School assemblies

I can remember at junior school a teacher who loved classical music would sometimes play five minutes of a well known piece of classical music at the end of an assembly. It sort of gave you a more rounded interest in music, even if many children looked bored.

YorkLady

We had daily assemblies when I was at primary school.
My lasting memory is of the classical music played for about two minutes at the end, then we had to file out of the hall in turn.
It’s where my love of classical music started and I’m grateful for it.

Yes, it's the same for me. I remember hearing "Fingal's Cave" for the first time when I was about 6 years old, at the morning assembly and loved it.

My junior school was Church of England, so singing hymns, bible stories and morality stories were a big thing every day. Once a week the vicar would pay a visit from the church next door and once a fortnight, we'd attend the church for a service on Mondays. Also the school every Thursday would play a religious programme on the radio called A Service For Schools.
Secondary school was rather different as it was non denom. My first secondary school had two house assemblies and one school assembly every week. The house assembly was really just like a bulletin of events with only a minimum of religion like a short religious strory. School assembly was more religious, with a hymn sung, the Lord's Prayer and then a religious/ moral story before the headmaster ran through various school notices and achievements.
Changing schools at 13, with a head and a deputy who were atheists and a housemaster with little interest in relgion, the assemblies were quite interesting. We'd be asked to put on plays or give talks about things that affected us like worries about finding a job after school or the threat of nuclear war. Also I remember organising a play that condemned racism, where someone in blackface( the school was totally white and this was 1982), was bullied over their skin colour and stands up to his tormentors.

ViceVersa

M0nica

Mollygo

The best belief system for a child to be brought up in is to have conscience as her compass and reason as her map and the ability to allow others to have their faiths without implying that there’s anything wrong with that.

But where do the map and conscience come from?

From having good people around them - and that doesn't necessarily mean those people need to be religious. You don't need religion to have a conscience and stop you doing bad things, you just need to be a good person.

I uite agree you do not need a religion to have a conscience, but what are 'good' people and where did they get their goodness from.

Humanism and Atheism are belief systems.

M0nica

Mollygo

The best belief system for a child to be brought up in is to have conscience as her compass and reason as her map and the ability to allow others to have their faiths without implying that there’s anything wrong with that.

But where do the map and conscience come from?

From having good people around them - and that doesn't necessarily mean those people need to be religious. You don't need religion to have a conscience and stop you doing bad things, you just need to be a good person.

Mollygo

^The best belief system for a child to be brought up in is to have conscience as her compass and reason as her map^ and the ability to allow others to have their faiths without implying that there’s anything wrong with that.

But where do the map and conscience come from?

The best belief system for a child to be brought up in is to have conscience as her compass and reason as her map and the ability to allow others to have their faiths without implying that there’s anything wrong with that.

Caleo Dd had no problem at all 'divesting herself of her faith.

Humankind from its earliest time has universally had an instinct to look for reasons beyond itself. Over time this has taken all sorts of forms and for many people there is far more to religion than, supernatural beliefs and need not necessarily include them.

Well said, Caleo!

M0nica

A child is brought up in a belief system even when it isn't religious. You can not bring children up in a vacuum.

My children are baptised catholics, one rejected the whole system at 13, the other is now more CofE than catholic because of his wife, and their children were baptised in a C0f E church.

Neither my children nor grandchildren have grown up in a rigidly religious atmosphere and they have formed their own views and followed them. It would have been much the same if brought up in almost any religion or none. On the otther hand just as there are religious families that do insist their children follow a rigid belief system, there are also atheist families doing just the same.

The best belief system for a child to be brought up in is to have conscience as her compass and reason as her map.

Why would you want to impose any supernatural beliefs on a child when the same child will be put to the trouble of divesting herself of those belief?

Nanny27

I don't think that christening is any kind of imposition on the child but rather a set of promises that the parents make to raise the child in the Christian way.

But that IS an imposition!

My son and daughter in law are not religionists and undertook to raise their children without any supernatural beliefs. When the little girl went to the local C of E primary school she was happy. She asked her mother one day "What is god?" Her mother told her god is something some people believe in.

Surely it is best to educated a child and not indoctrinate a child.

I don't think that christening is any kind of imposition on the child but rather a set of promises that the parents make to raise the child in the Christian way.

Basgetti

M0nica

A child is brought up in a belief system even when it isn't religious. You can not bring children up in a vacuum.

My children are baptised catholics, one rejected the whole system at 13, the other is now more CofE than catholic because of his wife, and their children were baptised in a C0f E church.

Neither my children nor grandchildren have grown up in a rigidly religious atmosphere and they have formed their own views and followed them. It would have been much the same if brought up in almost any religion or none. On the otther hand just as there are religious families that do insist their children follow a rigid belief system, there are also atheist families doing just the same.

Well, no.
Our children were brought up with no belief system. Ie: whatever you believe is fine by us 🤷‍♀️

That is a belief system.

Calendargirl

I attended a CofE primary school in the late 50’s and early 60’s.

Every day started with assembly, hymns, prayers, readings.

The memory of them has stayed with me throughout my life, a peaceful, ordered start to the day.

Surprising how many non church goers still want that type of education for their children.

I wonder why?

We don’t go to church now, although I did when I was younger but we sent our children to an oecumenical school. There they were taught about all religions. I felt it would broaden their minds and enable them to choose.

M0nica

A child is brought up in a belief system even when it isn't religious. You can not bring children up in a vacuum.

My children are baptised catholics, one rejected the whole system at 13, the other is now more CofE than catholic because of his wife, and their children were baptised in a C0f E church.

