What will go first?

Jalima1108 The NUT on Academies-^What is the NUT’s view on Academy schools?^

The NUT opposes Academy status. It believes that Academies have a damaging impact on children teachers and the whole community. These are summarised below along with the NUT’s alternative approach to Academies:

Why the NUT opposes the Academies initiative

Reason one: Academies hand over state schools to sponsors

Creating Academies in place of community or foundation schools involves the transfer of publicly funded assets to unaccountable sponsoring bodies. Academy sponsors are given control of a modern independent school set up as a company limited by guarantee. Sponsors receive the entire school budget directly from the Government. Academies on the scale proposed by the Government have the effect of transferring billions of pounds worth of publicly funded assets in the form of buildings and land into the hands of private sponsors.
I can post a link to the paper if you want-it has to be downloaded

Sorry - I did say some

It's one of the reasons teachers dislike Academies on the whole.
Do you have a link to back that up please trisher?

Of course, some teachers like working in Academies because the pay may be better, the opportunities for attending courses to further their knowledge may be greater and they find themselves working with colleagues who may be more enthusiastic than some in state secondary schools.

No, I can't provide a link because that is anecdotal evidence. I did some some.

As you say trisher a way round legislation so nothing to do with this thread.

It is interesting that some have said laws will be changed but no one has been able to give an example of when it has happened previously. Therefore I think it very unlikely.

Some Academies do, some don't there is detailed advice about the contracts and conditions they offer on the NUT website, Better teachers have always been paid more as have teachers with more responsibilities. The problem is that by changing the pay conditions you could find schools in very poor areas where staff are hard to retain anyway losing their staff to better paid jobs in easier schools. It isn't simple.But it is an area where a way has been found round a piece of legislation.

trisher so academies do pay people equally? Is that what you are saying? Assuming that was in answer to my question about which employment laws have been scrapped I'm not sure that applies as it seems to me it was to do with teachers contracts not the law of the land but maybe I misunderstand. I think on balance it is probably a good thing if teachers who are so good they are in demand are paid more than those not so good or that those in areas like maths or science where scarcity probably has something to do with where people with those degrees can get well paid jobs should be paid more. However this is rather off thread isn't it?

Nonnie it was the 1944 act which brought in the Burnham Scale The NUT. records
the groundbreaking 1944 Act brought in free secondary education for all, raised the school leaving age to 15 from 1947 (with a further rise to 16 at an unspecified date), and set up not a comprehensive but a tripartite system of grammar, secondary modern and technical schools.

The union welcomed the Act, which also made it statutory for LEAs to pay the Burnham–agreed rates of pay.

In addition women teachers would no longer be forced to leave their jobs when they married, and in 1946 a Royal Commission recommended equal pay for women teachers
When I said one of the best I meant in relation to other jobs. Academies of course are not LEA run and hence not subject to the Act.
The Department for Education (DfE) states that it is "the responsibility" of the academy to agree levels of the pay with its employees.
It's one of the reasons teachers dislike Academies on the whole.

"too many women take advantage of their employers and their co-workers."
"Beau" Do you object to women having babies, or just object to the babies being looked after by their mothers for their first months of life?

Pogs I mentioned that in another thread (re Barnier's encouraging remark.)
re the topic - I've just read elsewhere that for british retirees living in France their health cover by the british NHS (form S1) will stop at the end of March 2019.
However they would be able to join the french health system which involves a small payment.

trisher I had no idea there had been a law change which allowed academies to not pay equal pay. I didn't hear that one on radio 4. teaching which had one of the best equal pay policies right across the country but which was destroyed by the introduction of Academies. In fact I don't even understand one of the best as surely equal is equal and has no variations?

They need and want us, no surprise really.

Did anybody catch the latest news conference from Barnier and Raab a few minutes ago? It was on Sky News but the BBC did not show it live.

It is looking a little more promising when Barnier says :

The EU is prepared to build an ambitious partnership with the Uniuted Kingdom "

They covered various subjects and whatever side of the argument you fall on it may hold some answers to the questions that have been ongoing , daily for 2 years now.

Well you could begin with the introduction of zero hours contracts Nonniewhich effectively brought into mainstream employment measures which the unions had abolished for Dock workers in the 1947, when they were guaranteed regular employment (I know it wasn't a 'law" but they are great at finding loopholes!
Or you could look at teaching which had one of the best equal pay policies right across the country but which was destroyed by the introduction of Academies.
softly,softly catchee monkey.

I'm not a Gran yet but amongst my sons' friends those in public sector jobs seem to divi up the parental leave with their wives, taking 6 months each.

I can tell you what I would like to see scrapped when we are no longer tied by the idiotic Human Rights legislation.

At the moment we have had unbelievable situations where foreign criminals( who are here illegally in many cases of course) can't be deported back to their own countries because the prison cells are 'too small' or that they would be treated 'too harshly' there.

Then there was that insane case of some violent foreigner who had been escorted to the airport to fly him back home, only for him to pretend that he was a homosexual, and his 'human rights' would be violated in his country.
He is still here of course, and there have been many more cases like this.

So as regards getting out of the daft human rights rules, bring it on.

Please will someone tell me which laws which gave improved employment rights or human rights have ever been removed in the UK. I just wonder if doing so is political suicide.

Beau None of these things will be scrapped But I would also like to scrap some of the maternity leave regulations as too many women take advantage of their employers and their co-workers.
Mmm could you possily be hoping for what you say won't happen?

Perhaps it isn't Jalima1108 but I am very conscious that my life has been underpinned by a belief in human rights and that seeing these established has made life better for many people, but I also know how fragile they are. It isn't "negativity" to think that they may be easily lost. And if it is 'bad' for me it will be so much worse for those who lose their rights.
"Failing to plan is planning to fail!"

I'm optimistic too - none of those things will be scrapped, what utter nonsense, yet again. Although personally I would scrap the paternity leave - I worked at a FTSE 100 company and none of the young men there wanted to take all that time off work - they made no secret of the fact that they were glad to get back to work asap. I would also like to scrap some of the maternity leave regulations as too many women take advantage of their employers and their co-workers.

To sit and wait is to accept that you don't care and they don't matter.

No, it isn't. It's accepting that worrying is not going to help anyone or anything.

Please don't make yourself ill, trisher
Stress over things that may never happen is not good for you.

I do mean that.

I really have to admire your optimism, Jalima
Thanks MaizieD

I have faced many obstacles in my life and still try to remain optimistic.
Negativity is bad for mental and physical health.

I agree about the working time directive and it has just ocured to me that agency workers will probably lose the rights to holidays they have now. I think the future for low pay workers and zero hours contract people could be very dark indeed.

I saw Tony Benn many years ago with his production about the history of human rights.
Is that the same Tony Benn who passionately argued against the EU?
Or was there another politician of the same name?

I am hoping that anything that goes will swiftly be replaced by as good if not better legislation.

I really have to admire your optimism, Jalima