Why are so many elderly abandoned by grown up children.

Good post Kandinsky, agree completely.

I'll have to ask him Callistemon. I'm sure he'll some comment to make.

Circumstances do differ.
I left home at 21 and never spoke to my parents again.
Not all families are close or wish to be. There is no shame in that.

I don't think I can be bothered answering specific posts.

I know some parents have caused problems.
I also know some parents are good parents.
We don't have statistics. So no one can say how many are in either group.
I know my friends well but obviously some people here know them better.
I am caring and respectful of my children. I ask when it is convenient to chat. ( I have stopped asking for facetime. Not going to beg. They obviously don't want to)
I help when asked, have my own life (not needy). My children do have time to visit and money is not a problem. And still they don't come. I absolutely never tell them they should visit me more.
Someone said "as you sow"......
Not nice.
I know others in this situation.
What is the problem with admitting this is true?
Sometimes GN just annoys me.

annepl why are you taking it so much to heart? The trouble with abuse is it goes on behind closed doors and is done by people who look perfect to others. That's the point, abusive people don't want anyone to know or they don't get away with it.

That doesn't mean that anyone who doesn't get to see their children as much as they like deserves that treatment... Or that everyone in that scenario is somehow bad. Its just an important part of the answer to the question in the OP.

You Can’t force relationships.

If the bond isn’t there for whatever reason the person A has no reason to contact or have B involved in their lives.
Blood doesn’t mean a life time commitment anymore.
There may not be abuse. There may just be a clash of personalities but that’s enough.

annepl I know what you mean. If only everyone did reap what they sow, but they don't do they.

It's the almost immediate response of 'abuse' that annoys me as soon as someone opens up about any problem they may be having with their AC; abuse from the parent but rarely if ever, abuse from the AC.

As you say, there are no statistics and there aren't likely to be any either so far better to accept what we are being told rather than try and make someone else's experience fit our own.

annepl why are you taking it so much to heart?

Possibly for the same reason that EAC take it very much to heart when they're trying to explain their circumstances and don't think that they're being heard, listened to or validated?

It works seem that the opinion of a lot of people on here think you must be a bad parent if your children distance themselves. I don’t believe that for a minute. No one person gets absolutely everything spot on when parenting, or anything else for that matter, you raise them with love and guidance, the vast amount of mom and dads would if were necessary sacrifice anything for them. You ask at any home for the elderly and there will be a percentage who rarely get a visit, these are not all bad parents, it is a sign if the times.

I don’t think all who are estranged or abandoned were bad parents or bad people.

I just don’t think we can judge if others are good parents unless we are their children. We only see what they want us to see.

I think most of my friends are excellent parents. But my opinion doesn’t matter, it’s their children’s opinion who matters.

I just don’t think we can judge if others are bad parents unless we are their children. We only see what they want us to see.

I don’t think they would be bad parents.
But I don’t think lack of visits etc makes the children bad people either.

Sparkling where has that been said?

Good parents are good parents

Bad parents are bad parents

The only ones who really know are the children, same in reverse except, there is nature and nurture to consider and we all have some responsibility in how our children turn out. Not sure how much but it definitely isn't none. Unless no parent can take any credit for raising lovely people with good morals and a kind disposition.

I don't really understand what is wrong with saying that when it just is.

Exactly so Bibbity.

Starblaze I don't really understand what is wrong with saying that when it just is who said it was wrong?

Well there's a lot I was going to write but my son just rang to say hello. In the course of chatting I asked had they been out for a meal recently. Guess what? He his wife and daughters and his FiL had been in a restaurant five minutes from me a week ago. I haven't seen him since 21 June. Explain that. Oh, maybe I'm a bad mother. They also went to London about four weeks ago and I put money in their account for spending.
For the first time in my life I actually told him I was very hurt that he hadn't called to say hello.

Annepl, please don't take it to heart? It may have been the FIL's birthday, or some other reason why it was that side of the family who were out together. It probably wasn't that they wanted to exclude you, so much as that they were doing something that didn't involve you, and there is a huge difference.

If he hadn't wanted you to be there (deliberately) he needn't have mentioned it at all, and the fact that he did probably means it didn't occur to him that you'd be hurt. I understand why you were, but the chances are that he didn't.

Adult children can be thoughtless, but that's not the same as not caring, or being deliberately unkind. I know it's meaningless, really, but please have a virtual bunch of flowers .

Doodledog My son said he thought we were isolating which is untrue because they came on my birthday in June. I think he only mentioned it because I asked.
I certainly would understand if it was a celebration for her family. I've no problem with that at all. I'm not a clingy parent. But he knows my husband and I were both sick all last week and he could have just said hello, I think if he was in the neighbourhood.
I have never said anything to my children before but it just took me by surprise.
However thank you for your kind thoughts and the flowers.

I'm sorry - it does sound as though he was being thoughtless.

Mine can be too, and I probably am with my mum from time to time. There are no excuses, as it does hurt, but he probably didn't mean to.

There is a Zimbabwean proverb - 'The tree remembers what the axe forgets', which I think is very true.

I haven't heard that one before Doodledog.
I'm sure I have been thoughtless too at times. Good point. Thanks.

Why would you want your son to visit if you were sick?

I’d be keeping loved ones far away in that case.

Unless you wanted him to call and say he was 5 minutes away and refuse to visit?

I’m very confused

Summerlove

Unless it's something infectious why would I not want him to visit. Did you never visit a sick parent?
Besides I said we were both sick last week.

I rarely see my son. He was in the same town, five minutes away. I'm not hurt about not joining him for dinner. Just that he didn't stop by. What's confusing?

And are you trying to say I don't care about loved ones because I want them to visit me when I'm ill? What nonsense, And how unkind.

Smileless you made some good valid points.

Summerlove -- Great term -- And your "quote fail" is now understood.

You go on to say, "I don’t think all who are estranged or abandoned were bad parents or bad people.

I just don’t think we can judge if others are good parents unless we are their children. We only see what they want us to see.

I think most of my friends are excellent parents. But my opinion doesn’t matter, it’s their children’s opinion who matters."

And certain people/groups cannot and will not accept that truth/reality because to do so negates their ability to declare to themselves and each other that they were indeed "good parents" based on their own self affirmations.

I tried to be a "good child" or so I thought, BUT the people who got to decide that I was or was not a "good child" were the 'adults' in my life. THEY said/told Me I was a "bad child" and who was I to disagree? They were in the position to judge Me and my behavior from their POV as a parent/adult. But I/any abused child will say, "I judge You as the hypocrite You are."

This thread has provoked another lot of estrangement posts possibly due to the title? I think OP was really talking about the kind of thoughtlessness displayed by Annep1’s children, not actual full on estrangement.

In families all too often people inadvertently “take things the wrong way” - something said by a family member - that can easily be misinterpreted - so creating discord and unfounded assumptions! We can all be guilty of this and totally get the ‘wrong end of the stick’, so to speak. The key here is communication! If you don’t hear from your children or friends or family - then call them for a chat! They are probably totally unaware of how you are feeling! My sister-in-law lives by herself in a nice flat (housing for over 60s) and has said on occasions how she hasn’t seen anyone for days! Other neighbours meet up (socially distancing) but she would not join in, nor invite anyone into her flat for a chat and cup of tea. That says it all for me.