Being more German??

I've been thinking about the differences. I remember a TV Documentary about when BMW apprentices exchanged with Rover apprentices. Teamwork was impossible because the Rover trainees didn't understand or work from detailed plans. It is typical German to understand a flat plan on a piece of paper whether for a house or an IKEA wardrobe. The Rover workers talked it through to each other all the time and the Germans coudn't get on with that at all. They wanted to see a a plan and work from that.
Somehow just by living here I have learned to work from a plan and even draw them up myself! These are my own personal observations.

David Cameron is a fool if he thinks people can be more German still living in the UK. The media have spent -and are still spending too much time maligning modern Germany and the Germans that there can not be much acceptance to be more like them. The UK is divided into those who have visited Germany and generally like it and those who are faced daily with the SUN or the Mail version of Germany. They will stick to their patriotism and World War 2 celebrations and black and white films of 'our' boys.
Its another century now.

I'm a bit the same, Margaret; I love Yorkshire and England in general, but after 34 years here, I belong in Australia and appreciate what it has. In our case, it is a better political system, enough money for all, and an egalitarian attitude. Lots of things are wrong of course, and will get worse if the Tories are elected, but all in all it works. We got over the GFC unscathed during the Labour government, and have unemployment of only about 5.7%.

My knowledge of Germany is through my university lecturers, as it was in Austria where I learned the language and lived for a while.

The bit about getting no help with forms resonated. We were doing a seminar on driving and getting a license in Germany. I had a bit of a laugh about all the paperwork involved, including the certificate of residence you have to have (Einwohnermelde something), and I also passed comment that surely the clerk would help the applicant with the paperwork. He laughed and said I clearly did not understand Germany, where it is the applicants job to help the authority, not the other way round.

I would have fitted in in Germany as my parents brought me up to be self sufficient and not expect any help. But of course, that was 60 years ago!

I have dual nationality. British where I was born and German where I have lived with my family for over 40 years. In Germany you have to think for yourself, you are not mollycoddled. I worked for Stockport Education Authority for 5 years when we went back in 1991 and stayed for 5 years. I was surprised to see that the school secretary helped students apply for university. In the school my daughters attended there was only one woman and she didn't write anything for students. They had to do it for themselves.
We always noticed enormous overstaffing whether it was M&S Cafeteria or the cross channel ferries. Somehow Germany and other Northern Europeans manage with fewer people. Going to Denmark on the ferry you have to know when to disembark. There are almost no announcements. You see land approaching and go to your car.
Hard work and engineering are the mainstay of Germany and is tightly controlled by the unions and the guilds. From earliest schooling children are on the committees governing their own school. It is a very democratic, peaceful nation. It loves its traditions which are celebrated and enjoyed by the people who live there just like it drinks its own wine and makes its own beer.
As to being a Hausfrau well the younger generation is not better than most others today but the standard of public buildings and the seating provided is very high and somehow that rubs off.
I could not return now but still love England and often visit.

Where is the school maureenm48? Doing this for a half day every week sounds like a good compromise.

Loved the programme!
However was surprised that so many hadn't heard of FOREST SCHOOL in this country.Our local primary children often spend a half day out in the woods (whatever the weather).They just love it!

THAT WAS THE 'C'' WORD!

...and then when December comes, there's the lovely Christmas markets.

When I'm at my daughter's in South London I moan about all the rubbish in the streets but when I visit son in Munich it is so clean & perfect I want to muck it up & long for the reality & humanity of Tooting.
The other thing son finds hard is that he can only do DIY at the weekends but Sunday DIY & noise is banned & shops are closed from Sat lunch time. That means everyone rushes to the Germany equivalent of B&Q (Obi I think) on Sat morning & crowds it out, then the rush to complete the task on Saturday & if you find you need something else it has to wait until the next weekend.

We do love having a reason to visit Germany & explore beautiful places that we wouldn't otherwise have visited, though you can get fed up with yet another quaint Mediaeval town with wall to wall half-timbered houses.

My son's German neighbours have been lovely to them, especially when they've had problems - & they even gave their permission for son to cut tiles outside last Sunday.

The book 'Germania' by Simon Winder gives some interesting insights into Germany & the Germans.

I must watch that show - expecting a new 1/2 German
grandchild in Berlin in February !

I love Germany and the Germans. Being a Virgo I love order and cleanliness.
What was that woman on about when she said that she couldn't see where there was 4 hrs housework to do, she had two children there and no outside work to do.
Igot the measure of her when she said " I went to a down market supermarket, Lidl !!!

My uncle married a German lady. She seemed very exotic to us kids in the 50s. She wore high heels and make up which our mother never did. She called us darling and used to send my mum parcels of unusual sausages (!) from Germany on occasion. My mother had no idea what to do with them.
My uncle didn't meet her until he was well into his 40s and she was his first and only wife. I was rubbish at school but because she helped me with my German I was always top of the class. Unfortunately she became mentally ill in later life and my poor uncle had a terrible time with her.

I love the idea of Forest nurseries. I know someone who tired to get the idea taken up in a small primary school in NI badly affected by a bomb 15 years ago & her bosses thought she was crazy.

My son & Half German DiL aren't typical as DiL is very stressed by working too hard though she does finish work at the proper hour to get son from expensive private multi-lingual Nursery. But then her Mum was Anglo Kiwi and she went to an International school & US Universities.

