I don't think my daughter likes me much

rnnn? should be 'chat'

Would it be feasible for you to ask her to write a list of food/meals she would prefer to eat and then you could shop and plan accordingly?
Possibly even give her an amount to buy her own bits to make a meal and you provide basics, potatoes, butter, bread, cheese, pasta, rice with the proviso that it has to be spent on food and you will not make up for her spending it any other way.
Her age makes her more inclined to be stroppy but doesn't excuse her manners.
I feel she may be jittery at the thought of going to uni as she can't act the way she's acting with you, with other students.
Well, she can but she'd be left with no friends and others would give her a wide berth.
One of my sons doesn't do small talk and rolls his eyes if I rnnn about inconsequential stuff and he's twice her age.
There is no 'normal' when it comes to the amount of conversation we each are happy to indulge in.
As for her room - most mums will have the same problem. Forget it.
I wish you well and your daughter every success at uni however, I do think she needs some sort of intervention regarding her mental health and the uni ought to be made aware of this.
Very best wishes to you both ??

I totally empathise ilovedragonflies as my relationship with my daughter, who suffers from bi polar, is so similar and every time you think "phew! got through that" it can be ok for a while until the next crisis comes up. Then it's despair until it passes again. It's so hard too because, speaking personally, you feel so alone and isolated from 'normal' family experiences as life really shouldn't be this difficult. I think really good advice has been given upthread especially by notanan2 and Dorsetcupcake. The urge to help your child is very strong but maybe counterproductive. This is in no way a criticism..it has taken me a long, long time to come to terms with the fact that much as my girl depends on me I have been overly eager to 'help' sort out her problems and possibly created a culture of dependence and, as a by product, lack of esteem on her part. I could write a whole chapter if not a book on this but will just say I sincerely hope you find a way through and keep posting..the lovely mums and nans on here are wonderfully kind and supportive and it helps oh so much to be listened to.

Violettham I too am very apprehensive. There are too many student suicides already.

Dealite. You are so kind and caring to take the trouble to write that moving and very helpful message. I am so very sorry about your son.
Bless you and thank you. ??

My DD17 has similar mental health issues, a lot of what you have written is almost exactly the same, except some days my DD is slightly better. None of us know what will happen with uni after COVID19 and I have no idea if my daughter could cope but its where she wants to be. I am lucky in that I have another DD and my husband is at home so we can mix it up a bit, but you being alone with her all the time is incredibly difficult. I am also part of a support group so every day I can go online and say x happened and it was hard, if I need to. My DD also says I am talking about her all the time - apparently I tell all my friends she's an evil lunatic

I wonder if you have ever used the Young Minds parents helpline? There is every chance your DD will be unwell on and off for a while, and maybe even a long time, particularly if she doesn't want to take medication or try out other therapies (my DD has been let down by psychiatrists and therapists and she's still under CAMHS!) so having a support group or outlet would be invaluable:

youngminds.org.uk/about-us/who-we-are/

Ilovedragonflies Your message above crossed with mine above. I still have fears. I have greater fears for her at Uni too. I'd rather not spell them out. I am so very sorry about your father. My husband did the same.
I cannot change my feelings in my letter above on account of one good day. I am so sorry. Also trying to analyse, understand, diagnose, by discussion in letters with other very kind, perceptive and well meaning people online, though comforting, can never predict how your own situation will work out. I sincerely would like your daughter to see a Psychiatrist. Only that way can she be properly helped. Since she is interested in Psychology perhaps when she is in the right mood she might discuss herself and her moods and you can give her some true insights into what she is like and what you fear.

I sincerely hope all will be well. With love, Elle ?

