Assisted dying - what do you think?

This is a subject very close to me at the moment. I belong to Dignity in Dying and would hope that if I was in the same sort of condition as some people that I have seen die someone would help me out ( in all senses) had I let my dog suffer in the way I have seen I would have been prosecuted for cruelty.
I can fully understand anyone whose religeous beliefs are against this and they have every right to decide for themselves but they do not have the right to decide for me.

Totally agree Zephrine ...but having read the guardian link ...I do think some people would be put under pressure by their family ...you've only got to read some of the other threads to see how individuals in families can treat others. How could you protect against that if the law can be changed to aid assisted dying?

Yes, this is the big problem and there would have to be a lot of safeguards but as an individual at the moment I have the right to refuse treatment and even the right to end my life should I wish. I would be happy to put these wishes in writing, witnessed by a solicitor or doctor, and hope that these wishes would be carried out if I was no longer physically or mentally capable. A general bumping off elderly relatives is probably not desirable but there are circumstances where all hope is gone when surely with relatives consent two doctors could make the decision.
My nephew was in a persistent vegetitive state for 7 months, there was never any question of his survival, his parents could have refused to let the hospital feed him through a tube into his stomach but they would have had to watch him starve to death as it was they watched their much loved son waste away and turn from a lovely boy who just looked asleep to looking barely human. Impossible choices. Sorry

After seeing loved ones suffer until the very end, I feel if there were safe guards in place everyone should be given the right to choose how they would like to end their days.

With Zephrine's safeguards in place, I'm happy to be bumped off when I'm no longer compos mentis or if I say I've had enough. Happy to put it in lawyery writing.

Zephrine, I've belonged to Dignity in Dying for years (it used to be called the Voluntary Euthanasia Society). I made a "living Will" - nowadays called an Advance Directive some years back and have given one of my daughters an Extended Power of Attorney - she knows and empathises with my wishes on the subject of assisted dying. I have recently seen one of my friends die by inches over a period of months. When she finally died, or to be more accurate when her body finally died, I felt only relief for her, mingled with sorrow that she had suffered so badly for so long. Not for me!

I believe very strongly in assisted dying BUT if any member of my family was to assist me if I wanted to die because of severe illness and then be prosecuted for doing so, then that would be wrong and I don't know how you get round that one in this country. As has been posted before, if you have pets and they are dying and in pain you have them put to sleep, why can't we have the same dignity?

Thank God for the hospice movement. Nobody need die in pain and distress. I worked professionally with hospice services for many years and so many people and their families are helped to die with dignity. My own dear father was able to spend his last month in St Helena Hospice in Colchester where he and us had the best of care. Thats what I hope will happen to me but hospices only get 50% funding from the state which is a scandal. They have to raise the rest through their own efforts so a plug for the hospices and hospice at home services here.

I think that not feeding someone in a vegetive state is not starvation. If you have had cats you know that they stop eating before they die. This not eating is not starvation but a natural decline ending in death. The fear of starvation is felt by healthy relatives who have no experience of not eating, like in illness or fasting.
When my MIL was dying from an internal inoperal tumor we produced a Living Will signed by her and she was left to die. She wanted no food or drink and so she wasn't forced to eat or drink or have a stomach tube. There is care possible. The lips and mouth are kept moistened and morphium plasters against pain are administered. Death follows, just like with your old cat who you later find in a dark place in the garden. The family has to be firm with doctors who fear being taken to court.
After we had taken the decision the care in the home improved. The carers realised this was a natural happening and were involved in a natural process. They didn't have to spend time forcing her to eat or drink or take medication. It all felt so right! After she had died she was laid out and we spent some hours in her room. Some people find this shocking but we found it all natural even the gt grandchildren.

All very true but my nephews death was not natural, he was murdered, he was 25 and his parents were stunned by grief. Cats may be one thing but it takes a lot of resolve to withold food and water from a loved one.

But it doesn't. They don't want food. They don't want food forced on them!
Forced in them and then forced out of them to be crude about it. I have observed this with my FIL and it was a torment for him.
Murder does not belong in this thread about assisted dying.

