Losing out when moving abroad.

Yes it's quite different moving to a European country than Australia or the Far East for example. We retired and moved to France for a complete change and a bit of an adventure. We love living here as others have said, so peaceful and reasonably easy to get to and fro to see family and friends in UK.
The down side now as we are older, we have friends here whose partners have died and it's difficult to manage alone. Of course this is the same wherever you live but somehow seems more isolating away from one's home country.

We left the UK to move to Australia to be with our daughter and family, and now have 2 granddaughters. I have posted on here before but can't find the thread. My son was also going to emigrate but changed his mind at the last minute after we had already moved to Perth. He is now living in Amsterdam. To our consternation my son in law was offered a job in Zambia for a few years and so we have ended up here on our own although I do have a brother and his family here but it's not the same. Here is not home and I miss the UK. My daughter and family do intend to come back to Australia in a few years, but we don't know where exactly, it will depend on work for my son in law of course. My fear is that the will move on elsewhere before then. I would be happy to stay here if they were here. We talk about going back to the UK, but then might regret it if they came back to Australia. The exchange rate would be in our favour at the moment after Brexit but I do fear that if it goes against us further down the line then we won't be able to afford to go back.
It's difficult to get to see them as they are in the middle of nowhere and it involves four flights, although we have booked a holiday to Amsterdam and the UK next year. But as everyone says the long flights and the expense are not so easy when you get older and it is also difficult to get insurance. We don't know what to do.

I moved to Germany over 40 years ago and brought up my children without any help from my parents. My in-laws were there for me, but they were very old.

For me, it was extremely important to give the children roots in the area we lived, whilst they learnt about the English language and culture that I was keen to pass on to them. I took a newsletter from a bilingual group and remember very clearly an article by a half-Greek, half-British lady who was struggling with her identity because of the dual upbringing she had had. It was my aim to prevent this happening.

Our sons therefore feel absolutely at home in our little part of Southern Germany, but are all proud of their bilingual upbringing and are carrying the idea on to the next generation.

As they all live a long way away, only now do I realise what a wrench it must have been for my parents, although they always encouraged adventurousness.

As regards the opening comments from Lillie, I don't think that there ever was a danger of <<they picture the people back home being as they were when they left them, but their lives move on too and things change.>>

Even back in the 70s and 80s, I managed to keep up with changes.

It's not a question of where you live, but your attitude, I think. There are people who still bemoan the changes such as the way people bring up their children nowadays and the intrusive technology, but the UK is definitely no longer the land of Midsomer Murders and cucumber sandwiches. Even from here, in the middle of the Continent, I can see that, but some people living in rural Britain just refuse to see it.

(PS this is not a rant about gransnetters who comment on modern life and constantly reminisce about the old days. Just by dint of the fact that we're on this site means that we are accepting new technologies and lifestyles!)

My DS moved to Australia from the UK over 20 years ago, and married an Australian girl. We used to visit for 3 weeks every couple of years (we were both working then)and from the very first time I visited Perth I loved it and was determined to retire here when the time came. Anyhow, I must have done a good job of selling Perth to my two DDs in the UK because 10 years ago they both emigrated here with their families too, and so now we are all here! We do go back to the UK occasionally to visit relatives, but always can't wait to get back to OZ.

I had the advantage of coming back to the Uk in 1989. DH had been transferred to the North West to oversee the teaching of German.His contract was for 5 years. As he was sent officially to the Uk we had help with the rent of our half furnished house in Stockport which was even then so expensive.

We had our house in Germany still, our daughters had not yet left home but were both students. I found the tooing anf froing stressful and wanted only one house which I could feel was home.
Of course we looked at the possibility of moveing to the Uk but then I fell ill with a stomach complaint and got to know the NHS. Altough I was losing weight I only got that white medicine from my GP.
I asked a doctor at Bridge Club if he knew a private consultant and he said I should wait until I was in Germany at Christmas- a few weeks off.
I did and after arriving in my home town I rang my GP and the next day had a gastroscopy and knew I did not have stomach cancer. All in 24 hours after arriving.
That clinched it for me and it was the best solution as DH would not have wanted to stay.

Witzend............my husband and I have just returned to UK, after living and working in Spain since 1988. We had a great life there but after we retired, my husband was at a loss as to what to do and became very frustrated and bored with life. He had health issues and eventually had a kidney transplant there. We decided to sell our house there as neither of us wanted to die there and come back but the recession hit and it took 4 years to sell and the value decreased by 50%, so were unable to buy property here. However, we now are in a council flat for over 60's in a lovely area and are quite happy. Don't miss Spain at all!

Funnily enough, I think all the grandparents saw more of our dds during the many years we lived in the Middle East, than they did of their UK grandchildren, since we would spend at least a month with them every summer - more like 2 for me and dds since summer weather out there was ghastly - and both sets came to visit us more than once during the winter, when the weather was lovely.

None of their UK grandchildren lived around the corner, so there were odd days here and there, but not the nice long visits we had.