Neither my children nor grandchildren have grown up in a rigidly religious atmosphere and they have formed their own views and followed them. It would have been much the same if brought up in almost any religion or none. On the otther hand just as there are religious families that do insist their children follow a rigid belief system, there are also atheist families doing just the same.

Well, no.
Our children were brought up with no belief system. Ie: whatever you believe is fine by us 🤷‍♀️

A child is brought up in a belief system even when it isn't religious. You can not bring children up in a vacuum.

My children are baptised catholics, one rejected the whole system at 13, the other is now more CofE than catholic because of his wife, and their children were baptised in a C0f E church.

Neither my children nor grandchildren have grown up in a rigidly religious atmosphere and they have formed their own views and followed them. It would have been much the same if brought up in almost any religion or none. On the otther hand just as there are religious families that do insist their children follow a rigid belief system, there are also atheist families doing just the same.

Cossy

Nanny27

I think you’re right Grandma 70s that people see christening as a bit of an excuse for a party but I find it incredible that anyone would stand in church and make outright lies over the head of their child. Just wow!

Which is why none of our children were christened, I expect my dear CoE mother and my catholic MiL were horrified, but we feel/felt it’s not right to “impose” this onto our children though they were taken into churches for events like church parade and there’s a bible in our home.

My father caused a bit of a stooshie in our family when I was born. His mother went to church (Church of Scotland) every Sunday and his brother was a minister, so when he point blank refused to allow me to be christened, they weren't happy, to put it mildly.
His reasoning that once I was old enough to understand about religion, I could choose for myself - so his one concession was to allow my granny to take me to Sunday School. That only lasted until I got into trouble for asking too many awkward questions - and not getting any answers, just being told to 'believe'. Neither of my children were christened.

M0nica

Nowadays the majority of people do not have any religious beliefs, nor do most chilren. They are completely ignorant of what religion is, have never been in a church, temple, mosue or synagogue. To expect them therefore to latch onto the idea, the hymns, prayers and readings they would get in a school assembly, is unrealistic - and what about the schools where te majority of children may be being brought up in a rligion, but not christianity?

I think schools do need to have assembies to build up a sense of unity, but if it is to be more than just a reading out of notices, then whatever is done should be non-religious. I am sure there are many themes an assembly could be built round, with poetry, readings and music that are not religious.

My kids are in their thirties. I think their secondary schools (we'd moved counties by the time 2nd child was 11) took them to the different religious buildings available in the area. Certainly both schools' RE and PSHE lessons taught them about world religions.

And I repeat what's been said before, secondary schools do not have the space or the time to get 1000 pupils into one place

Nowadays the majority of people do not have any religious beliefs, nor do most chilren. They are completely ignorant of what religion is, have never been in a church, temple, mosue or synagogue. To expect them therefore to latch onto the idea, the hymns, prayers and readings they would get in a school assembly, is unrealistic - and what about the schools where te majority of children may be being brought up in a rligion, but not christianity?

I think schools do need to have assembies to build up a sense of unity, but if it is to be more than just a reading out of notices, then whatever is done should be non-religious. I am sure there are many themes an assembly could be built round, with poetry, readings and music that are not religious.

Nanny27

I think you’re right Grandma 70s that people see christening as a bit of an excuse for a party but I find it incredible that anyone would stand in church and make outright lies over the head of their child. Just wow!

Which is why none of our children were christened, I expect my dear CoE mother and my catholic MiL were horrified, but we feel/felt it’s not right to “impose” this onto our children though they were taken into churches for events like church parade and there’s a bible in our home.

“I get all my religious education off the daily news. All Arabs want to wipe all Jews off the face of the earth a la Ayatollahs and similarly all Jews want to wipe all Arabs off the face of the earth a la Netenyahu and each reavows their intentions on daily basis. We are a Christian nation but we've allowed others to obliterate that fact. Prior to the 1st Gulf War British service men and women stationed in Saudi Arabia were not allowed Christian services prior to the liberation of Kuwait from Saddam Hussein s invasion”

Orly

In the main I find your comment above rather ignorant and very divisive.

I've no problems with assemblies, it's a good opportunity to build a cohesive value driven school community but it shouldn't be based on Christianity. We're a multi faith/no faith society and we should be secular. It's a parent's responsibility to give their children religious guidance (should they wish) not the state. I wasn't christened, my children weren't christened and my grandchildren are not christened. I certainly didn't want or need the school to instill religion into any of my children and I know my children feel the same.

I think you’re right Grandma 70s that people see christening as a bit of an excuse for a party but I find it incredible that anyone would stand in church and make outright lies over the head of their child. Just wow!

Nanny27

So many people don't follow any religion and many weddings now take place outside churches which is fine of course.
What I never understood is the number of parents who continue to have their children Christened. With no faith why would they do this?

I cross-questioned a friend of mine about this. She had no particular belief and never went to church, but she had her children christened. In the end she said “Just in case there’s something in it”.

I wasn’t christened, and neither was my husband. We were both born in 1940, and it was very unusual then. I also refused to be a godmother to the “just in case there’s something in it” child, which upset my friend very much - but how could I be so involved in something I didn’t believe in?

My son, however had no such reservations - he cheerfully accepted being godfather to a friend’s child. He didn’t believe any of it, and moreover neither did the child’s father. It was just an automatic formality and an excuse for a party!

Interesting thoughts, AuntieE. I agree we need to engage people, especially children, more in all religions.

Most private schools do not really instruct children in one religion only, although parents could, of course, look around for a specialist setting that does. Many private schools have a Christian culture and heritage, but even these schools celebrate and respect the range of religious traditions represented in society.

More importantly, Fundamental British Values, such as respect, fairness, and responsibility, should be central to the school’s ethos. Though some might disagree with that too.