Oh Zepnrine ...I am so sorry ...to make that type of decision for a loved one, under any circumstances, would be unbeleivably hard ...but given the way your nephew came to a vegetative state... it must have been unbearable.

I can see why you have become a member of Dignity in Dying.
Perhaps you would be willing to share their web address with us?

Sorry for typo Zephrine ...that's what comes of typing through tears

If your nearest and dearest had a degenerative illness and wanted your prior agreement to help end life when the time came, how can you applaud the sentiment, but refuse to help? Or am I just being a coward?

I have their leaflet right by my desk - the web address in www.dignityindying.org.uk.
I too have a living will/Advance Directive; there are certain requirements if it is to be legally enforceable so it is worth checking it out with Dignity in Dying's stuff rather than 'going it alone'. Also good to lodge a copy with GP and family members, and nominate people who can consult with doctors and one another if you are unable to be part of the discussion when the time comes.
I agree the 'slippery slope' argument is a difficult one but I believe 'the answer to wrong use is not no use, it is right use' - in this case referring to the legalisation of assisted dying.
How is it that the medical profession and the law pull out all the stops to keep us alive without consulting our wishes, but then go all self righteous and refuse to help us get out of the resulting miserable end.

Thanks Jacey. www.dignityindying.org.uk

PatriciaPT When we took a copy of our living wills to our GP he said he wished more of his patients would set down their wishes while they were still able to do so.

Elegran when I took mine he looked through it and said 'Does this mean I'll be sued if I don't abide by it?' - so I said 'Yes'. (He has the rare capacity to make humorous conversation while still taking proper note of what you are actually there for.)

PatriciaPT You could sue him in a higher court, with no right of appeal!

Of course we should all be allowed to choose when and how we die if we are in a vegetable state or terminally ill,as other members have said,we do not let our pets suffer. My partner and I have promised each other that we shall go to Switzerland if the law does not change here. The legal problems are not unsolvable, I have done a power of attorney for health and welfare asking that if I am in a 'locked in'state or my mind goes that my children will ask that I may die.If this is done while we are 'compus mentis' and witnessed to that fact it should be honoured, but I should not advocate that relatives make the choice themselves.
This all seems so sensible when the NHS is in such a critical state.

My father made a Living Will and my mother made her wishes known and both parents had their wishes respected. For myself? I honestly don't know. I hope I have enough time to make a decision. If not and my condition is hopeless and I become a burden I should be allowed to die with dignity. I think that being a burden would be the spur.

Dying is so much a part of living. It is a luxury to choose how we die. My father had that luxury. He too made a Living Will which we produced when it was obvious he couldn't take any more. He'd always been an 'instant' man!

He was in hospital at the age of 89 being fed 13 pills three times a day. Up to this time he had done all his own shopping and cooking. He knew there was no chance of him ever 'getting better'.

What a wonderful week we had with him. The registrar listened and took him off all medication except those that would ease his path out of this world. Friends came to say goodbye at his request, and grandchildren came from afar. After a week, he had a good lunch, had a nap and died. We, too, spent valuable time with him at this time, and it was so special.

The problem with going elsewhere to choose to die is that the moment has to be hastened. One has to travel maybe months or years before the allotted time just to be sure of arriving. Choosing to die at home, surrounded by loved ones, is a luxury. Why is this being denied to so many? Well done to all those bringing this subject out in the open, such as Terry Pratchett and Gransnet. Thank you.

I agree with Charlotta that it is not starvation. I have had the devastating experience of having 3 elderly relatives die in hospital in the last 12 months and all three of them stopped eating and drinking naturally, the only thing given to them was pain relief if needed and they refused anything else. We were told it was nature's way of letting them go peacefully, which they all three did. None of them had a living will nor were coerced into "giving up". I felt they had just had enough.

DH & I have both made living will's and the DCs all know what is expected
it's not an easy subject to broach with your children but we felt we needed
them all to be aware of what our requests where,we also have made plans
for our remains to be used for medical science as there is no way any one is going to profit from our demise,and the DCs will arrange a service at our local
church and a party at the local pub,all sorted