Dds were always tremendously excited on arriving at Heathrow to see the grannies and grandpas waiting in the arrivals hall!

Yes, great expressions here in all languages regarding homeland, separation, love and distance. Thank you.

I was engaged to a French man in my university days while working there for a year, but ran home soon after! I often wonder how my life would have been different. I was then lucky enough to spend 5 years in my 40s working in France with my DH (British) and loved it, but was glad to return to the UK. Now, as we approach retirement the thought comes up again, but the GC issue is the greatest reason not to.

Back to expressions, and for those of you who enjoy languages, I'm always amused by ET saying in French "ET téléphone maison", when in English "home" conjures up far more than just the house. (In ET's case I think he means to phone his own planet!)

finnochio- love that last sentence. In many ways, the fact we live abroad is a real incentive to visit both ways. I'm sure we would see the GCs and DDs less if we lived just on the other side of the country.

The other GPs live in the UK- but for some reason just don't seem to have the 'urge' to visit them as often- as they don't really enjoy travelling I think.

Very true vickymeldrew - a short hop over the Channel if your family lives in the outh of England is no further than visiting them in a different part of the UK.
Visits to Australia, NZ, South America etc are fine until age or ill health creeps up on one, and DC who emigrated to far-flung places may not be able to have long enough off work or be able to fund annual trips back home, especially when the DGC arrive.

And, of course, what is abroad to one partner may well be home to the OH!

"Love, we find, travels very well. It pays no heed to frontiers."
Ffinn that is just a perfect way of expressing how we feel too. Thank you.
I also think that in this interconnected world nobody can think that they will have their family nearby for ever. You only have to read the anguished threads on Mumsnet where people want to move abroad and feel guilt about leaving their parents. It happens.

The Germans have a saying:

Die Fremde wird nicht Heimat aber die Heimat fremd
= The foreign can never be really home but home will become foreign.
This is exactly what happened to me.

DH now refuses to back to the UK. He has absolutely no interest in it now. DD2 feels sorry for people who have to live there! It now seems as if I won't go this year either because of my health

My true 'Heimat' is the English language which now comes in via satellite dish everyday and I read English all the time,
on Kindle or via amazon. If I order 'Britsh Foods' they are delivered in two days and M&S as well.
Modern technology has transformed living abroad.

Just moving over the Channel or the North Sea hardly seems like being abroad compared to America, S America or Australia and NZ. I'm relieved my daughters love Europe too much to think about leaving.

The gains outweigh some of the minor losses. Individual circumstances differ so widely, as this thread shows. Apart from one, all of my siblings have lived for most of their married lives in other countries, so being here is no different from that perspective, and the development of digital communication is a great boon.

If we could afford to move back to the UK, and that is a big if, I doubt very much we could then afford to visit our grandchildren (two in America), as often as we do now, which is not as often as I would like. Even here we save hard to make the trips happen. We visit the UK family as often as their and our circumstances permit.

Quite what will happen in the long term remains to be seen. We have a few general long-term plans, but that could change in a blink of an eye, so for now will continue to
enjoy our life here, within a good community and with strong friendships.

My husband was not born in the UK, and spent most of his schooling at an English boarding school - and has never felt more at home that he does here.

Our sons are independent and doing their own thing, as are we.

Love, we find, travels very well. It pays no heed to frontiers.

micmc47 you summed it up completely: it's just not 'home' Fortunately my OH knew the wrighting was on the wall when the first GC came along. We were also lucky in that local friends wanted our house.

The greatest difficulty about living abroad is being far from loved ones, particularly elderly parents.

Lived and worked abroad for many years when in the RAF, then on retirement tried the Algarve for 8 years. Nice while it lasted, but eventually became bored with it, and sold up and moved back to UK some 3 years ago. Definitely the right move for us, for many of our own reasons, but if the ex-pat life suits you, then good luck to you. In my case, moving back home has brought a sense of peace and familiarity I could not experience anywhere else... and watching the Grandchildren grow... well, I can't put a price on that...

Yes, I had a stubbornly entrenched partner TriciaF. I was always the one who initiated the annual/biannual trip back to the UK, with 'himself' chivving about getting back home to some peace and quiet! So, if I'm honest (in a daft way ) it's worked out for the best, as he would have been as miserable as sin if he'd been the one left on his own....not wanting to go back to the UK, but unable to cope with the language required for everyday existence. ... the endless bureaucracy, health issues etc.
In the time we've been here I've seen so many retired couples move 'back home' after 4 or 5 years, in particular when grandchildren arrive. And in my experience it is always the wife who wants to return (because of the new GCs).....the poor old DH just goes along with it. And financially it has cost them dearly. I've picked up almost new white goods at knock-down prices from returning expats. It's quite sad , but I guess the pull of grandchildren can be too much for some.
I'll miss the snow- capped mountains from November to March, the intense summer heat, the fetes and village lunches, but I'm sure I'll soon settle into a English village..... cricket, WI , Sunday pub lunch!!
I'm in Dept 31 btw TricisF

