Am I just being an old fashioned prude

Just remembered another story. This is for people who think young children are just sponges and don't think about what words mean. When DDs 1 & 2 were very young (DD1 might have been two but not much over that; she was sitting on the pram seat above DD2 who was a small baby lying in the pram), we set off out somewhere. A little way up the street where we lived I remembered something I'd forgotten. Given how much of a tizwaz (I couldn't leave DD1 in the pram seat while I went indoors, for a start; it wasn't safe to do that) would be to go back and get it, I said "Oh, hell!" and turned the pram round.

DD1 said: "What you said?" She knew it wasn't an expression she'd heard before and clearly wondered what it meant. I told her I'd forgotten something. I reckon she then understood that it was just an expletive used when one's annoyed at oneself, or something, even if she couldn't actually have verbalised that idea. I never heard her say it. Two year olds don't have that kind of adult frustration at themselves.

My grandkids have been known to hear the odd f--- from me. Hilarious giggling usually ensues. They would never swear, themselves. Well, not in my hearing. Who knows what goes on in the playground when mischievous small boys get together?

Rather than criticise, I would explain why I didn't like an expression.

Actually, young adolescents know perfectly well why people don't like certain words. That's why they use them. It's part of their perfectly healthy rebellion. Most of them grow out of it, especially if one doesn't make a fuss.

Only the "odd f---" jings? Surely you are being a little modest?

I have exactly the same problem. my new neighbours absolutely pepper their sentences with the F word - using it in front of and directed at their children. It is used so extensively that find it uncomfortable. It wouldn't be so bad if they didn't talk so loud !!! They are not particularly nice people but I find that I can't sit out in the garden when they are out because of the volume and content of their conversations. I'm not a prude and yes I do swear when I drop something but this is just unnecessary and vulgar in my opinion

I actually think the F word (and more) has become just a normal word to most people nowadays. I'm often shocked to hear it come out of the mouths of people I would never dream would even think it never mind say it out loud and in public!
I know all the words (used to be a nurse!) but the only one that even leaves my mouth is s**t and not in front of children of course.

Obviously kids will hear all the bad words too, but if they don't hear them at home they hopefully won't think it's ok to use them ... unless to test us all out of course!

It does seem to be the norm, sadly, these days. I'm not an old prude-far from it. And no, I don't think it harms those who may be in earshot, either.

BUT I still believe there's a time and a place for it. Just because it has become normalised (for some) doesn't make it right for others to have to listen to.

I was out with a person (woman) on Saturday night (a friend of a friend) who literally used the F-word for every other word. She was loud, too. It spoilt the evening.

To me, overusing the F- and other words gratuitously is lazy and, yes, rude. I think if your neighbours are genuinely nice people then you'll have no problem asking them to tone their language down when in the company of the littluns.

Is it the norm? It may be for some people but neither of my children swear nor the grandchildren. In fact DH takes the youngest to football occasionally and last week the language was particularly ripe. GS at 11 years old looked at grandad with wide eyes and pulled a face as if to say "Blimey!" But grinned too as he clearly thought it was naughty but fun.

Not normal for me either, but we have to remember that it is normal for some.
If they are useful neighbours to have then you have to just accept it really. When they get used to you ( and your speech patterns) they may not swear as much.You can always hope.

It has been really good to hear all your views.Food for thought. Thankyou.

I have had a friend for years and have never heard her swear but after several people remarked that she 'swears like a trooper' or has a 'foul tongue in her head', I asked her if that was true. She told me that she had a habit of speaking as she was spoken to and therefore as I didn't swear she didn't when with me, but if others peppered their conversation with sweary words she would do the same and more if talking to them. Since then I have noticed that her accent also changes radically, mirroring the accent of whoever she is conversing with.

Just an observation.......

My daughter and her new husband managed to buy their first home with blood, sweat and tears - and all their savings. They were so happy when they moved in, having worked hard to redecorate. They looked forward to spending time in the garden, also to entertain friends and family.

We all soon discovered that their neighbours curse and swear (sometimes in conversation) and sometimes as in "Why don't you just shut the f*ck up". Or, "Don't be a c*nt". It makes sitting in the garden really unpleasant, not least because it is distracting. So - is "conversational padding" normalising and therefore the thin end of the wedge?

Why should the people who dislike swearing, accept that people swear? Why can't it be the other way round and people who curse accept that some people don't, and desist. We just cannot enjoy sitting out with all that going on next door, even if we do tell ourselves its fine because it's just conversation and it isn't aggressive.

maryrose
If your grandson knows that these words are wrong he may well tell your neighbours: 'That is a very bad, rude word you know' when he gets a bit bigger.
They may have a think about their language!

Out of the mouths of babes .....

I do worry that this might happen to us Grannyknot, and however open minded I might try to be I dont think I could sit there and ignore it. Would mean going indoors.

mary I agree. Why would you sit out in a beautiful garden, if the air is turning blue around you ...

