Who hates the NHS

Hetty58

Allsorts, the decline of the NHS is due to long term severe underfunding - not 'people coming into the country'. Think about the staff, as without them it would simply collapse. Many, perhaps most, are from abroad.

Yes, it is true that many staff come from abroad, but if you visit an A&E on a weekend night you will see the proportion of people coming in for treatment who have also recently come from abroad, some of whom resort to verbally abusing the staff so that they can be seen first. Also parents who don't speak English bringing in young children who simply have mild colds that could be seen by a GP or health visitor.
Last time we saw knife wounds and several girls so drunk that they had passed out. And not one of these patients was of UK origin. Please don't regard this as racism it's just that in this area we are flooded with recent immigrants who behave badly and expect an instant service from A&E because that is what they believe they can get in the UK, along with free housing and benefits.

I don’t hate the NHS but I sure don’t love it either!
It’s been getting worse for a very long time in all sorts of ways.
Fail to see why I should be grateful, having paid NI for many years.

I think the NHS is a wonderful service. Yes we do pay for it during our working lives but its reassuring to know it's there when needed. I recently had a heart attack. Ambulance arrived within 10 minutes of me phoning. It was a 3 man crew (actually 3 ladies). The paramedic on board was brilliant and helped to reduce my anxiety with her humor. Arrived at A & E Scunthorpe Hospital. Received attention immediately, hooked up to heart monitor and received constant attention. My heart rate was reduced by a clever little trick by a doctor. Once stable I was transferred to a ward. The nurses and staff on that ward (16) were brilliant. I saw what they had to deal with and they carried out the work with a sense of pride, despite how unreasonable and abusive some patients were. They treated all of us with courtesy and respect. The food was great, always tasty and the puddings delicious. Doctors were first rate and explained exactly what was going on with my heart and related issues. They all deserve a higher rate of pay that is related to the hard and important work that they do.

Love or hate doesn’t really come into. Finances certainly do. Medicine has seen vast improvements over the years, cost of drugs…need to be expensive sometimes to fund future research, cost of new machines, technology driven. There is an awful lot of waste though and extra layers of admin. IT waste, stationery waste, personnel. Need more at the ‘coal face’.

I’m grateful fir it always been there when I needed it. I’ve waited a while for an ear operation but I don’t mind I can wait.

I think we’re incredibly lucky to have the NHS. If you’re dissatisfied you can always pay privately or take out an expensive insurance scheme. Trouble is, if your condition is life threatening you’ll probably be referred back to the NHS.

The nhs saved my life on 2 occasions, I’m can’t fault them but I hate the dilatory office staff who are so po faced when speaking to them, have no coordination with each other and blame computers for errors such as 2 appointments same day 20 miles apart etc
My other bugbear is the two tier system . My elderly mother had to pay 600 to get decent hearing aids without waiting months. My daughter paid 38.00 per ear for syringing. I have to pay goodness knows what for a mouth scan as I can’t tolerate having a goey mixture in my mouth to have dentures. I can’t help this, also I have been told if I need any more dental appointments I must pay, apparently you can only have so many in a year. Why do you have to pay for stuff that should be free and the poorest get the bargain basement service.

Anybody who needs emergency care for serious illness or injury in the UK will need the NHS, as private hospitals don't have A&E departments (please correct me if I'm wrong). The late Prince Philip was transferred from a private hospital to an NHS one for his final illness; the King, when Prince of Wales, went to the A&E of an NHS hospital to have a fractured wrist treated; Boris Johnson was treated for Covid in an NHS hospital. It doesn't matter who you are.

I don't hate the NHS, gave my DH 16 years life afrer his surgery for cancer, will say though even back then it was a case of not addressing what could be the cause of his illness square on for 2 years by then it had progressed. Now, having cared for him prior to being admitted to a hospice ward for pain management assessment (he never came home) the amalgamation of NHS with social care is a farce. Nothing is joined up other than department names. The only part of palliative care at home that worked was the Drs who visited twice in 2 months to check how he was doing. They at least adjusted medication. As for OT, not worth the bother, care assistants, what are they, never saw one. Even phone contact info was a laugh. Phoned the OT who had assessed for basic stuff, none of which fitted or worked. One piece of equipment for the bed was a two man job. 2 vans and drivers would be sent at 8 am and that was the only time two would be available. My DH was on such a drug regime he needed about 2 hours for one drug after another to start working so he could move, never mind get out of bed. There was no way I was going to wake him about 5 am if he was asleep. No other time could be accommodated. Equipment never fitted. Phoned OT to tell her situation. Message on system was that she was on holiday and wouldn't be available until a date in July. I was phoning early April. Long holiday for some. Had to phone 999 one morning explaining it was not a life and death situation but I could not lift my DH to sit him up to then lift him to toilet. 3 staff turned up, did what was necessary but were appalled that no care was given. They even noticed and dealt with a burn I had on my arm. I knew it should have been seen in A&E when I did it but I didn't have 3 or 4 hours spare to sit in the.hospital. The only outcome of joining services is to me that powers at be feel money will be saved. Certainly will as long as there isn't an increase in managers as I hired equipment, paid for a carer for two sessions when I had dentist appointments, managed all the medication collection and administration. Did all care for DH. I am not impressed with the supposedly joined up service. In my view a person needing care at home should have one case worker who should liaise with all necessary parts of the service. We have an NHS and Social Care Service with people who want to do a good job. We also have a huge lack of funding