I haven't had time to read all the comments but didn't want to read and run. Firstly, it takes until our young people are up to 23 to build their brain to become more empathetic, more aware of what is going on around them, etc. Secondly, if she is going off to Uni in September and is living with others, she will soon have the rough edges knocked off her and will grow up enormously. I cannot believe the difference between the boy who went away in September and the grown up who came home. He went from having everything done for him (by his Dad!) to somebody who cooks and cleans up after himself, offers food money, doing his washing, etc.
One thing that does occur to me as I read your post looking at her history, relationships and food choices is that it is quite possible that she might be on the ASD spectrum. Girls often present very differently and are far more able to cope but can escape diagnosis. Being in control is a big part of this when everything else feels fragile. It might be worth doing some research and finding strategies which will help both of you to cope. Quite often it is little adjustments in the way you think that make such a tremendous difference because the 'slights' are no longer personal. Regardless of whether ASD exists, the strategies used are usually helpful.
My daughter is 35 and I remember going through this stage so clearly. We sometimes still struggle but I am no longer this "stupid" person who knows nothing and I've learned to keep my mouth shut with the circular arguments about why she is the only person in the world not to have a solution to her problems. I just say, "I'll have to have a think about that," and make my escape. Strangely enough, there is normally a solution somewhere!

Hi * Ilovedragonflies*, only just read this and your last response. I think at the moment, any problems are magnified and made worse by this lockdown, particularly if you’ve already got mental health issues. It sounds like you’re getting on top of things, and doing as best you can. You love her, so that is the backbone to everything else. I hope all goes well for you both.

I completely sympathise with you. My daughter is 28 but we have had a very rocky relationship. She has massive mood swings, not bipolar but shes on medication which helps to a certain degree but when she feels good in herself she stops taking it & then shes 100 times worse. She doesnt live with us now, she has a 9 year old son who we love dearly and is very intelligent. He doesnt get the stimulation he needs from her and even messaged me last night wanting to come and live with us because he can talk to us. The language And tone she speaks to me is disgusting, pretty much how she speaks with her friends. When I was very ill in hospital a few years ago, she came to see me once and ended up storming out because I wasn’t up for talking and it was all about her problems, not how are you mum! I was in for 6 weeks and she never contacted me. She later admitted that she wished shed been in my hospital bed so she could get looked after and have the attention, i couldnt believe it! Other times she can be the most caring young woman you’d ever want to know but it doesnt last very long. She says she cant talk to me because of the tone of my voice & how I roll my eyes. she asks for an opinion and when you give it, she goes ballistic and puts the phone down like she did last night and then I received a long swearing text off her. I’m sorry to say that it doesnt get any better the older the become. Hoping your daughter will though. Ohh for them to be babies again....I wish. Good luck x

Dear Ilovedgragonflies - I wept when I read your letter. I am truly sorry for you having to live with this very difficult young woman, and I would only say don't blame yourself. I think it is very important to have your own space as others have suggested and just stop cooking, cleaning, washing and generally treating her like a child, which she is not. Once she ventures into the big outside world she will have to cope, albeit with professional support. In the meantime, look after yourself.

Dear Ilovedragonflies

You poor lady! This is the kind of terrible crisis that is bound to arise in our lockdown situation.

Forgive me but I have only scanned the thread. As soon as I read "I'm aware I sound selfish and self-pitying but I feel utterly broken and can't go anywhere .." and your final sentence, I knew this is a crisis situation.

Please phone your Doctor now. Tell him/her that your daughter and you have reached crisis point and you fear for the worst. Her depressive/anger condition had become worse and you are unable to manage her and it is having a terrible effect on you. You are frightened of what might happen. She refuses her medication.

You are not "selfish and self-pitying". You are a normal person in an impossibly terrifying, indeed threatening,
situation that cannot be managed where you are on your own. Your daughter's previous self-harm is enough to tell me how dangerous this situation is. Please be aware, mental health is as important and as serious as any other health care need and a mental health crisis affects those nearest who also need help and needs intervention as much as a heart attack needs an emergency ambulance.

