Is there still a Conservative Party?

There is definitely a Conservative Party, just as there is a Labour Party and Liberal Democrat Party along with numerous others.

Political Parties like the U.K. are constantly evolving and they are learning a very hard lesson that you cannot please all of the people all of the time.

GrannyGravy13

There is definitely a Conservative Party, just as there is a Labour Party and Liberal Democrat Party along with numerous others.

Political Parties like the U.K. are constantly evolving and they are learning a very hard lesson that you cannot please all of the people all of the time.

Put it another way, GG13. Is what is called 'The Conservative Party' the same as the party you have supported over the years?

Do you not think that parties should have core principles that shouldn't change?

Iam64

ronib

MaizieD well is Gnet a safe space for ‘actual Tories’? Does Gnet encourage or welcome discussion from ‘actual anyone who isn’t left wing’?
However that’s not the topic of the thread…..

You’re having a laugh

It's ronib's modus operandi.

MaizieD well not necessarily. I have become aware that some people are a bit hesitant to contribute to discussions….. not that I am 😤

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

There is definitely a Conservative Party, just as there is a Labour Party and Liberal Democrat Party along with numerous others.

Political Parties like the U.K. are constantly evolving and they are learning a very hard lesson that you cannot please all of the people all of the time.

Put it another way, GG13. Is what is called 'The Conservative Party' the same as the party you have supported over the years?

Do you not think that parties should have core principles that shouldn't change?

I agree with GrannyGravy13, I think all political parties do evolve over time, and go through dynamic and dire periods too. Core principles morph slowly don’t they, rather than change dramatically?

To anyone who doesn’t feel the Labour Party is left wing enough, look if Labour voters don’t vote cos they don’t like Keir Starmer then the Conservatives will get in yet again next election, is this what you want? FGS just give Starmer a chance.

^ Core principles morph slowly don’t they, rather than change dramatically?^

On those grounds alone would you say that the tory party of today is anything like the tory party of a decade ago?

I can't see the tories winning the next election, Oreo, but I can see tactical voting and more wins for the Lib Dems. Starmer might have to be a bit more conciliating about co-operating with other parties.

MaizieD

^ Core principles morph slowly don’t they, rather than change dramatically?^

On those grounds alone would you say that the tory party of today is anything like the tory party of a decade ago?

I think it depends what you define the Tory party as MaizieD. There’s a clear divide in the party at the moment, and the right wing have assumed precedence in the last few parliaments since 2010. Lots of their MPs are uncomfortable/disillusioned however with the direction, as are many voters. It’s a crossroads I think, who knows what will happen next - but my money would be on the moderates winning out eventually.

Oh how I wish that the extreme right of Conservative and the extreme left of Labour would just leave their respective parties and set up new ones. They could even use moderate names to describe themselves in order to disguise their true personae.. e.g. The Slightly Fascist Party (SFP), and the Almost Stalinist Party (ASP). I don't feel it would fool anyone, but their core voters could still kid themselves that they are in favour of democracy and freedom. Perhaps we would then get what I suspect many have been crying out for for decades.. a Government not handicapped by dogma, which could then tread a centrist path which would be welcomed by many, and which would actually allow them to just get on with the business of truly serving the people. We can all dream..

NanaDana I second your dream…

A true party of the centre, that’s what I would like. Dream on Maddy.

But isn’t that what the LibDems have always been?

MayBee70

But isn’t that what the LibDems have always been?

Therein lies the problem, I have no idea what the Lib Dem’s stand for.

GrannyGravy13

MayBee70

But isn’t that what the LibDems have always been?

Therein lies the problem, I have no idea what the Lib Dem’s stand for.

Well, that’s the problem isn’t it. People want things to be black or white but most things in life have grey areas. To me, the LibDems combine Conservative economics with Labours social values. Isn’t that what a middle of the road party should be? I personally think that that’s where Keir is taking the Labour Party. I’m not sure that the working class vote for a party that stands for them because most working class people have higher aspirations. The people that need the most help are the unemployed, the sick. I don’t see how Conservative policy of lowering tax helps them. The guy that helps maintain my house laughs at people like me who he calls champagne socialists. The Conservative Party could have had Rory Stewart as leader and even I would have voted for him.