I hate it and I love. My children were all born at home with the help of lovely NHS midwives and my GP and it used to give us the service we came to expect BUT not now. I was in hospital for two weeks recently and during that time the doctors could not get a diagnosis of what was wrong with me. After discharge (still waiting for a scan which never happened) I used my insurance my old company had taken out for me. Surprise surprise, stage 3 cancer. What would have happened if I hadn't gone private? Stage 4 and then death? During my Chemo treatment for the cancer I was admitted to hospital with coronavirus and sepsis. Spent a week in hospital and on the last two days, they had no supplies of the anti-biotic that I needed!!! They hadn't been ordered..... Absolute shambles but there are still some 'proper' doctors and nurses in the NHS who are so kind and caring and efficient but there are also some who are not!!! Striking nurses and doctors - disgraceful. There that's opened up a can of worms. .

I hate it and I love it. My children were all born at home with the help of lovely NHS midwives and my GP and it used to give us the service we came to expect BUT not now. I was in hospital for two weeks recently and during that time the doctors could not get a diagnosis of what was wrong with me. After discharge (still waiting for a scan which never happened) I used my insurance my old company had taken out for me. Surprise surprise, stage 3 cancer. What would have happened if I hadn't gone private? Stage 4 and then death? During my Chemo treatment for the cancer I was admitted to hospital with coronavirus and sepsis. Spent a week in hospital and on the last two days, they had no supplies of the anti-biotic that I needed!!! They hadn't been ordered..... Absolute shambles but there are still some 'proper' doctors and nurses in the NHS who are so kind and caring and efficient but there are also some who are not!!! Striking nurses and doctors - disgraceful. There that's opened up a can of worms. .

Love the idea of it
Hate the reality

Kate1949

And from a close relative who works there, less waste, expensive conferences with lunches, layers of management etc.

I totally agree, there are certain people who are simply on a gravy train. A friend came across a bunch of managers travelling 200 miles by train to London for a meeting, enjoying first class. He was not impressed. This is wholly wasteful of precious resources.
From my years as frontline staff I can tell you, it's not the nurses, midwives and health visitors etc. - those at the bedside, doing the drug rounds, dressings, birth visit or clinics - that get any perks. They're lucky to get a meal break!
The other thing which needs to stop is the ridiculously sad amount of waste and theft by patients, of anything that isn't nailed down. I worked in a hospital which was newly opened. Every cupboard in 4 postnatal wards was stocked with laundry and baby clothes. In a very short time we were struggling to find a pillow or a cot sheet. They got lifted by patients and their relatives by the bagful. This was despite the NHS stamp across the fabric. Then we got complaints for having to use paper baby nighties and sheets.
We are very fortunate to have the NHS, I admit mistakes happen, I have suffered from the result of one, but I am still alive because of a fabulous cardiology team of doctors, expert nurses, radiologists, physios and wonderful support staff. I don't do love /hate but I am so indebted to them all.

Amalegra,

I just want to tell you that your post on the NHS gives us a very real account of the NHS. You are spot on in your assessment! Thank you.

Just had a hip replacement on the NHS and they were wonderful. My life is transformed. However there have been times when I haven't felt that the NHS was quite so terrific eg a couple of weeks ago the physio I saw post op seemed to spend an awful lot of time examining my non operated leg despite the fact I said several times it was my right hip I had done plus he had the notes in front of him. Eventually had to say (as nicely as possible) "it was the right hip". Before my op the nurse at the clinic got my hips muddled up (which was a bit concerning! ), twice I have been waiting for appointments only to discover I had been "missed out" and once I waited months on a physio app only to discover the GP had forgotten to refer me! So the system isn't perfect and they do make some dreadful blunders but I wouldn't be without them.

Hety58 .., why is it so that money has to be used as a sweetener . Pay them more to get a better service !! Money should not speak volumes to get a kind word or a better service ….

At the moment that is not true. Medicare covers everyone over 62/65/67 (depending on age at retirement, it has gone up several times) and private Medigap insurance is available to cover the 20% of costs Medicare does not pay. Since "Obamacare" went into effect Insurance companies can not refuse coverage for any reason. Life Insurance is not usually available to people over 80, however, nor is insurance to cover nursing home costs. Medicare covers only the first 90 days in a nursing home. Coverage for care at home is woefully inadequate. There is another government program called Medicaid that will cover nursing home or sometimes home care when practically all savings have been exhausted.
Plenty of Medical mistakes are made here too, and duplications and money wasting are rife. The US is rated at the rock bottom of all the developed countries for it's medical care.

