Israel, Hamas and now Hezbollah

Callistemon21 I am going to look for a banging head against a wall emoji as Glorianny only sees/reads what she wants to, and doesn’t seem to grasp what many of us on here are actually saying.

Glorianny

Hamas need to be wiped out, if they hide amongst Palestinian civilians and foreign national hostages it is Hamas which has the blood of innocents on their hands.
tickingbird

Can you date and time the above post you’ve attributed to me please as I don’t recognise it.

tickingbird

Glorianny

Hamas need to be wiped out, if they hide amongst Palestinian civilians and foreign national hostages it is Hamas which has the blood of innocents on their hands.
tickingbird

Can you date and time the above post you’ve attributed to me please as I don’t recognise it.

Whoever said it, it seems straightforward- Hamas is to blame, not the innocent Palestinians.

We can weep for all the innocents caught up in this dreadful conflict but we are helpless.
The UN should not apportion blame but strive for a peaceful settlement.

GrannyGravy13

Glorianny you are exceptionally adept at taking one paragraph/sentence out of a post which does not give the full context.

I said that the Palestinian electorate voted for Hamas in 2006/7 and haven’t had an election since.

If you vote in a terrorist organisation then it stands to reason that there was a large proportion of the electorate that agree with some if not all of their policies. One of which is to eliminate all Jews from the planet.

There are no doubt many Hamas sympathisers in both Gaza and the West Bank (as there were IRA sympathisers in Ireland during the troubles and no doubt still a few today)

I have repeatedly posted that I feel empathy and sorrow for the innocent Palestinians, they will be the major casualties in this war. Hamas and its growing army of supporters will either be hiding in the vast tunnel networks or hiding amongst innocent women and children.

GrannyGravy13 you are great at providing facts without any explanation of the issues behind what happened.
The reasons for there being no elections are in fact very complex and cannot be blamed entirely on Hamas. They include Israel's reluctance to allow Palestinians in East Jerusalem to vote and the position of the President a member of the PLO. An election was scheduled for 2021 with Hamas' support. Most Palestinians had registered to vote. It didn't happen but Hamas had agreed to it and were not responsible for its cancellation.

Gaza is so densely populated because Israel has closed the borders. And an Israeli general has stated that they intend to make the country uninhabitable. That isn't targeting Hamas.

Callistemon21

tickingbird

Glorianny

Hamas need to be wiped out, if they hide amongst Palestinian civilians and foreign national hostages it is Hamas which has the blood of innocents on their hands.
tickingbird

Can you date and time the above post you’ve attributed to me please as I don’t recognise it.

Whoever said it, it seems straightforward- Hamas is to blame, not the innocent Palestinians.

We can weep for all the innocents caught up in this dreadful conflict but we are helpless.
The UN should not apportion blame but strive for a peaceful settlement.

Totally agree that UN should be negotiating not apportioning blame.

A Government minister on the news this morning said that the U.K. Government is negotiating with the Emir of Qatar regarding getting aid into Gaza. Whilst it’s common knowledge that the head honchos of Hamas are currently residing (hiding in luxury) in Qatar.

Negotiations are the way forward, Hamas has a trump card of hostages and using innocent civilians as human shields whilst Israel has the weaponry.

Glorianny past issues are not going to solve the current situation, it’s time to look forward.

Apparently there is to be a COBRA meeting today and the subject will be the British Israelis who are being held as hostages and how to get them out. Is this even possible? I can’t imagine how this could happen.

maddyone

Apparently there is to be a COBRA meeting today and the subject will be the British Israelis who are being held as hostages and how to get them out. Is this even possible? I can’t imagine how this could happen.

This is why the PM is constantly in touch with the Emir of Qatar he may (definitely has) influence over the Hamas leaders currently living (hiding) there

Even if you completely ignore the power dynamics and abuses which led to the Hamas attack and just look impartially at the raw data, it’s an easily quantifiable fact that what Israel has done since October 7 is worse than what Hamas did on October 7. While there are many here who don’t agree, it’s not seriously debatable. The only way to make it seem otherwise would be to see Palestinian lives as worth less than Israeli lives, which is not a position that deserves to be taken seriously.

Dear God. Again we are in so much trouble.

