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Rachel Reeves said *WHAT*!

(91 Posts)
Rosie51 Fri 30-Jan-26 15:17:39

Grantanow I agree, MaizieD. Education like other public services is a public good from which we all benefit and it should be funded through general taxation as it once was with parental income assessment for maintenance grants to help poorer individuals.

with parental income assessment for maintenance grants to help poorer individuals is what I will argue against. If somebody's parents are unwilling to financially support them in further education, are you quite happy for that individual to be denied their opportunity? Basic maintenance grants should be available to all.

LemonJam Fri 30-Jan-26 15:15:51

I'm aware of the growing anger about "student loan interest payments" particularly. Martin Lewis was on TV talking to Victoria Derbyshire about this. He also spoke about Reeves decision to freeze of repayment thresholds" so a form of fiscal drag.

Reeves was on LBC yesterday talking on this matter. She actually said "Around half of people going to university today, but half don't. And it is not right that people who don't go to university are having to bear ALL the cost for others to do so".

Lewis didn't appear to be too incensed about that particular statement when put to him by VD and said that was a "separate argument for others to debate". His main concern was the change in contract terms affected by Reeves regarding freezing the repayment thresholds, and that a change of contract terms that "wasn't moral" as it is "fiscal drag".

MaizieD Fri 30-Jan-26 15:04:52

Oh, cross posted with Wyllow. Thanks for the link, Wyllow.

OK. Asking where the money is to come from is reasonable. I, of course, would say that despite the increased numbers of students, a means tested maintenance grant, as in the past, would not be impossible; the government doesn't have to wait for taxation to fund it. The grant could cover reasonable living expenses (rent and food at a predetermined rate) with a top up loan for books and necessary equipment, or more expensive accommodation if that's what the student wants.
Any loans to be administered by a not for profit organisation and interest rates to be fixed (like mortgages used to be) not upped at every opportunity.

The money the state would put in would be good for the economy as it would inevitably be spent in the area local to the university. Most of it would come back as tax.

Doodledog Fri 30-Jan-26 14:57:20

How can our society pay for all students whole expenses with current levels of university attendance - where's the money coming from?
Students bring a huge amount of money into local economies of university cities. Obviously the expansion of HE has increased the number of those cities.

Thy pay rent, spend on food, clothes, entertainment. They buy train tickets and use buses. They go out in the evenings and often keep the hospitality sector afloat. Many get involved in local projects of all kinds as part of their degrees. They contribute to research. They have jobs, and some will pay tax. When they graduate they often stay where they have studied, but wherever they live, they will, on average, earn a lot more than non-graduates and pay tax and NI on their earnings.

Staff definitely pay tax. They also live in university areas and buy or rent houses. They pay council tax, and also spend in local shops, restaurants and entertainment venues.

All of that is money in the economy, so where the money comes from.

MaizieD Fri 30-Jan-26 14:47:42

I saw posts about it on Bluesky so did a search, which came up with this

www.newsbreak.com/the-independent-517119/4466568522907-voices-everyone-with-a-brain-can-see-student-loans-are-unfair-except-the-chancellor

There was a clip of her saying it too. I gather it was part of a radio interview.

Wyllow3 Fri 30-Jan-26 14:46:00

This is about as full as you can get for what was just one statement at the end of many complex ones in a radio interview. This is a record of the actual interview.

www.lbc.co.uk/article/rachel-reeves-tells-lbc-student-loan-system-is-fair-amid-fury-as-graduates-rack-5HjdRQH_2/

Before we get on high horses in a massive way I do think we need much more thought into t system that is clearly not really working properly, for simple reason -

I agree in theory of course, who could not, that we pay for our next generation of workers who fully need the degree ...

but How can our society pay for all students whole expenses with current levels of university attendance - where's the money coming from?

Mamie Fri 30-Jan-26 14:36:46

Is there a link to a written statement MaizieD? It would be interesting to see the context.

MaizieD Fri 30-Jan-26 14:33:20

I know that not everyone pays back their student loan, but for those who achieve a salary above the cut off point the cost can be exorbitant. Such as this example posted on SM

A doctor whose student loan was £77,000+ (don't forget they are 'students' for longer than most graduates) now, after 3 years in post owes £106,000.

bsky.app/profile/peterstefanovic.bsky.social/post/3mdkb7pq2n22x

Our graduates and our universities' research in ,many fields have been highly regarded internationally. How can we continue to produce such high quality results if potential graduates fear they'll be burdened for years with huge debt? How can we train our much needed professionals in the caring disciplines?