I remember good old Nye Bevan introducing free healthcare so I'm grateful. I have paid once for a private health op because I had to and know how much it cost and the following check ups.

Firstly, I don’t think the use of the words love and hate are useful in discussion about the NHS, but unfortunately journalists love triggering people’s emotions with them.
It is impossible to argue that all is well with the NHS, there has not been a coherent long term plan for at least a couple of decades. Decisions are made for immediate political reasons instead. A case in point was our lack of preparedness for covid, given that an in depth study (I think in 2016) gave recommendations on what measures would be essential in the event of a pandemic, but was never implemented due to costs.
We spend less per capita on health and social care than most other developed countries, but expect the NHS to be the best in the world.
I am a massive supporter of the concept of the NHS, but it needs to be given direction by health and social care experts, not politicians and the insidious privatisation must stop.

Anyone who hates the NHS should try living in the USA see how they manage.
My husbands family cannot believe that we do not pay for anything.
My husband's life was saved by a pancreas, kidney transplant 12 years ago. It enabled him to see our son married and our granddaughter born.
Unfortunately he had 2 strokes in January this year and has remained in hospital where they managed to save him from sepsis 4 times, covid and c.diff.
On June 16th he was finally allowed to come home for palliative care as they cannot do anything more to help him. Again the NHS is fully funding him and we have carers helping us, plus some one living in. The doctor comes out when we call and the district nurse comes daily.
Where else in the world would this happen and where would we get this kind of help.

Mayal Yes, the US health system is dreadful, but between our sytem and theirs there are probably 20 or 30 alternatives.

The alternative to the NHS is not the US.
Here is a link to a ranking of countries with public health services www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/slideshows/countries-with-the-most-well-developed-public-health-care-system Denmark and five other, mainly European countries are rated better than the UK.

M0nica

Mayal Yes, the US health system is dreadful, but between our sytem and theirs there are probably 20 or 30 alternatives.

The alternative to the NHS is not the US.
Here is a link to a ranking of countries with public health services www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/slideshows/countries-with-the-most-well-developed-public-health-care-system Denmark and five other, mainly European countries are rated better than the UK.

And the difference between those higher rated European countries and the UK is... what?

I think you need to go into the detail of the analysis to find that but I seem to remember we were marked down because of limitations on access to services - waiting lists etc and health outcomes, in other words you are not as likely to recover as well from any illness as you would in other countries on the list.

Maya1

Anyone who hates the NHS should try living in the USA see how they manage.
My husbands family cannot believe that we do not pay for anything.
My husband's life was saved by a pancreas, kidney transplant 12 years ago. It enabled him to see our son married and our granddaughter born.
Unfortunately he had 2 strokes in January this year and has remained in hospital where they managed to save him from sepsis 4 times, covid and c.diff.
On June 16th he was finally allowed to come home for palliative care as they cannot do anything more to help him. Again the NHS is fully funding him and we have carers helping us, plus some one living in. The doctor comes out when we call and the district nurse comes daily.
Where else in the world would this happen and where would we get this kind of help.

Maya1 Anyone who hates the NHS should try living in the USA see how they manage.

Not been my brother's experience living in NYC since Uni, 40 years I believe. Effective insurance covering everything he required. They've decent insurance, some people just choose no particpation.

Upon retirement USA have a health scheme - works for most, but not those who choose not to properly pay the insurance.

Harvard (arguably best Uni in USA) quote:

"According to the Harvard Business Review, hiring more doctors does not solve the problem, although physician shortage remains a constant threat. The main issue involves the following:
A different perspective on solving the shortage crisis
Uneven care. Health consumers are receiving different levels of care determined not by a standardized level of quality but by their location, condition, or insurance plan. More rural areas may not have enough physicians, while urban areas may have more than needed.
Lack of insurance coverage. We discussed earlier in this article that many health consumers can’t afford the high cost of primary care due to high insurance costs.
Off-time. Many disciplines only serve patients on weekdays during regular office hours, with no availability on nights and weekends.
Inflexibility. Physician assistants and nurse practitioners can deliver primary care with the same quality as physicians but at a lower cost, yet they are underutilized.
Limited access. Some health consumers may be turned away from practices that limit access if they have Medicare or Medicaid. These patients aren’t as profitable a venture for providers.
Lack of efficiency. Compliance-related activities such as clinical documentation and electronic medical record administration limit a physician’s ability to offer more care."

-Adapted and revised from the Harvard Business Review

As I noted earlier my brother had great care, as did we when on holiday or working with/for him in USA. Access is far easier than here.