Bullying, harassment, London Fire Brigade

Having served in the RAF in the seventies I did not see much of this kind of behaviour. It’s a shock to me that people like this still exist. I do think uniformed services do attract a macho mentality, even amongst women. We seventies women were more than capable of batting back the odd stupid comment from the men. I did know one man who was promoted through the officer ranks despite being known to be an abuser though. Just one known to me though. On the whole I’d like to think we’d have moved on as a society, but this report is damming.

If reporting and getting a complaint dealt with happens when you are still working in that `team` how does that work. I wouldn`t be surprised if a lot more goes on that is not reported.
I think men feel its just a laugh and they are `entitled` to behave in such a horrible way.

Nanatoone, I wonder if it’s worse than our experience? My father was a Royal Marine, joined the police, had a very successful career. He discouraged 17 year old me from applying but told me 10 years later he’d been wrong, the best sergeant he’d ever had was a women. They’d positively changed the force ( were talking late 70’s)
I don’t like celeb culture - are women being put down in more unpleasant wsys

I felt really sad about the whole story. Firemen to me were ‘hero types’.
Seems they have feet of clay.

Most people have feet of clay.
Fireman are everyday heroes, just think of what they do and what they have to see.

There are different ways of being a hero. A real hero doesn't have to put there down to be confident as a white male!

We have to bring our boys differently. And create a political culture where it is expected that we "call out" abuse - not dismiss with "wokeism"

What happened in the report IS going on in pockets all over the country. time to call a halt. I am heartened by the fact the now government ministers are being "called out" for bullying too. (and I include women bullies, btw, its just that in our society it is currently male on female and PoC.)

All cultures partly at least depend on the behaviour of those on the top layers..

Correcting first sentence, "A real hero doesn't have to put women and minorities down to be confident as a white male!

Iam the police were also disproportionately represented as you say.
But this was the 1990s/2000s, not the 1970s. In one case it was clear a serving officer had been "tipped off" about his (also serving) wife by a serving (and senior) colleague who she has gone to for assistance. They were definitely unhappy about arresting/charging the perpetrators.
Services looked after their own - unless they were escaping abuse it seemed to me.

All this said, I have wonderd if firemen (and other servicemen) are considered to be "rescuers" and possibly attract more women who are vulnerable or suffer from low self worth. I've no accademic evidence for this. I've had a quick look on Google Scholar just now. There is nothing obvious there and am conscious that I don't want to stray into victim-blaming because what better way to lower your self worth than being told you are worthless.

Can I just give a shoot-out to those truly excellent officers who did outstanding work supporting the victims/survivors of abuse.
Let's not tar everyone.

Shoot-out... No. *shout-out!

I worked closely with police from 1981- 2011, joint training, joint investigations. Ok some of the work involved specialist police teams but my wider ecperience was largely positive. Just as it was with other agencies, largely excellent dedicated staff, the occasional individual who would have been better on a window cleaning round (no disrespect window cleaners)

NotSpaghetti

Can I just give a shoot-out to those truly excellent officers who did outstanding work supporting the victims/survivors of abuse.
Let's not tar everyone.

Of course - I've been getting out of an abusive relationship this year and had to call the police round twice. Both times were lovely young men, and "aware", clearly had good training and they mentioned our force as being very ++ in this field. they weren't good enough to really take it through, but caring listeners.

It makes me aware things can change: but all the more aware of how misuse of the power they have can be very, very dangerous.

LFB now in “an enhanced level of monitoring “

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-63969181

The new met commissioner is quoted as saying there are many misogynist, racist, criminal officers he wants to, but can’t sack. Let’s hope he tackles that. How come Cressida Dick didn’t seem to notice

Good question.
and I dont have an answer, for she must have seen it at work.
There will always be a small number of women who have been tough enough to "make it to the top" but don't as it were take on board the concerns of other women once they've got there. Feel they have to be one of the boys? Beyond that I'm guessing.

Possibly she did, but couldn't sack them either?

Without people speaking out against them formally and complaining in a way that allows the procedures to end in sacking, it's impossible to get rid of people. Sometimes it can be done with some sort of "golden goodbye" but probably the police can't just pay people off... and really they shouldn't have to.

I have seen this happen in Universities and the staff just go elsewhere.

As has been pointed out, it's often when large groups of men get together some of them behave very badly and as no-one wants to be the one to speak up, it's easier to join in (or remain quiet) than to call it out.

lovebeigecardigans1955 -yes, and it does take a lot of inner strength to call out your "own" group behaving badly.

The fears you'll be isolated - won't be believed - so powerful, you can end up thinking "its my fault for not coping". thats why the black guy in that Fire Service took his own life rather than complain..