The US Election.

Yes, we belong, in this matter, with NATO and greater co-operation. the immediate matter is the Ukraine.

There's is another thread going atm about the US and the military as of course the US has thousands of soldiers in US military bases around the world: if these stop being NATO friendly, we need to look to our own resources, however difficult.

It seems clearer than for some time, that there are those who seek to weaken the Western Alliance by dismantling NATO, namely: Viktor Orban, Geert Wilders, Robert Fico, Alice Weidel , Meloni and Salvini, Lepen, Nigel Farage and more, collectively known as “Putin’s Useful Idiots”.

A divided Europe did not happen by chance- it was orchestrated from outside, by the like of Putin.

A new European defence strategy and military capability is required, and it must include GB, or we will stand more isolated and vulneable as ever. Liberal governments in Europe and Britain must unite and drive this initiative forward. It might be too late already.

I found this very relevant article

"The US election, Ukraine, and the meaning of peace"
ecfr.eu/article/the-us-election-ukraine-and-the-meaning-of-peace/

Its hard to see the "compromises" in it possible.

ronib because he still sees Russia as an Empire - and wants to rebuild it as such.

His plan for a new Russian Empire includes Ukraine (and Belarus it seems). He's even compared himself to Peter the Great.

This may interest you
www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/02/21/russia-annex-belarus-2030-leaked-documents-reveal/

Ladylfl did you listen to Patin’s speech at the outset of war? My understanding is that the encroachment of NATO on the border of Russia and within missile striking distance is complete anathema to Putin. Why else would Putin have started it?

ronib

Ukraine joining NATO will encourage Putin to continue the war David49

Surely it would discourage him? Putin is surrounded by NATO countries and probably doesn’t want to get into an even bigger spat.

Ukraine joining NATO will encourage Putin to continue the war David49

ronib

David Starkey pointed out that Russia has now regained all the territory it wants from Ukraine and that Russia is now fighting a very prolonged battle. There’s an assumption that the West is being damaged economically by dragging out this conflict. Certainly the Uk is currently suffering economically due to very high energy prices, and Russia is not folding over the cost of war.
If it takes President Trump to bring about a workable solution, what does it say about the failure of the rest of the world? Putin recognises bravery when he sees it. We don’t.

It would have been possible to push the Russians back if NATO had acted quickly because Russia was not prepared for a prolonged campaign. Now Russia is well entrenched, it’s going to be very costly to push them out now, I doubt Ukraine has the manpower to achieve victory on their own. Unless others are willing to put boots on the ground it’s not realistic to think of winning the war.

Putin has taken enough territory to claim victory, however much we dislike that, a ceasefire with conditions, Ukraine joining NATO is probably the best solution now.

It’s well known that Trump wants Europe to spend more on its own defence, in the UK we rely very heavily on US defence technology, in conjunction with EU we need to expand the defence capability

David Starkey pointed out that Russia has now regained all the territory it wants from Ukraine and that Russia is now fighting a very prolonged battle. There’s an assumption that the West is being damaged economically by dragging out this conflict. Certainly the Uk is currently suffering economically due to very high energy prices, and Russia is not folding over the cost of war.
If it takes President Trump to bring about a workable solution, what does it say about the failure of the rest of the world? Putin recognises bravery when he sees it. We don’t.

Trump will be for America and America only. God help the rest of us. Australia has a few American bases which may help in our relationship with them. Nearly all our trade seems to be with China not America now. If I was in Europe, particularly the UK, I would firm up ties and become a strong united front. Big,big mistake to secede with Brexit, especially now. I don’t think Trump will give a damn about historical ties, probably doesn’t even know what they are.

Babs03

Apparently Putin has praised Trump and says he is ready for dialogue.
Yep I bet he is.
This will be the double act from hell.

Yes - it out already.

www.npr.org/2024/11/07/nx-s1-5183184/russia-putin-ready-engage-trump

As predicted, anxieties about the future of Ukraine with Trump as POTUS are entirely justified

"He claimed that "Russia didn't ruin relations with the U.S. and is open to reviving them, but the ball is in the Americans' court."

Putin said he did not know what might come of Trump’s promise to negotiate a quick end to the war in Ukraine, suggesting the president-elect's proposals are worth studying.

Trump has criticized the scale of U.S. aid to Ukraine — which has surpassed $100 billion since Russia's invasion of Ukraine in 2022 — feeding fears in Kyiv and the European Union that Trump intends to impose peace largely on Moscow’s terms."

Some immigrants arrived here as children and may not even realise their status needed to be regularised.

Yes, and become illegal immigrants. Either this is OK, or it is not.

One of my cousins did the same, from Canada. She was working and earning a good wage- and was one of the very many who benefited from an Amnesty. Can't remember which year that was and under which President. She was working in the film industry and the Met Opera in NY.

Apparently Putin has praised Trump and says he is ready for dialogue.
Yep I bet he is.
This will be the double act from hell.

Mt61

Oh well that’s something that he had a visa

Presumably, as he had Canadian citizenship through his mother, he would have been granted a three year visa as a matter of routine.

It happens everywhere that people overstay the length of their visas.

Student visas are very strict and for the limited period of study. Those who stay beyond are illegals. Like many illegals, he did very well in the end, and somehow his situation was legalised. We don't know how, as there are no normal routes to do so. Many illegals do end up contributing hugely, one way or another. But illegal he was- there is no denying this.

What do you mean Oreo with your 'don't worry about 'us'. I do worry about us, me included, my OH included, my children and grandchildren, family and friends. US.

Mt61

Oh well that’s something that he had a visa

Fleurpepper

Fleurpepper is right in my opinion. It doesn’t matter that individual European countries have internal challenges, what matters is that we work together to preserve what we value - Europe is much closer to the values of the UK than anywhere else, and the USA really is as foreign a country as any.

Oh well that’s something that he had a visa

Germany's coalition has collapsed so they're not very united, most European countries are dealing with their own domestic issues and divisions.

Don’t worry about us Fleurpepper isolated economically and security wise we’ll muddle on as we always do.😁

Allira

Do you mean the UK or the whole of Europe, Fleurpepper?

I meant the UK- No longer part of EU, and without other true allies, so very isolated, economically and from the point of security. Trump does not give a monkey's about the UK- unless he, like Putin, XiPin and Kim Jung-un - want to further destabilise Europe and want to use the UK to help with that. He will use Farage, Meloni, Lepen, Oban and anyone else they can manipulate.

But there has never been a time where a united and strong Europe is vital to face the true difficulties and challenges of the current world.

Fleurpepper

Mt61

Fleurpepper, he’s probably put a lot of money into the USA, built businesses & employed an awful lot of people, he hasn’t just landed with a rucksack on his back.

Well he did- as a poor student, on a student visa. Many immigrants, including illegal ones, do contribute very much to society, working hard, contributing to the economy in so many ways with their labour, and paying taxes.

Illegal immigrants paying taxes, how do you work that one out. To pay taxes you need to be registered to work, NI number or whatever registration needed in the US. They get paid cash in hand, the tax man sees nothing of it. A bit of vat, whoopee do.

Yes, indeed.

Meantime, this is interesting - who voted for whom

www.facebook.com/share/p/14tAgL6p6L/

Fleurpepper

And never mind the economy, where does that leave us, in this present truly dangerous world, with regards to safety?

Where does the American election leave us? Or?