Anne Boleyn

Chestnut

trisher

Chestnut

If we are going to enter fantasyland then why not get Bart Simpson to play Churchill?

Bart Simpson is a cartoon character not an actor Chestnut. Actors are real people. If you don't know the difference I understand it must be difficult to appreciate what is happening.

You've missed the point completely. ? Perhaps you need an explanation. You took us into fantasyland by suggesting Idris Elba or a woman to play Churchill, and I was just playing along with this silly game by suggesting something equally ridiculous. (I'd have thought that was obvious actually).

But women have been playing men's parts for years Chestniut, interestingliterature.com/2014/10/was-hamlet-a-woman-yes-and-no/
so why not a woman playing Churchill? Or a black actor? It isn't ridiculous. It's entirelt possible and it could be very interesting.
I think it will take more time for black characters to be played by white actors, primarily because white actors and white roles now dominate. But if in the future the numbers equalize it would seem to be desirable

lemongrove

The woke posters are enjoying revelling in their wokeness!
What larks they are having. ?
I can only sit back in amazement at the weirdness of their views regarding casting.....although I think they are probably saying things for the effect, egging each other on ( as they giggle).I hope it’s that, and not that they really believe such daftness.Mind you, it’s GN so you never know.

?. Absolutely, it’s complete madness.

Agree lemongrove, chestnut, disco. It’s so ridiculous, I think it’s a wind up. To do what they suggest would turn all productions into pantomimes. A bit like this thread!

Nice article in the Sunday Herald this morning about the series. Explains how they were trying to get the best actor for the part. Interesting.

Not sure I'll watch it though, its got an Irish actor playing Jane Seymour. Jane Seymour wasn't Irish! And the actor playing Henry is only 33 and everybody knows he was 45 when Anne was killed!

Its just PC gone mad.

Maybe the question should be, are we fantasists or realists, and take ‘ racist’ out of the equation.
I know I’m definitely a realist. I’ve never liked pantomime. I wouldn’t watch something where the sexes were changed. I wouldn’t watch anything where a white person was portraying a black person, and the same the other way round.
A fantasist could do these things because they have good imagination. I don’t, and never have.
I struggled being adopted, because they weren’t my real family. This is something I can’t change.

Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?

My DFiL used to think the most damning indictment of any series/program was that "it couldn't really happen, could it?" He liked a war film because they were all factual, weren't they?

I think some people are more interested in impersonators than actors.

Toadinthehole

Maybe the question should be, are we fantasists or realists, and take ‘ racist’ out of the equation.
I know I’m definitely a realist. I’ve never liked pantomime. I wouldn’t watch something where the sexes were changed. I wouldn’t watch anything where a white person was portraying a black person, and the same the other way round.
A fantasist could do these things because they have good imagination. I don’t, and never have.
I struggled being adopted, because they weren’t my real family. This is something I can’t change.

You'd never watch anything where a white person was portraying a black person? So you've never watched a biblical epic? Or are white people playing middle eastern characters OK because they aren't that black? Maybe the same goes for westerns, I mean native Americans are OK to be played by white actors. It is only really black people who must never be confused with white people.

No there really isn't any racism is there.

trisher I think it will take more time for black characters to be played by white actors, primarily because white actors and white roles now dominate. But if in the future the numbers equalize it would seem to be desirable
I would say there are now a lot of dramas and movies starring black actors and other races too. There are plenty of parts in TV dramas and movies, and even historical dramas without changing the sex and race of real people. Hopefully more writers will include black characters whether real of not without having to change history.

Oooerr! Alegrias1 too much philosophising for my poor brain on sunny sunday!?

At the end of the day it’s all a nonsense. This is being done in the name of art by some right on director/producer.

The argument now is that gay characters are played by gay actors. Native American actors used to be thin on the ground in the days when westerns were the mode, but now those parts are played by them. I dare say in Africa all the actors are black. Seeing as people of colour only account for quite a small percentage of the population in the UK why should they play a larger part in the acting profession? If a film is being made focusing on the black community then, obviously, black actors would take those parts.