I'm cheered to see so many agreeing here. I was furious when I read her statement grin

62Granny Fri 30-Jan-26 14:08:50

Plus she wouldn't have had to pay her student loan back, going by her age, so she was quite happy to accept purely state funded higher education.

Ilovecheese Fri 30-Jan-26 14:00:55

She is in the wrong party. She has never seemed to have real Labour values. She wanted to be "tougher than the Tories " several years ago. Now she seems to saying that there should be no welfare state.
She wants to take money away from disabled people on benefits, those who have the least, in order that those who have the most can keep all they have.

AGAA4 Fri 30-Jan-26 13:52:57

She is in the wrong party or perhaps shouldn't be in government at all.

GrannyGravy13 Fri 30-Jan-26 13:34:20

MaizeD 👏👏👏

Grantanow Fri 30-Jan-26 13:33:33

I agree, MaizieD. Education like other public services is a public good from which we all benefit and it should be funded through general taxation as it once was with parental income assessment for maintenance grants to help poorer individuals.

The argument that it benefits only those taking degrees is nonsense. We need surgeons and physicians, physicists, musicians and historians. The present system loads them with excessive debt for a lifetime. The government inflates money it collects at RPI which is higher than CPI which it uses to pay occupational pensions.

Of course a degree has led to higher income but there are plenty of nongraduates on high incomes - plumbers, footballers, etc.

RosiesMawagain Fri 30-Jan-26 13:26:44

Many agree for the reasons given here but also for her sheer flakiness.

Oreo Fri 30-Jan-26 13:21:27

It’s sheer peevishness as well as muddled headed thinking from her, and this is the woman that so many praise to the skies and some even want to be PM 😲

MaizieD Fri 30-Jan-26 13:16:45

LAst night I discovered that Rachel Reeves, I think in the context of being interviewed about student loans, had this to say:

"It is not right that people who don't go to university bear the cost for others to"

I couldn't believe my eyes when I read that.

Leaving aside the point which I have made over and over again, that taxation doesn't fund spending because:

1) all money comes from the state, either by way of its direct spending on goods and services or via commercial bank loans, made under licence from the state.

2) Spending comes before taxation as without state spending money there would be no money to tax back

So no-one but the state itself is bearing the cost of University education.

Reeves' statement seems to me to be to be contradicting the Labour principles behind the provision of 'public goods' one of which is universal education. But, worse than that, it is promoting an attitude which has no logic. There are lots of services provided by the state which not everyone benefits from; we don't all use the courts, we don't all make heavy demands on the NHS, some people pay for private health services and don't use it al all, we don't all have children in state schools (understand that I'm using 'we' to encompass the whole UK population) to name but a few examples.

Reeves' statement makes it seem reasonable that people should complain and feel resentful about the state financing services which they themselves don't use. Where on earth is her 'reasoning' meant to lead us?

Are we to make an annual declaration of the state financed services we do use and receive a tax rebate to cover the cost of services we don't use?

Is it permission to resent and demonise those who do make more use of state provision than we do? (and heaven knows, there's more than enough of that going on already)

Is it move towards the privatisation and marketisation of all services so we can choose and pay for whichever ones we need (if we can afford it)?

Of course, since Thatcher, there has been an ideological move towards privatisation of as much state provision as governments can get away with because that is a driving feature of the neoliberal economic strategy which has informed government policy since then. It is still ongoing. How many people are able to get NHS dental treatment? How many private care providers are there, the numbers increasing as councils become more and more cash strapped?

I realise that there are differences of opinion over the balance between private and state funded services but I have always regarded Labour as. at heart, being in favour of state provision to ensure that all citizens have access to essential services.

That Reeves' apparent defence of the student loans which impose a heavy long term burden on those aspiring to better themselves through a university education and who in part comprise the teachers, nurses and doctors who are vital to the health and wellbeing of the population really worries me.

But her implication that a university education is a personal indulgence which doesn't deserve the support of the government and state support can be justifiably resented by those who don't go to university utterly astounds and sickens me.

I don't think Reeves has a single vaguely left wing, Labour principled bone in her body, she is in the wrong party and is totally unsuitable for high office in a Labour government.