If your Doctor does not come up with the goods, phone the NHS and spell it out. Do not sugar-coat it. This is a crisis. The situation we are in is directly exacerbating it but she might have had a return of her illness anyway as it tends to come and go and anything might trigger it.

Calling for medical help is not giving up or failure any more than calling an ambulance to a suspected heart attack is a failure to help. It is the right thing to do, and your daughter needs it.

The circumstances you are in, caused by the lockdown, actually constitute the ingredients for torture. Being with a person who consistently negates you, puts you down, and yet whom you feel responsible for, is a real Catch 22. It is an unsolvable and unbearable situation. As soon as I hear the phrase "Treading on eggshells" I know someone is in overwhelming, probably unmanageable difficulty. Even when she is asleep you are terrified about what she might do. But nothing you do at home like this will work. She will make sure of that. For whatever reason, causing you distress is making her feel a bit of relief at the moment. She probably can't help it, but all she can do is hurt you, and at least she isn't self-harming at the moment. But you must break this situation. Really it cannot go on. It will only get worse especially during lockdown and when the two of you live together without help.

Please phone for medical help now. Be direct and describe her situation without apology or excuse, that she won't take her medication, her history of self-harm, her mild bipolar, - she should see a Psychiatrist - and how you cannot reach her. Say how you feel too and don't blame yourself for it!

I am a Psychologist and worked in Hospitals and am also a Counselling Psychologist now retired.

Most of all I have my own personal experience. Albeit long ago of living with an adult who was like your daughter in many ways. For example he stepped over me and ignored me when I collapsed outside the bathroom and left a child to find me and call the Doctor. He then actually refused to let the Doctor send me to hospital because he did not want to look after the children.

Time to take positive action, my dear, help is on its way. Lockdown isn't going to end soon and may not bring the cure anyway. Make the phone call now please. Or make some notes first so you can refer to them if you get confused on the phone.

I will be thinking of you. Sending lots of love. This can be helped and resolved. You are strong, you can do this. Your daughter can be made well with the right help, which it is up to you to ask for. Lots of love. Elle x ???

Thank you all for your responses. I do feel you are on to something when you suggest autistic traits. She ticks a lot of boxes, possibly more than for bipolar. When she was small, I put her whispering down to shyness rather than anything else (my mistake, in hindsight) but no teachers picked up on anything except that she was quiet and clever. It took us 3 years to receive a referral to CAMHS, and a further 6 months before she got an appointment - by phone - by which time she'd decided nobody bar me gave a monkeys. Consequently, she wouldn't engage with the person she was allotted and only went for one face to face appointment. She didn't like it when he said I had done the right thing by asking for help for her because she didn't want anyone to know she needed it. You can lead a horse to water, kind of thing. She was very angry that it had taken so long and had given up on herself - it's heartbreaking to watch.

My GP said he thinks she is cyclothymic (mild bipolar in that she has depressive states but no mania, just occasional happier times) especially because my father truly was bipolar (he took his own life when I was a child - I remember the manic episodes very clearly and she doesn't have them). Her mood swings do run in a cycle though; I can map out when they're coming and mentally prepare. This lockdown one has been a doozy!

Strangely, she got up yesterday and was like a different person - she changed her bed, talked, smiled at me more than once, and made dinner for us both. I wonder how she'll be today.

I've googled MIND again (plus CAMHS - she has to self refer now because of her age) and looked at symptoms and indicators and agree that she fits the criteria in many ways. Now I'm wondering if she's more aspergers/autistic traits than bp.

Re uni, she knows there is support there but it has to be her who asks for it. As many of you have said, I am worried about her going and whether it's right for her, but it's her choice. She's to study psychology as she wants to be able to help others and got straight As at A level in that subject. I actually think this could help her on an awful lot of levels and maybe it will give her the nudge she needs to get help for herself. She's fascinated by how our brains work.

