Stop ignoring the 50 million

Six adults in my close family. Five voted Leave, one voted Remain. All professional people. All but one with degrees. No one older than 65. Leave voters all under the age of 34.

These specious Remainer arguments about age and wisdom of Leave voters are getting very tedious. Grasping at straws or what?

Meant the Leave voters apart from me and OH were UNDER the age of 34.

M0nica - thank you for your very good and sensible post of 17.55.14.

I wish it could be stuck at the top of every GN Brexit post yet to come!

Varian is sounding desperate now. We HAVE to move on. The parliamentary bickering and Remainer attempts to prevent Brexit are extremely damaging and now serving no purpose other than to stall the inevitable.

That may be the Remainer plan? Create more havoc and upset businesses whilst we can?

My Remainer friends feel that we really do have to leave and then, from a level playing field where neither side has to make weighted concessions, we work with the EU to strike a trade deal beneficial to them as well as us. I know of people in France and Germany who want just that to happen too.

I cannot see the point of any of the niggling about the different demographics of leavers and remainers. Just because the majority of people in an age group voted one way, doesn't mean all did. Many highly educated older people voted leave, many poorly educated older people voted Remain, but broadly speaking the older people and less educated people of all ages voted Leave. Remainers were broadly speaking better educated and younger.

So what?

manage to survive without funding from the EU?

EllanVannain, you are aware that we pay billions and billions of our taxpayers pounds into the EU every single year....billions and billions?

The EU funding you think we'll miss is just a fraction of the amount returned to us that we pay into Brussels.

When we leave, we keep our billions and billions of UK pounds, not just for one year,, but forever more.

Why does anyone think that, after discovering just how appalling the consequenses of brexit might be, do the mega rich backers of brexit still campaign so strongly against giving the British people a Final Say????

Just a wild guess-

"The amendment introduces rules that help address hybrid mismatches between the EU and third countries. ... The newly agreed rules aim to prevent such arrangements and prevent the erosion of taxable bases in the EU countries. The implementation date for the amended directive is set for 1 January 2020."

www.consilium.europa.eu/en/policies/anti-tax-avoidance-package/

Those of us who are not brexit funders with billions stashed away in offshore funds to avoid tax need not worry that brexit might be stopped.

And how many of us on here varian have "billions stashed away in offshore funds to avoid tax"?

If the referendum was only advisory why did Parliament trigger Article 50?

Why in the pamphlet issued by DC's government at considerable expense to the tax payer tell us that this was a once in a life time opportunity and the result would be implemented?

DC himself promised that the result would be implemented but the self opinionated, arrogant fool had no back up plan if the vote was to leave.

That isn't the fault of those who voted leave, it was DC's fault and the fact that after more than 3 years we are still in the EU is because of our inept self serving MP's.

So, we have another referendum and the majority vote leave, what then? Parliament is tying our hands to prevent us leaving with no deal. We can't get a deal other than the one TM negotiated; what then?

Parliament voted against it 3 times. Parliament doesn't want us to leave with no deal but wont accept the deal on offer, the deal that the EU has stipulated is the only deal.

If it wasn't so tragic, it would be funny.

I agee with you Smileless "That isn't the fault of those who voted leave, it was DC's fault"

I also agree that it was wrong for parliament to trigger Article 50 when the brexiters did not even have the semblance of a plan.

The Liberal Democrats and some other MPs did not vote to trigger Article 50.

Since then I think that our MPs have woken up to the potential disaster that is brexit and so have done their best to protect the nation by scrutinising the government's plans,
which is, I suspect, why parliament has been prorogued.

But they did trigger Article 50 didn't they and you can't just blame the brexiters for not having a plan, blame Parliament for not ensuring there was a plan before pulling the trigger.

Those two words in your post are so important varian; potential disaster.

Population 67,601,153
To leave vote 17,410,742
To remain 16,141,241
If remainers hadn't fought tooth and nail and thwarted every which way we would be out by now

.......and how many angels can balance on the head of a pin.

We only have the political leaders that we do because people vote for them and don't make enough noise when they screw up.

We're in the situation we are because politicians of both the biggest parties have been trying to keep their seats, despite what they personally believe would be good for the country.

It's sad that those who have gone out on a limb and not followed the party line will probably lose their seats.

Yes, sad for them maybe!

Of course, things are never that simple.

The number of persons not on the electoral register was calculated by subtracting the size of the electorate as of 22 June 2016, from the ONS record of total UK population published on 26 February 2016.

A person may not be on the register by their own choice, or due to ineligibility such as not yet being old enough, being in prison, or not possessing UK citizenship.

EU Citizens living in the UK were ineligible unless they were from Malta, Cyprus, or the Republic of Ireland.

Members of the House of Lords are usually ineligible to vote at UK General Elections, but were allowed to vote in the EU Referendum.

British citizens who had lived abroad for more than 15 years were included in the 'Did not vote' category, as they are on the electoral register but were not permitted to vote in the referendum (nor are they allowed to vote in other UK elections).

In total, the electoral commission reported that the size of the electorate on referendum day was 46,500,001, and 72.1 per cent of that turned out to vote.

This chart is not an entirely convincing argument against Leave or Remain, but it does illustrate that 'the 52 per cent' and 'the 48 per cent' actually constitute much smaller proportions of the UK population than the figure might imply.

www.indy100.com/article/brexit-leave-remain-52-48-per-cent-voter-turnout-electoral-register-charts-7399226

The only way this is going to end is with another referendum. OK all the leavers will shout we had one, leave means leave. But this is such a huge matter that just to make sure have another one.

I think a General Election would sort out the parliamentarian wheat from the chaff.

Wonder why Lib Dems, Labour etc are running scared of that - another chance to put it to the people?

Makes you wonder.

Day6 They aren't running scared, they just are not going to let Boris set the date.
Also, if it happens before Oct.31st it will be dominated by Brexit. It shouldn't be much later than that.

In some ways, this thread is a bit refreshing as it shows that most people are not obsessed with Brexit and realise that the sky will not fall in either way.

Day6, it's because they want the Tories to own the failure not them. If there is a GE and Labour or Lib Dems win, or there is a coalition of those two and the ensuing Brexit brought catastrophic results, e.g. extreme poverty to the already poor in this country, or sick people who died because they couldn't obtain necessary medication, who would then get the blame for what the Tories set us up for?

Not only that, but some people will vote for non-Brexit issues. If the idea is to find out what people think about Brexit, the only way is to have a referendum.

Here here growstuff but if a general election comes before a referendum all Remainers must support the Liberal Democrats, the strongest party of Remain.

I keep reading that Labour want to deselect Margaret Beckett. It's like the Conservatives getting rid of Ken Clarke. Not only that but she's the one that put forward Corbyn's name in the poll for the leadership .

….blame Parliament for not ensuring there was a plan before pulling the trigger. No blame vote leave for not having a plan for leaving; just a lot of empty promises.

It still mystifies me that Leavers are so vehemently resistant to a second referendum? surely if they have the strength of their convictions they will be confident of winning a second time?

As a leaver humptydumpty it is not my lack of conviction that leave would win that I am opposed to a second referendum, it's because we were told by DC it was a once in a life time opportunity to make our voices heard.

I believed that was the case and I'm sure you did too.

If I'm not going to be listened too first time around, why on earth should I, or you for that matter, believe that I'll be listened too second time around.

We won first time around. If you'd won, would you want a second referendum?