although some problems may be longer lasting.

I am now thinking more seriously about prepping, at least buying another torch and more batteries.

Another torch & batteries, that is serious prepping 😂 Monica

friendlygingercat

I blame various UK governments for dragging us into this position by supporting Ukraine. We should have kept out of it and not become involved with a third world country on the fringes of Europe with whom we have nothing culturally in common.

Oh dear Friendlygingercat It appears you don’t understand what the definition is of a third world country
This video will explain it to you.

youtu.be/s_JNPkmsTOk?is=J0A8iJRiGO6hTNrS

That would not stop the effects of El Niño, the threat from Iran or fuel shortages due to the war in the Middle East though. Russia is not the only threat, it is a just one threat.

I blame various UK governments for dragging us into this position by supporting Ukraine. We should have kept out of it and not become involved with a third world country on the fringes of Europe with whom we have nothing culturally in common.

But we are only being asked to make contingencies for two or three days, not for prolonged periods. There would be lots of issues, not just drugs, but all basic supplies if it went on for longer than that.

EkwaNimitee

No one has mentioned prescribed medicines? If there’s protracted chaos many of us are going to be very ill or dead. No chance of stocking those up.

Good point!

That's one way of reducing the population.

No one has mentioned prescribed medicines? If there’s protracted chaos many of us are going to be very ill or dead. No chance of stocking those up.

Mike Chapell looked well prepped to last a while to me.

Very articulate but talking nonsense.

The bottles have a use by date stamped on them dalrymple, but it’s not always easy to spot it. I think it lasts about three years usually, although I rotate mine, so the new ones go in the garage.

IF anything catastrophic should happen I should be taking myself away to a green and pleasant land……..😇

NATO now seems to be fairly inept and spineless. I have been adding to my Armageddon cupboard on a monthly basis over the past year and, despite the fair amount of derision from gnetters last year, I bought my generator, which will keep freezers, a fridge and the ability to recharge mobiles and laptops going! Have torches,camping lamps, basic first aid kit, two months of dog food and the ubiquitous loo paper.

Does anyone know how long bottled water lasts? Would like to know.

David49

Whitewavemark2

TBH david to my surprise I think we are largely in agreement over this.

I have been listening to Carlo Rovelli and how Kennedy managed the Cuban crises ( my opinion of the Kennedy’s has risen 100%). I can’t see a single politician in the world super powers with perhaps the exception of China having the intellectual capacity that Khrushchev and the Kennedy’s showed during the Cuban crises.

Kennedy and Khrushchev

We were always fed the story that Kennedy made the Russians back down - propaganda

What really happened was, at the height of the tension Kennedy phoned Khrushchev personally and they agreed that if US removed missiles from Turkey, Russia would remove theirs from Cuba.

Although current leaderships are at a low when mutual destruction was at stake sense prevailed and the warmongers on both sides were overruled.

Yes, and the two things that absolutely stood out for me was that the kKennedy brothers were being advised very strongly by the military and politicians to use military power. They went against this advice entirely alone and Khrushchev, to help them save face in withdrawing from Turkey went along with the story that he had backed down in Cuba. The truth only came out years after. I always thought that Khrushchev had backed down.

You could say that the three of them Saved the world. I am in awe of their statesmanship.

Thank you petra for the BBC Sounds link to the podcast ‘Radical’ interviewing prepped Mike Chappell (who apparently lives here in urban Manchester in a 3 bed townhouse with his family).

Interesting listen to be honest.

I liked near the end when he said “we are all peppers to some extent”. He asked the interviewee “do you have a box of plasters at home?”
“Yes”
“Yet you’re not bleeding right now are you? And that box would cover quite a few bleeds”.

“That’s all prepping is. Get tins of food tgat you could eat from cold - corned beef, Spam, potatoes, macaroni cheese - stuff you would actually eat in your own pantry - and just increase your stocks a bit to cover 14 days. I don’t live in a mansion. I don’t have an underground bunker. We’re talking about an un under the stairs cupboard with a few shelves. If I can do it, anyone can”.

It was a very thought provoking programme (40 minutes).
Thank you petra for the link.

Whitewavemark2

TBH david to my surprise I think we are largely in agreement over this.

I have been listening to Carlo Rovelli and how Kennedy managed the Cuban crises ( my opinion of the Kennedy’s has risen 100%). I can’t see a single politician in the world super powers with perhaps the exception of China having the intellectual capacity that Khrushchev and the Kennedy’s showed during the Cuban crises.

Kennedy and Khrushchev

We were always fed the story that Kennedy made the Russians back down - propaganda

What really happened was, at the height of the tension Kennedy phoned Khrushchev personally and they agreed that if US removed missiles from Turkey, Russia would remove theirs from Cuba.

Although current leaderships are at a low when mutual destruction was at stake sense prevailed and the warmongers on both sides were overruled.

Oldnproud
I can’t speak for lentils but you’re not wrong about wet wipes. I’ve done the trip on the French canals and rivers from Calais to Sete 4 times.
The canal authorities often turn the taps off when there’s a water shortage. After being caught out once you make sure you have a good supply for washing and washing up.

Governments in the Uk made us so weak, it is shocking.

No wonder the leaders of our armed forces were tearing their hair out so to speak.