And as I said, apart from anything else, it's distracting to have to try and constantly "tune it out". In the case of our family, it is impossible to achieve that for all those in our group, anyway. For example, my SIL who is a quiet, softly spoken person, literally can't stand it.

I do not quite understand why it is "lazy", any more than any other expletive or for instance adjective used for emphasis.

I do think that children know the difference, as others have said, between a word used to offend or abuse another person, and usage when surprised. My DD said bugger today when she dropped something - her 7 year old was present and he smiled and shook his finger at her. They both laughed and she said "Naughty old Mummy."

I used to say my children were "bilingual", in that although they heard (and being realistic probably said too) all sorts of language in the south London playground they didn't use that language at home - I'm sure that was because we (mostly!) didn't talk to them like that at home. It's part of learning how to behave according to the environment they're in. Having said all that I'd prefer not to have to listen to lots of feffing and jeffing in my own back garden.

maryrose I wouldn't be exactly overjoyed if my neighbours were continually f'ing and blinding loudly within earshot of children. If you find it really upsetting, then perhaps the approach that NannyandGrampy suggests might be OK. Personally, I wouldn't risk annoying or embarrassing them because you say that they are otherwise very nice neighbours and I wouldn't want to risk spoiling a good relationship.

I think there are far worse things that people/neighbours can do than swear. It seems to me that sometimes the most outwardly respectable and cultured individuals are the most selfish and unprincipled people underneath.

I think it would be a different matter if they were swearing aggressively/threateningly at each other or at you and your family.

lucky to me it is "lazy" if every second adjective is effing this and effing that - in other words when a sentence is peppered with swearwords. My late FIL used to say "bloody" a lot: The bloody car got a bloody flat tyre and I bloody well had to take it to the bloody mechanic. Cost a bloody fortune. Lazy IMHO. And tiresome.

eloegran of course outwardly respectable people can be selfish and unprincipled. So I would avoid people like that, and I would also avoid unselfish and principled people who swear a lot.

grannyknot I know a person like that, except every other one of her words begins with "f".

I'm no prude, and swear quite ripely myself on occasion but .." I took my f..kng car the f..ing garage and, f..k, you know f..ing what? They couldn't f..ing do it, so, you knows what? I f..ing told them to f..k off, I did".

Tedious.

I think there are many people of the 'older ' generation who do not like to hear the continual use of the f word ,and certainly not the c word, whether it is used aggressively or as 'padding' . People with consideration for others will usually realise this and as granynqueenie said (and probably some others) will temper their language accordingly. It has become the norm with younger people I'm sure , but fortunately many of them have the good manners to avoid shouting it accross the garden. I sympathise with the Maryrose.

Yes, much as you would prefer neighbour's to tone it down, I suppose they could argue it's their garden. I wouldn't want to sour relations with good neighbour's.
Language is a living thing, changing all the time, imagine the words we use now which didn't even exist in our childhood. And if it didn't change we would all be sounding like Shakespeare or Chaucer.
I feel the f word is becoming so devalued it certainly doesn't shock youngsters at all. All my DGC tell me thy have heard the f word a lot at school and often from the teachers!!
I personally don't like it and wouldn't use it but try not to flinch when I hear it. I get fed up with some lovely progs/films RUINED for me by bad language eg Four weddings and a funeral; Bridget Jones. Such a pity.
I heard a lady pass a group of school boys feffing and blinding and she just said "boys! Language!"
My DH taught for many years in a secondary school and said it's a bit like children who are bi lingual, it's simply the language they use that presumably they hear at home-when not used in anger.

I never heard swear words from my mum but when I started school I came home from school (at the age of 5) saying "f off" and using the V sign. My mother was horrified and went to complain to the head who said he'd taught in some inner city schools and never heard the language he'd heard in our school! This was in the 60s and was on a new estate. Unfortunately that sort of language has always been around - people are just less bothered about using it these days. But it isn't generally used as a rude word now - just as part of normal language :-( I hate hearing young children/teenagers using it so often - especially the girls. Having said that when some people swear (like Billy Connolly) it just doesn't sound offensive.

If you asked anyone if they think f* is swearing, I'm pretty sure they would say it is, so the fact that it's used a lot more in everyday conversations doesn't automatically make it acceptable in all situations.

It's perfectly reasonable to ask someone who is swearing to watch their language for xyz reasons. There's a reason why most children don't swear in front of their parents or grandparents. There's a reason why most people don't swear all the time.

maryrose54 if I had this problem with my neighbours, I wouldn't say anything. As you're on good terms with them, they may pick up on the fact you don't swear and naturally temper their language, especially when they meet your grandson. Either way, I would be grateful for nice neighbours because bad neighbours would be a whole different story.

I agree about the previous comments about swear words. I also hate blaspheming.
I wouldn't say anything to the neighbours but hope they would be more sensitive in front of youngsters.