GrannyGravy13

Glorianny past issues are not going to solve the current situation, it’s time to look forward.

But you can’t look forward without learning from the mistakes of the past. If humankind did learn from history we wouldn’t be in the mess we’re in now .

bmacca

Even if you completely ignore the power dynamics and abuses which led to the Hamas attack and just look impartially at the raw data, it’s an easily quantifiable fact that what Israel has done since October 7 is worse than what Hamas did on October 7. While there are many here who don’t agree, it’s not seriously debatable. The only way to make it seem otherwise would be to see Palestinian lives as worth less than Israeli lives, which is not a position that deserves to be taken seriously.

I think many are just keeping quiet. Most know very few facts about the situation. I've put this link elsewhere but part of it is very interesting regarding this topic as they discuss global perceptions of Israel-Gaza.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiGIyt7u26E

I also listened to this and I've posted info about the radio 4 programme but sometimes I feel people are so entrenched in their opinions that they don't want information, they just want to keep saying the same things over and over again. What I respect about RS and AC is they are of the centre but not the same and they have guests who are allowed to say what they think, are asked direct questions, challenged when necessary but not "interviewed" in the way that stops the interviewee getting his POV over. I thought the interview with Husam Zumlot, the Palestinian Ambassador to the UK was very interesting. I thoroughly recommend all the podcasts that have included something about this dreadful conflict.

I find it quite difficult as I have said elsewhere to view Campbell as balanced (and I am of the centre) his behaviour on Twitter (not particularly on this subject) is frequently tribal and aggressive. He is as entrenched as anyone. That is not to say the podcast isnt useful.

They are foxie and it separates the generations so much. Not by the thinking of the young, but by the stick in mud attitudes of the older generations.

Perhaps there should be a thread for recommendations?

I agree with you about Campbell Galaxy.

Glorianny
Hamas need to be wiped out, if they hide amongst Palestinian civilians and foreign national hostages it is Hamas which has the blood of innocents on their hands.
tickingbird

GranyGravy13. 23/10 08:13 NOT ME!

If you’re going to be quoting from earlier in the thread then do it properly and don’t put my name to posts that aren’t mine.

Nothing wrong with GG13’s post but I knew immediately it wasn’t one of mine,

The Palestinians are ultimately to blame by electing Hamas to represent them, then once allowed power they took over and crushed any opposition within Gaza, the same with the Brownshirts in 1930s Germany

Egypt had the same problem with Muslim Brotherhood, they got elected then pursued an extremist agenda and had to be removed by the army within a couple of years.

I don’t know what the answer is going to be, Hamas cannot be allowed to continue because they don’t care how many die in pursuit of their aim to destroy Israel.

Galaxy

I find it quite difficult as I have said elsewhere to view Campbell as balanced (and I am of the centre) his behaviour on Twitter (not particularly on this subject) is frequently tribal and aggressive. He is as entrenched as anyone. That is not to say the podcast isnt useful.

I watched it and it was Stewart who had most to say about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

More children have died since 7/10 then the total mortality that resulted in 9/11.

This is going to be known as the children’s war - the world should hang their head in shame at allowing such a thing to happen.

Hamas was elected because at that time they were considered less corrupt. No election followed and nearly 20 years later they remain in power.
There is no Palestinian army
So no way to get rid of them,

Whitewavemark2

More children have died since 7/10 then the total mortality that resulted in 9/11.

This is going to be known as the children’s war - the world should hang their head in shame at allowing such a thing to happen.

Certainly a good proportion of children were murdered by hamas on the 7th.
Any numbers given out by hamas are highly suspect.We won’t play Top Trumps tho, as various posters have said.
What precisely the rest of the world should hang their heads in shame for is a mystery.Countries with some power can make recommendations but none of them can actively interfere, it’s a delicate and diplomatic affair.

It’s inevitable that many children will be killed because I believe I am right that nearly half the population of Gaza are under 15.

silverlining48

Hamas was elected because at that time they were considered less corrupt. No election followed and nearly 20 years later they remain in power.
There is no Palestinian army
So no way to get rid of them,

Less corrupt? Just twice as brutal.

So, should we have bombed Ireland to smithereens when the IRA were bombing England?