Calling all adult children

A definite win Beescrete .

Unfortunately with those who cannot see beyond their own needs and desires, even when the one whose there for them and helps them the most is ill, they can only see how this impacts on them.

Did you tell her that you'd felt like sh** and the reason you hadn't been round was because she hadn't had her flu vaccination and you were concerned about her catching it from you? I hope so because even though she maybe incapable to taking it on board, I'm sure you'd have felt better for saying so.

I had a friend many years ago who eventually kicked her eldest son out because his drug addiction meant he was stealing from her and his younger siblings, as well as frightening them with his outbursts of rage.

It was heartbreaking to witness her heart ache and the guilt she had for being unable to help him.

I meant to post this on my estrangement thread but I'll leave it because I don't think it's too of topic and deleting here is hard😂

An update on my no longer estranged but often regretting it situation:
Being sick was a huge challenge. While there is a caretaker who comes for 3-4 hours, 3 days a week to chat and help with cleaning tasks, my mom was frustrated by my lack of engagement. I was lacking in patience because I felt like sh**, and didn't want to go to her apartment to potentially give her the flu before she's had her shot. She had no concern for my health and discomfort and was just annoyed that I wasn't there for her. I was again asking myself why did I restart this relationship.

Today I'm feeling better and we watched two episodes of Love is Blind together in her apartment. I left on a high note before anything could turn sour. A win in my book!

Allsorts

Sometimes a loving parent has to estrange, in the case of financial and elderly abuse, gambling and addiction, mental health issues. What Diamond Lil described is a reason to estrange. No one should be abused. I haven't experienced it but I can see why some parents need to protect themselves. Sometimes only one is to blame, its ridiculous suggesting that
parents are responsible for life choices adult children make.
Do not judge a situation until you know the facts.

I work in the addiction treatment field, back of the house not client work, and I've met so many families that had no choice but to cut off their children. ACs stealing from their younger siblings to supply their habit is not uncommon. It is so painful to see these parents put in the position to cut off their loved child.

@purplepixie the abbreviations really confused me too. Most important EP- estranged parent AC EC estarnged child

Smileless
Thanks for you well wishes this is the first day I have woke up feeling normal. When I'm sick it's like a day or two. I was out of commission for over a week, so glad to be feeling better. I already made my mom's and my (even if it's too late) appointment for the flu shot

For clarity I think it creates a weird dynamic On This Forum, where many ACs and EPs have experienced very cruel treatment. The worst of those people aren't coming to forums for help, so instead they are interacting with reasonable and flawed humans.

@Madgrann77
"It is hard to see how eg. serious financial abuse resulting in an elderly parent estranging themselves from their financially abusive AC, as being shared "fault". Ofcourse one can say that their upbringing caused the ACs behaviour but that would be a very simplistic view of what shapes a person alongside their personality."

I totally agree with this and have made some less articulate posts trying to describe the same phenemon. Those who are willing to come ask for help and advice on a forum are unikely to be the worst of the worst abusers, but the people who were abused by the worst could totally be on here. I think this dynamic can create a weird distrust where one side thinks the other is always downplaying their part and not being honest.

Not everything is down to EPs and we've been saying so for years DL, it's a pity we have to keep repeating ourselves.

Smileless2012

The reason for them to lie about their observations User is because they were fed by VioletSky as part of her continued vendetta against some EP's here on GN, because she was banned for the second time.

The link you've provided is extremely offensive to some loyal and long time members of GN so I've asked GNHQ to remove it.

Such is her inability to move on, that she continues to return with different names.

I agree that that would be valuable sweetpotatopie but I think we can all see that that is never going to happen.

Yes Whiff Hithere's 'defence' is no surprise.

Well, whatever " User'whatever the number is this week" posted, I know how DH was.

He was a good Dad, but I'm not sure how anyone deals with addiction - it takes over. It's all about the next "fix" whatever that might be.

As for poor parenting maybe causing it, well ok, but can someone explain (by statistics) why more very young children have mental health problems now, than ever before?

Is that down to poor parenting by some of the young estranged or otherwise parent/adults that post, moaning about their parents? 🤷‍♀️

Or not?

To be clear, I worked in a child protection dept for many years. I know how awful some parents can be. I can still remember some abuse that continues to make me feel sick. 😡

And, I worked with other forms of abuse depts, and I know how abusive and awful some adult children can be. 😡

Estrangement happens for so many different reasons. 🤷‍♀️

Not everything is down to EPs. 🤷‍♀️

Was it our fault he married a duplicitous woman? of course not eddiecat. Thank goodness he's no longer with her; unfortunately for our ES and us, he still is.