My case is somewhat different. My parents moved to Spain when I was six, and I have lived her all my life. I married into a Spanish family and all would have been well, had my ex (now deceased) husband had not been an alcoholic and caused all sorts of strife which led to divorce. I have two children by him. I then married an Englishman who had been here for a good many years and we have a child in common.
I have no ties to the UK, as my mother lives here and i have no living family in the UK. DH has all his family there but is not particularly close. As we are not well off, we try to get over once a year to see his parents and so that our daughter has a relationship with them.
Do we miss the UK? Not at all.
Several people have mentioned living abroad and thinking those in the UK have not changed, we have the reverse experience in that DH's family see him as a rebel teen even now. He will be 54 in a few days!
Would I live in the UK? Not likely. I enjoy our visits, but love my home. Spain is home to me.

We were very careful about location when we moved here- in the countryside/mountains- but with good road and bus/train services to both France and Switzerland- for shopping, culture (cinema, theatre, etc) - very aware that as we get older it will be more and more important. We could cope very well here without cars if we had to at some point-and could also easily get deliveries and help.

Having lived in the UK from age 19 to 60 - despite having many friends here, I feel a bit of a stranger here at times, funnily enough (not surprising as I lived all my adult life in UK).

willsmadnan - you must be quite near us (SW Gers.)
We've been here for 15 years but have kept a small place in England.When one of us dies the other will go back. Not easy to live here alone.
Two of our grown children live abroad (India,Kuwait)and the girls in England. I go back regularly but husband doesn't. Stubbornly entrenched, but that's his nature.
Our family has always been a bit dispersed, all very independent, but close when it's needed.

Having had 18 very happy years in France, 2 daughters weddings and subsequent GC all happening in the UK, now I find myself alone here in the foothills of the Pyrenees , but I am quite ambivalent about returning 'home'. We did it... we lived the dream, and now it's time to close the page and open a new one. It was quite indulgent of us to hike off in pursuit of 'the dream' and I'm so grateful our daughters never critised us for it, now I am quite looking forward to repaying their support by offering my support in whatever way I can for the few years that are left to us.
Like you mamie we had many good French friends which I will be leaving behind (and some fantastic young expat friends who have been towers of strength for the past 6 months)... but I guess home is where the heart is.

Vickymeldrew- I so agree. Living within 1 day's driving or train journey distance, or a short flight away is so different to living on other side of world. Not sure how I would cope with GCs living in NZ or OZ - I have to admit.

Am a strange hybrird- eg a double expat. Born and bred here in French speaking Switzerland- left at 19 for short stint in UK and stayed there all my adult life- married to a Brit, with British children and GCs, friends, studies, career- and never intented to come back.

Were looking for a small place to rent when we retired, and low and behold, fell in love with this old house in t'mountains- and were lucky enough to also keep a property in the East Mids. And yes, we truly feel we have 2 lives and 2 homes. When we go to UK we feel we are going home- and when we return, we are coming home ...
dual nationalities for both of us now (since the age of 21 for me), and both bilingual (well sort of for DH- he has done so well and was determined not to be one of those expats that just shouts louder ;) )...
But when we are unable to travel with ease back and forth- then I imagine we will sell up and go back to UK- and probably keep a smaller place here if we can- possibly rented.

See how it goes- nothing is written on stone, and we will take things year by year.

I have known of several older people who had to move back eventually for health/family reasons, or because one half of the couple has died and the other doesn't drive or speak the language, or just feels lonely and wants to be closer to family.
Sometimes there have been big problems because they can't then sell their house, or UK property prices in the area they want have moved way out of reach.

We lived overseas for Dh's work for many years, and I'd never want to move from the UK again, but if I ever did I'd be sure to keep some sort of bolthole here. An ex colleague who recently moved to a much cheaper area of rural France bought a flat near her own family here - in case. Very sensible IMO.

I married and moved here to Sweden 48 years ago, there are ups and downs, but I am fortunate to be able to get over to the UK three or four times a year, so I never loose touch.I try to keep up with things, I stream tv programmes, wonderful, as Swedish TV has much to be desired.I read local newspapers so that I am up to date when I go to the UK, at least I know what people are discussing that way.
People seem just the same when I meet them, of course I meet them so often, so not surprising really.People often ask me over here where I feel most at home, and my answer is I am at home wherever I am, in the UK home is there, and in Sweden, home is here.Of course Liverpool will always be home to me!
The difficult question to answer is when they ask me " do you dream in English or Swedish" now thats difficult to answer!Thats a good research project!

My son and family emigrated to Australia about 10 years ago and definitely think that everyone is as he left us. He can't seem to get his head around the fact that his fathers Dementia is worsening ,his uncle is unwell after having a stroke and I can't cater for 40 people who they would like to catch up with in one go. Oh dear how I wish we were all the same as we were 10 years ago!