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Opinions please.

(32 Posts)
annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 09:14:56

I have read an article this morning about a 60 year old who is appealing to a higher court for permission to have her dead daughter's frozen embryos implanted in herself so that she can give birth to her own GC. She says it was her D's wish.
The article contains the phrase " just because we can, doesn't always mean we should " which is how I feel.
She has not been turned down on moral or ethical grounds but because there was no written request by the daughter.

Anya Fri 26-Feb-16 09:24:57

Poor woman.

Luckygirl Fri 26-Feb-16 09:59:54

She must be in some distress and turmoil to feel that this is an appropriate thing to do. I wonder what the history is behind the embryos being stored in the first place - presumably she had some illness that might decrease her fertility and wanted to use them herself. And where is the father of these embryos?

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 10:02:34

Rather perplexed by that Anya.
If you mean because she has lost her daughter I totally agree.
If you mean because she has been refused permission I don't agree.
If you mean poor deluded woman because she thinks it's a good idea then again I can totally agree.

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 10:04:36

The daughter died of cancer so I assume that she had embryos frozen before treatment so she could use them if treatment was successful.

Alea Fri 26-Feb-16 10:13:03

Absolutely with you both on the "Poor woman" comments, for all the reasons Annsixty says.
It does raise the question "Whose baby" which is also prevalent in the sort of posts on other threads in the past regarding "Grandparents' rights" .
You cannot replace a child or a relationship with a child, with a grandchild and as grandparents we need to bear that in mind as sometimes the boundaries become blurred.

Indinana Fri 26-Feb-16 10:33:00

That is so sad, on all counts. That she has lost her daughter, that she so desperately wants to carry out her daughter's wishes but is thwarted, that it looks likely she will effectively 'lose' her grandchild as well as her daughter.
To know there are embryos - embryos that have the potential to become your grandchild(ren) - but not be able to give them life, must be utterly heartbreaking. My heart goes out to her.

maturefloosy Fri 26-Feb-16 10:35:04

I understood that they are not yet embryos - - just her frozen eggs - so no father involved yet.

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 10:36:05

I have just read a second report that it is eggs the daughter had frozen and the woman's husband would be the father, and GF of course. Usual accurate press stories!!!

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 10:36:47

X posts.

Anya Fri 26-Feb-16 10:41:14

I meant 'poor woman' to find herself bereaved of her daughter and denied her child's child.

Whether the decision to deny the eggs to be used is the right or wrong one, I cannot decide. If she knew this was her daughter's wish then she feels she is letting her dead daughter down.

As I say I cannot reach an opinion on the rights or wrongs of this, it's just too complicated, but info feel for her.

Anya Fri 26-Feb-16 10:41:46

info I do

Indinana Fri 26-Feb-16 10:43:36

Well that puts a rather different slant on it if they are eggs rather than embryos. Not sure I'd find that acceptable, to be honest, for the child's father to be also its grandfather. Better for the child, surely, if another 'father' was found.
The child is the important person in this situation, not the grandmother. Easy to lose sight of that.

maturefloosy Fri 26-Feb-16 10:52:05

I agreeIndinana - the child would be 10 when her mother was 70 - not ideal for the child growing through her teens - for lots of reasons.

My sister lost both her daughters to cancer at varying ages - one of them had not had children - having her child would not have bought her daughter back - or replaced her - and the grief of losing her was enough to deal with at that time. I feel very sad for this lady.

maturefloosy Fri 26-Feb-16 10:53:13

Sorry ' its teens ' not 'her teens'.!

janeainsworth Fri 26-Feb-16 10:54:03

Surely there would be a genetic problem if the woman's husband is also her DDs father?
If his sperm was used to fertilise the egg, the resulting embryo would have DNA from his sperm and from the egg.

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 11:04:34

Now my question is , would any of you have considered doing it if it had arisen?

Indinana Fri 26-Feb-16 11:15:05

That's a difficult one, ann. Certainly not at the age of 60, but if it had arisen when I was, say, 50 then who knows?
The thing is, I cannot imagine the depth of grief at losing a daughter, and where it might lead me. I know several on here have been through this, so their opinions would perhaps be more valid than mine.

Indinana Fri 26-Feb-16 11:16:22

I would certainly not have allowed my husband, her father to be the child's father.

janeainsworth Fri 26-Feb-16 11:23:50

I wouldn't have wanted a baby, any baby, at 60, but as indi says, we are not in the position of the woman in the article.

Synonymous Fri 26-Feb-16 12:10:50

This seems to be a sad grieving mother riding her emotions and who is setting herself up for untold mental strain and health problems.
One has to ask where this could go or even stop. When a young woman sadly dies the eggs are there and perhaps could be harvested and a similar situation created. Would parents do that? I doubt it or that they would be allowed to do it. The young woman in this particular case was herself preparing for different eventualities in her own life and not her death since if that had been so she would have left written instructions. Technically the eggs which were harvested are just as much a part of the daughter's body as if they were not harvested.There is no entitlement here.
Any child born from these eggs would be damaged by all the history connected with it's birth. Given that the daughter died of breast cancer you can just see that the next step might be the possibility of screening the eggs or embryos for the genetic possibilities of a child having the same health problems and so then you subsequently raise other issues too. It just goes on and on - and Pandora's Box comes to mind!

When your daughter remains unmarried and goes past the age of conceiving a child there is a kind of mourning that goes on both in her life and the lives of her parents over the perceived loss of the next generation. We have to come to terms with these things which are all part of life. The scenario discussed is not very different albeit with the added sadness of the loss of the daughter herself.

Anya Fri 26-Feb-16 14:08:40

When you say the 'woman's husband' I'm assuming you mean the dead woman's husband surely. The man, who would gave fathered the baby had his wife not died.

annsixty Fri 26-Feb-16 14:21:36

At the time I posted I believed it was the girls father but having googled further in order to be as accurate as the press will let me I read they had hoped to use an anonymous donor. Also trying to be accurate someone up thread said the girl had BC. The reports I have read say it was bowel cancer.

Nelliemoser Fri 26-Feb-16 15:32:41

All I can say is NO. I can understand her distress but it seems to me totally wrong.
Those eggs are the daughters. They are not the grandmothers to use because she feels bereaved. We are not entitled to have grandchildren.

If there is no actual evidence that the daughter wanted mum to do this we are just going on one persons word.
The grandmother would have to choose the grandfather. IMO It's too full of potential difficulties with regard to family relationships etc.

I can sort of see a slippery slope here.

janeainsworth Fri 26-Feb-16 15:47:47

nellie this is the BBC report. www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-35651301
"The High Court was told the daughter was desperate to have children and had asked her mother to "carry my babies"."
That seems an unreasonable dying request to me, very sad though the situation is.
How can anyone put pressure on their own mother to undergo the trauma of IVF, with its attendant dangers of high levels of hormone supplementation, and be responsible for a child well into her 80's?
A child should be wanted for him or herself and not to satisfy someone else's rather vain wish, which is the impression that the report gives.