There's no way I would ever kick her out. Things are easier when I am at work in normal times (ie out of the house) as I have an escape from it for a while. We just need to get past lockdown without either of us saying or doing something intolerable. She needs to know she has a home and someone who loves her, regardless of how bad things get. Uni could be the making of her and is within 3 hours from here. If she needs me, I can get there (presuming it actually opens come September!)

It has helped a lot by reading that some of you have been in my position and that you've come out the other end, relatively unscathed. Parenting is hard! I'll keep telling myself that there's light at the end of the tunnel and go easy on both her and myself. We're not long after having the virus, as was pointed out, and she told me yesterday that teenagers like her are suffering strokes from it but she's not worried by that. (She obviously is!)

It's a rum old world, isn't it? back to all of you xx

there is too this weird thing that happens...possibly more with mothers and daughters because the bond is so strong that the need to separate becomes cruel. A kind of desire by the loved daughter to be hated so they can be separate. It sounds mad and is not consciously cruel but its effects can be. So distance yourself. She might just be clumsily telling you to back off. What a time to do it! 100% behind you. Time for your acting skills to come into play. Act disinterested even if you can't be. Good luck. and big hug.

I agree that it sounds very like high functioning autism. Obviously this cannot be diagnosed under lockdown. She might or might not have bi-polar, as others have indicated. However, she is 19 and an adult, so it will be up to her to seek help if she wants to. In the meantime, it's a very difficult situation for both of you, and as the stoics say, the only person you can change is yourself. Try not to see it as her 'not liking' you. She is frustrated and threatened. Let her get on with what she's comfortable with, unless it endangers or threatens you or anyone else, and try to engage in things which give you some satisfaction and comfort. Please don't try and get her to talk, it will be counter-productive. We all have to hope we'll be out of lockdown soon. Meanwhile, sending you hugs and .

I agree with other post it does sound like your daughter might be on the Autistic/ Asperger spectrum
I urge you to seek medical help (GP would be a start) just so you can find out the correct way to deal with this, as it is not the way you would deal with a bi polar person.
Please inform them of all her personality traits including her eating preferences. If it does turn out that she is on the AS you and her will get the coping strategies to deal with this and it could turn your lives around.

While I was writing my message Dorsetcupcake61 must have also been writing with far more detail. It is worth checking it out as your daughter will need to develop coping strategies, not easy but it can be done.

My first thought was possible undiagnosed autism/asperger's. Have quite a lot of family experience of autism, both child and adult, and her behaviours sound very familiar. Also girls often go undiagnosed as present very differently to boys and are known to mask a lot of their behaviours, therefore slipping through the net at school, etc. If she makes it to university, maybe someone there will pick up on the possibility of ASD, and that may lead to her getting the help she obviously needs x

Yup you look after yourself and give her space to grow up. She is no doubt struggling with being 19 and with hormones. Does she have any friends to chat to ? She won't be with you for ever so she will need her own friends. Of course she bites you right now - we all bite the one we love so flatter yourself when she bites you ! Counselling would help her hugely - see if you can get that in place now. If not she will need to talk to the student counsellor when she is at uni. Not much help right now I know. Hooray for gransnet to help you let off steam. You've done that. Now zip the lip and give the girl some space housework really doesn't matter one bit. Love does. Keep calm tough though that is.

Not much to add here other than it's clear your daughter has problems with her mental health and self esteem and you are bearing the brunt of this at the moment. Going University may help, assuming it is not going to be a first year of home studying. In which case she might prefer a gap year and to try and get a job. One of my daughter's was very difficult from age of 11 to 19 but she wasn't the only one with slovenly habits when she got to uni. She did become much more aware of the issues while at uni when sharing with others even worse than her, and emerged 3 years later as a lovely thoughtful person and is much tidier. I would recommend reading reliable resources on the impact of Circadian rhythms in terms of resetting the internal body clock, as longterm nocturnal habits combined with depression can be very damaging to the extent it becomes difficult to hold down a job. I experienced this myself when I was very depressed after my marriage broke down, and realising the importance of the rythyms help me recognise that some of what I was doing was making matters worse.

