Henry Nowak…….an absolute tragedy.

I was in a NHS hospital yesterday and the signage was completely wrong. An orthopaedic patient ended up walking much longer than necessary. The point is that when public services, including the police have severe shortcomings made public, it’s difficult not to engage. It’s almost self preservation.

I have to agree.
Without open discussion, people would just accept that version of events wifhout question.

What none of us knows is what the situation was like when the police first arrived

Do you not research before saying things which are untrue, twaddle?

There is a clip, longer than 2 minutes which shows the police as they arrive and get out of their vehicle.

The 2 brothers are stood up as the police arrive and the father is bent down 'explaining' that he's trying to get Henry to sit up. He also mentioned blood coming out of his mouth. They lied about how he had fallen when he was trying to escape over the wall.

People are not speculating. They are commenting on what they've seen on police camera footage.

So just do a bit more research rather than criticise others

I havent seen anyone express hatred for the police.
Not on here.

Sago

Tuliptree

ronib

The evidence if you want to call it that is that Henry Nowak took just over one hour to die from stab wounds. I don’t know how a pathologist would know for sure that with medical intervention, his life may have been saved or not.

Read the judges sentencing remarks. Some injuries are just not survivable even if you don’t die immediately . And experienced medics know this. I really don’t understand why based on zilch evidence anyone wants to believe he would have survived. It’s a pity ( in lots of ways) that the inquest is so far away.

It does not matter if he would have survived his injuries or not.

The Police did not act in such a way to give the best chance of survival.

This in itself is a crime.

Quite! What people are failing to grasp is that the police have a duty of care. It doesn't matter if Henry had been racist or not, nor whether his injuries were survivable or what etnic group any of them belonged to.

What none of us knows is what the situation was like when the police first arrived. My understanding is that there were only two minutes from the time of the arrival until it was realised that Henry was seriously injured. I don't think all of the two minutes has been captured on video (could be wrong).

With hindsight, it should have been realised that Henry was injured and an ambulance should have been called. I expect the inquiry will go over and over those two minutes to understand what happened. Did the officers follow the correct procedure? If not, why not?

What I do know is that speculation by thousands of online "observers" isn't going to bring Henry back or bring any comfort to the Norwak family. Hatred of the police as an organisation isn't helpful either.

Well HQ was quick - I wanted it deleted because it was a real nuisance just stuck there

It's not offensive, Tuliptree
We've all done similar, I'm sure.

Goodness sorry about that post - I don’t know what went wrong - I’ll see if HQ will delete of

I have tears in my eyes.
My boy is 18.
Thinks he's all grown up, but he's just a child in so many ways.

I feel traumatised by certain elements of that footage.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MissAdventure

I think the father made pretty clear in his speech thay he is aware of failures to do right by his son.
He did it with a grace i could never manage in his circumstances.

Indeed he did and it's a crying shame that his plea could not be respected.

Thanks Sago I am trying not to cry at this point.

Exactly!

Tuliptree

ronib

The evidence if you want to call it that is that Henry Nowak took just over one hour to die from stab wounds. I don’t know how a pathologist would know for sure that with medical intervention, his life may have been saved or not.

Read the judges sentencing remarks. Some injuries are just not survivable even if you don’t die immediately . And experienced medics know this. I really don’t understand why based on zilch evidence anyone wants to believe he would have survived. It’s a pity ( in lots of ways) that the inquest is so far away.

It does not matter if he would have survived his injuries or not.

The Police did not act in such a way to give the best chance of survival.

This in itself is a crime.

I don’t think Henry (using his NAMEis important to me) would have survived his injuries.

What would tear me asunder if I were his mother would be thinking of my scared and UNBELIEVED boy dying alone and panicking.

The man who murdered him (over 25y) was a snake. A low bellied slitherer of a human who was cocky enough to play the race card and assume he’d be believed (which he bluddy well was in the short term). Absolutely despicable low life.

The whole family are like it from reports from the area. Both brothers were known as violent. A report today showing the brother holding a sword while confronting somebody outside a Hindu temple. Awful evil family.

Yes that is true the call handler asked if there were any weapons and he chose to lie knowing he had just stabbed a man in the chest and he must have been badly injured. He is indeed a wicked evil man.

I'm sure the fact (note: fact) that the muderer stated, when asked, that there were no weapon at the scene as far as he knew also didn't help matters.
Wicked, wicked man.

ronib

The evidence if you want to call it that is that Henry Nowak took just over one hour to die from stab wounds. I don’t know how a pathologist would know for sure that with medical intervention, his life may have been saved or not.

Read the judges sentencing remarks. Some injuries are just not survivable even if you don’t die immediately . And experienced medics know this. I really don’t understand why based on zilch evidence anyone wants to believe he would have survived. It’s a pity ( in lots of ways) that the inquest is so far away.

The evidence if you want to call it that is that Henry Nowak took just over one hour to die from stab wounds. I don’t know how a pathologist would know for sure that with medical intervention, his life may have been saved or not.

I think the father made pretty clear in his speech thay he is aware of failures to do right by his son.
He did it with a grace i could never manage in his circumstances.

AGAA4

I think it would be better for the family to know that the wound was imminently fatal and nothing could have saved him than to think negligence caused his death. What they had to see was bad enough.

Yes I’ve thought the same -as I’m sure most posters would. Sadly on social media, some people want to stir up the opposite view without a shred of evidence.

I think it would be better for the family to know that the wound was imminently fatal and nothing could have saved him than to think negligence caused his death. What they had to see was bad enough.

surfsup

foxie48

Surfsup Actually there's lots of evidence of racism in policing in the US. George Floyd was arrested and murdered by a white policeman who is serving 22 years for his murder. The fact he had a criminal record or had fentanyl in his system is completely immaterial, he was asphyxiated by a policeman sitting on his neck for 9 minutes whilst he struggled to breathe. To compare the death of Henry Nowak to the death of George Floyd is frankly ludicrous. Added to that there were at least 256 black men shot by police in the the US in 2020, black men are nearly three times more likely to be shot by the police than white men. The issue of police violence towards black men in the US is extremely well documented.

I’m not the one who brought George Floyd into the discussion and whether you agree or not his death was politicised.

It’s also well documented that far more white people were killed by police in the US.

As per usual on here anyone with a different viewpoint, however objective, is labelled, directly or inferred. There are lots of other facts well documented here and in the US - ie crime statistics but some prefer to turn a blind eye.

However, this thread is about Henry Nowak and his appalling treatment by the police. Some are seeking to excuse those officers for their dereliction of duty and lack of humanity and I will continue to challenge that viewpoint.

Please could you direct us to the posts on GN which are seeking to excuse the police officers "for (sic) their dereliction of duty and lack of humanity".

GrannyGravy13

That is how I feel FriedGreenTomatoes2 the thought that his last seconds of life were in handcuffs, with no friendly or reassuring words, must be too much for his grieving family…

I doubt suppose their grief is alleviated by the thugs making political capital out of it all, despite the father's specific request.