This Anne Boleyn play is ridiculous and the actress concerned may be the best actress ever but from the clips I’ve seen I just can’t relate to it. Also, as I’ve previously stated, AB and Henry VIII has been done to death. His whole reign was awful and the most horrific tortures were inflicted on people. I don’t know why they don’t do more on Charles II. Now there’s a king I can relate to.

You mean the words to Bohemian Rhapsody?

I dare say in Africa all the actors are black.

I .... just....can't....

Good grief.

Frankly, ever since I read that Samual L Jackson has a problem with black British actors playing American parts, on the premise that the British have no understands of what its like to be black American, I saw the whole argument about racism in a different light.

It's great if they can find people who have a similar background to the part they play, but it needn't be an actual requirement. You do not need to be gay, black American or anything else for that matter to play a role. The actor often researches their part in detail to get an an understanding of the character. It's called acting.

Chestnut

It's great if they can find people who have a similar background to the part they play, but it needn't be an actual requirement. You do not need to be gay, black American or anything else for that matter to play a role. The actor often researches their part in detail to get an an understanding of the character. It's called acting.

Chestnut you've just totally contradicted what you've been arguing for the past day!

Not at all Fanny. It's wrong to change the race or sex of a person who actually existed and who we know about. However, having a gay actor play them is neither here nor there. A black British actor can play a black American part, he doesn't need to have experienced what it is like to be a black American if he researches his part. And we're talking all roles here, not just real historical people.

I have no particular issue with a black actress in the role of Anne, although I think the story has been rather done to death with each one promising but rarely delivering anything much new! However I belong to a forum called Quora, which has its fair share of those who are not familiar with British history and recent posts have been protesting that the fact that this lady was ‘of colour’ is not widely known! It chimes nicely in with the current, and very tedious, saga of the Sussexes and I fear that some ill informed people are going to use this as a stick to further bash us ‘racist’ Brits with. I hope I am wrong but just a thought.

Amalegra - are you saying that people on the forum actually believe Anne Boleyn was black?

I am looking forward to this new interpretation. I don't know what happened to the last episode of Our Yorkshire Farm though.
. I enjoyed the recent David Copperfield film. We have seen enough white people playing people of colour for long enough and never batted an eyelid.
We were only talking yesterday about all the attention Henry Viii still gets when he was so evil. What is the fascination.

We were only talking yesterday about all the attention Henry Viii still gets when he was so evil. What is the fascination.

I think it's partly because he was responsible for creating the C of E, partly because he was Elizabeth's father, and partly because he displayed characteristics that are (sadly) familiar to some people today. He seems to have had a narcissistic personality disorder, falling madly in love, then turning against people very quickly, with the ability to turn his back on people who were out of favour as quickly as he had idealised them in the first place.

I think a lot has to do with the fact that the story has so many opportunities for great drama, though. Six wives with very different stories, good costumes and lots of sex and violence.?

Thomas Cromwell played a large part in the downfall of Anne Boleyn. We can never know for sure how much influence he had on Henry.

AGAA4

Thomas Cromwell played a large part in the downfall of Anne Boleyn. We can never know for sure how much influence he had on Henry.

You are right - there is much of the story that is supposition rather than fact, which is another reason why I think there is still so much interest in it after 500 years.

It is debatable whether Cromwell engineered Anne's downfall at Henry's behest - in order to get rid of her because she hadn't given him a son, and he had replaced her in his affections with Jane Seymour - or whether he did it for his own reasons.

It has been suggested that he took against Anne as revenge for the execution of his mentor, Cardinal Wolsey, which is a possibility. As you say, though, we'll never know.

I find this period of history enthralling. Henry was thought to be evil but I believe his advisers had much input into the events during his reign.

Of course Henry V111 is very interesting, but it's been done to death.
Mainly, imv, because its easy to sell abroad. So financially its a winner.

So many other areas or people in history (not just the royals) we could be entertained and learn something from.