They both worked in a German pharma company in England & the Germans there loved the relaxed atmosphere & all the banter which son said doesn't happen in his German office.
Yes, purplehairstreak they eat lots of pork & drink lots of beer in Bavaria but they are also out cycling, ski-ing & walking a lot in their leisure time & have well marked trails & cycle routes to help. They also have to clear the snow from outside their homes by 7am in winter.

Some of our stereotyped views have been challenged especially by the awful workmanship of the builders who built their house & the dodgy alcoholic developer who has done them out of a lot of money by going bankrupt - they even had to pay the bankruptcy admin guy to ensure the bankruptcy went through which in the end was in their interests. They don't appear to have LA Building Inspectors as we do here or any free Consumer Protection agencies. My son notices how Germans seem to throw money at solving a problem rather than fighting for their rights or fixing things themselves - but maybe that's just in wealthy Munich.

I loved our times in Germany; Theseus was never posted there long term, but his father was with BAOR, and his (father's!) second wife was German, so we were there a lot.

DS2 studied German at university, and enjoyed his year there as an assistant.

And of course, there are the cakes and tortes.....

PS , I have also been to Germany .

Lucky you Purplehairstreak , I just love Germany and the Germans , when we go to Mauritius there are lots of them there in the hotel .

What I like about them they know how to enjoy themselves , bit like me .

I watched the programme with interest as am shortly going to Germany on holiday. Overall, the lifestyle choices were pure common sense, also not using on-line media whilst at work, not wasting time chatting etc. Childcare costs were a dream and the environmental setting for the nursery & encouragement to play creatively reminded me of the Steiner approach. The 4 hours of hausfrau work is now a standing joke in our household - realistically how would anyone find enough to keep do, like keep cleaning etc. in a small apartment? Also there would be a strong risk of getting very bored doing so much housework....

What really concerned me was the diet that was shown in the programme -meaty meaty all the way, topped off with gravy & mashed spuds - only evidence of veg was the cold saukraut and what about excersise? They all seemed to be getting around mostly by car.

Very interesting/thought provoking & although it reminded me a bit of life in the UK in the 1950's, there were some essential common sense message in it.

I love Germany and we visit regularly. Our friends all seem to work both male and female. They do love to show off their English which is great for this elderly camper who finds it very difficult to link in to any language apart from English. I am so glad I didn't watch the programme because I should hate to have my view dented. Not too sure my little home could handle four hours housework though, it's the dirt that holds it together.

Yes, I think I have some German blood in my veins my maiden name could, kinda suggest this, and I feel so at home there.

I found the programme very interesting, but I wonder if it painted an idealised view of German life? For example, part of the reason for the general lower level of personal debt is that unlike in the UK, German tenants have security of tenure in the rented sector, so there is not the same pressure to own a place of your own.

The programme centred very much on the white middle classes, and I think that life for ethnic minorities is not quite so cosy. I used to sometimes lecture in Germany to German teachers, who were always amazed at the resources we had available in the UK to help children whose first language was not English. They seemed to have the attitude that it was not their responsibility to help foreigners learn German.

Loved many aspects of German life as shown on this programme on BBC2. Especially the fact that they have such a strong tradition with apprenticeships and secondary schools aimed at children less academic but with a good education towards the skilled trades. When Thatcher did away with apprenticeships she helped to ruin this country.
My daughter actually lived in Nuremberg for a year and loved it. It was clean, safe and friendly. She and her boyfriend of the time did find it odd that so many mums didn't go to work.

Do the Germans have to put up with these ghastly zero hour contracts that are being inflicted on so many of our workers over here anyone know?

I worked with a German girl and she felt that England was more polerised than Germany as far as housing was concerned. Also when my children were young I met a couple of German mothers at a mother and toddler group and they thought that there were clusters of mothers in our area who were obsessed with private education and talked of little else, they couldn't understand it because they said in Germany pretty much everyone put their children into the state system. I knew the type of women they were talking about, I had one across the road from me, who simply assumed that I had moved to our house as it was up the road to a private prep school where her children went. My children being pre-school age at that time. I had never said anything that should have given her that impression that I was going to educate them privately this was an assumption on her part and when I told her they were going to state schools she physically recoiled as if had told her we had contracted the Bubonic Plague!

Just watched this programme on iPlayer and I think that I must have some German genes. I did spend five years living in Germany and enjoyed my time there very much; when people ask me about my German friends I usually say they worked hard and played hard. German children are (well, they were when I lived there in the early 70's) totally cosseted. I used to get into so much trouble for allowing my toddler to walk to many places rather than putting her in a pushchair - it was not unusual to see four and five year olds still being pushed around. I used to take my children on the local bus and complete strangers would press money into my children's hands or give them packets of sweets or chocolate. My eldest daughter actually started to work the system by the time she was three, she knew that if she chatted to people the 'spoils' would be greater. Since I no longer do paid work I think the four hours a day doing washing/ironing/cooking/cleaning/gardening is probably about right too.

Also they value 'non academic' education - good technical education and do not have the elitist public school system that pollutes our society

Germans in general do not rack up huge debts on credit cards and shareholders are in for the long haul and not short term profits

I suspect that another reason for Germany's economic well-being is that the differential between bosses and workers is very much smaller than it is in the UK. Also, as a rule, bosses don't get regular pay rises of 40% or more.

P.s. I know that these figures do no apply to small and family businesses.