I feel for you, it must be awful. Have you a friend or relative you can phone, or text if she might hear? If not, a charity. I haven't read all the other comments yet but you need support for you. The teens are a difficult time and she's at an awkward age but you need to look after yourself, preferably without alienating her. You've worked, looked after her and successfully brought her up as a single parent - no mean feat. Dealing with her mental health issues must be exhausting with lockdown. Hopefully when this is over, she isn't living with you and she grows up a bit your relationship will improve. Good luck.

@ilovedragonflies.
Hi, you sound as if you are doing a great job.
Is your daughter on the autism spectrum as her behaviours, interactions, depression, self-harm and aggression would fit with how girls often present?
It sounds as though she is completely out of her comfort zone, hence her inability to relate to you when you were so unwell, her anxiety levels would be too high.
I hope I'm not giving you more to worry about but it could be an explanation. She could be assessed at Uni.
Good luck to you both.

Hi I loved dragonflies. My heart goes out to you. Along with other posters my first thought was autism/Aspergers. My youngest daughter was diagnosed with it at 11yrs old along with ADHD. Shes now 25. It's quite undiagnosed in girls. Their outlook on life and how they process things can make them appear very cruel and selfish. This can often be the case with those they are closest to. She doesnt hate you. Times of change used to make things much worse as fear and anxiety is overwhelming. That however means the pressure is awful for you and at times when you feel at your lowest they seem to be at their worst. When my daughter was your daughters age I seriously considered throwing her out I'd had enough! It's been a long journey,very long. Everyone is different but I used to calmly acknowledge that I could see she was worried etc but that didnt mean she could be rude to me. I often found she wouldnt get out of her comfort zone unless there was absolutely no choice. As I said it's been a long journey but she has a job,and is buying a flat with her fiance. She still has the odd meltdown and suffers from anxiety and depression but in whole has a successful life,one that I never imagined she would. Her fiance is lovely,I often wondered how he put up with her,then realised hes on the spectrum himself! Do a bit of background reading on the internet,theres loads of information. Above all be gentle with yourself,I hope you have friends and family that can give you emotional support as there were times when I felt like the worlds worst mother and wondered how I had got it so wrong. I hadn't but once I understood more about how her mind worked it helped. Sending virtual hugs and lots of love.????

I was a bit perplexed when the OP said she would not be able to continue writing on here for a while as her daughter would want to know what she was doing.

There is every reason why you should be able to communicate online whenever you want, without question. You both need to lead more independent lives- separate meals, rooms, online activities.

Undoubtedly your daughter has mental health problems. Even if she won't do anything about it, you could get good advice from Mind or one of the other MH organisations to support you during this difficult time.

My son had bi-polar and you’ve described exactly the way we lived during a bi-polar episode of which I unfortunately experienced many until his death. Can you comfortably contact your doctor to arrange a visit for your daughter? Under the circumstances she needs help even if she doesn’t want to accept it? I know how tough it is for you right now, every word spoken will push her buttons and the ensuing anger is so heartbreaking to a mother, she can’t help herself it’s the illness talking but you’re dealing with a young women who is very clever, has all day to analyse you and knows how to manipulate you even during a manic episode! Have you contact with a Mental Health team in your area? Until you can access some help the best course of action is to leave her alone, if she isn’t self harming and stays in bed all day, with the room in a mess, leave her there. Check on her every few hours with a cup of tea or a meal, as awful as the depressed state is you know where she is, she’s safe at home with you, the reverse is worse. Please try and remember you’ve loved her all her life and will continue to love her even when she’s extremely hurtful to you, you are her rock and her safe place. Please try and find the strength to cope. There are many websites that can offer advise, bi-polar uk being one of them but I think you need a mental health check for your daughter now and some help for you to help you cope. Sending you love, understanding and hugs, your doing the best that you can for your daughter, remember that XX