The centre is moving to the right though, so who could agree what a centre party would look like.

To me, the LibDems combine Conservative economics with Labours social values. Isn’t that what a middle of the road party should be?

I'm afraid that 'conservatives economics' is what is making the UK poorer and more unequal.

When I think of Vince Cable selling off Royal Mail for a pittance; in fact when I think of it being sold at all, it makes me very worried about a LibDem version of economics.

Though, TBH, Labour is no better in its economic thought.

While ever the parties are hidebound by the 'household economy' myth, nothing is going to improve.

"While ever the parties are hidebound by the 'household economy' myth, nothing is going to improve."

You are absolutely right about that MaizieD both the main parties peddle that line.

Katie59

“they became the SELFSERVATIVES ,only interested in themselves and their like “

Of course the majority of voters are self serving, they will vote for what benefits them, only a minority vote for principles.

The Tory party has a large block of right wing extremists that holds the moderates to ransom, current problems stem from the ERG forcing Cameron to commit to a Brexit referendum.
They would never have got the majority they have without the chaos around leaving the EU.

"Right wing extremists", oh dear. Pathetic.

Freya5

Katie59

“they became the SELFSERVATIVES ,only interested in themselves and their like “

Of course the majority of voters are self serving, they will vote for what benefits them, only a minority vote for principles.

The Tory party has a large block of right wing extremists that holds the moderates to ransom, current problems stem from the ERG forcing Cameron to commit to a Brexit referendum.
They would never have got the majority they have without the chaos around leaving the EU.

"Right wing extremists", oh dear. Pathetic.

I think that even ex Conservative MP’s are saying that the Party is now controlled by the far right. This isn’t scaremongering.

MayBee70

Freya5

Katie59

“they became the SELFSERVATIVES ,only interested in themselves and their like “

Of course the majority of voters are self serving, they will vote for what benefits them, only a minority vote for principles.

The Tory party has a large block of right wing extremists that holds the moderates to ransom, current problems stem from the ERG forcing Cameron to commit to a Brexit referendum.
They would never have got the majority they have without the chaos around leaving the EU.

"Right wing extremists", oh dear. Pathetic.

I think that even ex Conservative MP’s are saying that the Party is now controlled by the far right. This isn’t scaremongering.

Time for the stragglers to wake up and smell the coffee.
www.opendemocracy.net/en/far-right-mainstream-conspiracy-theory-uk/

Freya5

Katie59

“they became the SELFSERVATIVES ,only interested in themselves and their like “

Of course the majority of voters are self serving, they will vote for what benefits them, only a minority vote for principles.

The Tory party has a large block of right wing extremists that holds the moderates to ransom, current problems stem from the ERG forcing Cameron to commit to a Brexit referendum.
They would never have got the majority they have without the chaos around leaving the EU.

"Right wing extremists", oh dear. Pathetic.

Why is it pathetic? It seems an accurate description of some of the most recent Conservative actions and beliefs of some of the party's MPs.

How would you describe the lurch to the right and away from the consensus of public opinion?

Maybee - I'm proud to be called a champagne socialist. I want everyone to have the best things in life. Happy to settle for Cava for everyone if that's more affordable.

Thanks Casdon for the link. It confirms what many of us feel, that the right is on the rise. The current crop of influential Tory mp’s and ministers are many miles away from people like Ken Clarke and Rory Stewart for example.
I’m a Starmer supporter, didn’t respect or admire Corbyn as leader tho of course the core principles were good. I’m not in the least surprised Labour lost so badly but look where we are now.
Public services including our nhs devastated. Here’s hoping the LP does well enough, that tactical voting and co-operation between Labour, LibDem, green etc get these barstewards out next year.

Chocolatelovinggran

Maybee - I'm proud to be called a champagne socialist. I want everyone to have the best things in life. Happy to settle for Cava for everyone if that's more affordable.

Same here. I’ve worked hard, got savings and if I want to share a bottle of champagne as we toast my lovely husband, we will