We realised too late that his friends, some that he'd had from childhood were dropped in favour of hers, those being the only ones they socialised with. We were so close that it never occurred to us that we'd eventually be dropped too but of course it was our closeness that was the problem for her.

We do know that he told his brother he'd told her that he'd given up everything for her. So there's nothing you can do to prevent being estranged in these circumstances and as long as the influence remains, so will the estrangement and when this happens, the EP's are blameless.

It is as you say Allsorts ^ridiculous suggesting that parents are responsible for life choices adult children make^; ridiculous, tiresome and incorrect.

Yes, apologies, of course there are exceptions to every rule, I should have been clearer in that I meant in the case of an argument or a differing of views. Abuse or true narcissism is an entirely different matter and should never have to be tolerated.

We were estranged when my then daughter-in-law didn't want our DS to have any relationships she couldn't control (this included friendships). She controlled him by saying she would stop him seeing the children by telling the police he had hit her.
The estrangement ended when the marriage ended.
I don't agree that we were in any way to blame for what happened. Was it our fault he married a duplicitous woman?
(He is now with a wonderful woman)

What is this post about?
All these abbreviations get on my wick.

Sometimes a loving parent has to estrange, in the case of financial and elderly abuse, gambling and addiction, mental health issues. What Diamond Lil described is a reason to estrange. No one should be abused. I haven't experienced it but I can see why some parents need to protect themselves. Sometimes only one is to blame, its ridiculous suggesting that
parents are responsible for life choices adult children make.
Do not judge a situation until you know the facts.

stillawipp

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

I think it is possible for it all to originate from one side. One person makes choices that are truly damaging to the other person, maybe it's necessary to step back. In the case of AC, not even necessarily because of how they were raised. There are always multiple other influences on their lives while young.

On the whole though, I think there is often contribution from both sides. Not to say that the other side is unreasonable in the choices that cause the other side to react badly, but they've contributed to the situation, even if it is completely justified.

It's good to see your post Madgran as it comes from someone who isn't estranged, demonstrating that it isn't only those who are still estranged who realise that EP's don't always have to be at fault.

stillawipp

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

It is hard to see how eg. serious financial abuse resulting in an elderly parent estranging themselves from their financially abusive AC, as being shared "fault". Ofcourse one can say that their upbringing caused the ACs behaviour but that would be a very simplistic view of what shapes a person alongside their personality.

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

Hope you feel better soon Beescrete .

Madgran that wasn't meant for you but the person you were quoting

If you shared your insight and I missed it, I am going to check back in tomorrow. I'm still battling the flu and not 💯 myself yet

Gmax3

NoMoreNarcan --- "Most people, including myself, see parents that aren't in contact with their children as a huge, glaring, red flag...."

DiamondLily --- "Not always. My two stepsons estranged DH.... Despite agreeing my late DH had been a great Dad, one estranged because we wouldn’t fund his alcohol/gambling addictions. 🤷‍♀️
The other one estranged because he considered elderly parents become an increasing burden, and didn’t want to be there.🤷‍♀️
So, no rocks on heads, no evil parent, no spouse to blame, nothing to blame but addiction and selfishness."

I love this exchange so much that I wanted to capture it for posterity.

As for the original intent of OP, to try to be compassionate and support each other, whether we are EP, EAC, or neither of these, that seems only possible for a small subset of those who post here. This topic is a hot one, and it causes many to give knee-jerk reactions. For me, I ignore the "knee-jerks" (pun intended) and focus on the compassionate ones. That's a life lesson, btw, don't you think? (Rhetorical. No reply requested.)
Hugs to those who give & need compassion!

I am quoting this specifically because I missed diamond lily's post, I don't know if they were deleted or I just didn't see them amongst the other posts. I think you bring up a major cause of estrangement that isn't well represented in these threads, addiction. While we don't have the specific statistics for estrangement I would bet addiction is in the top 5, be it parental or child.

Same AC EC typo

Smileless2012

If it were to have a similar OP to this one, I don't think it would make any difference unfortunately Oreo.

I unfortunately have to agree. If you are an estranged AC who wants to reconcile this forum is better than the forums only for ECs. Those are good if you are sure you want to estrange and they will offer you important and helpful support. If you are like me and waffling between estrangement and reconciliation there is no place for you in EC forums.