Channel 4 Dispatches - Momentum Party

Sorry posted too soon
You cannot objectively assume what is in any politicians mind. You only have what they say and in particular what they do as evidence.

Being naive and over enthusiastic is a by product of being young, all of us went through that stage, and it should as I suggested be encouraged. Maturity will come all too soon as we have all found out.

I am not sure that you are entirely correct when you say that parties should reflect the views of voters. Impossible!! What does happen is that they the parties set out their stall in the manifesto. This will chime with many people to a lesser or greater degree, and will attract votes accordingly.

UKIP may have won some votes but it has singularly failed to attract any active or extra political attention with new members signing up in their droves. It is politics by headline, and the media is willing to aid this.

All votes count surely? We are all to a degree observers, but we are also directly affected by what governments choose to do, even if it simply means living in a culturally impoverished country. You may not personally be affected by governmental policies, but you will live in a country where its citizens may feel unequal or very satisfied with their life.

You have to ask yourself why they distrust Labour. Of course by far the largest reply will be the economy. I see this as largely down to two factors.
Labour has singularly failed to robustly defend its record and the 2008 banking debacle.
The second factor is of course the hostile press and media. Traditionally, There is little active political participation in this country, and we know fromwhere most people get their misinformation.
The phenomenon of Corbyn and the enlarged membership shows that there is indeed enthusiasm for political participation and this should be applauded rather than denigrated. It shows a level of healthy democracy.

Actually, Joe Soap from Accrington DOES matter - as do all the other Joe Soaps across the country, because they're the ones who will vote.

I want to see a strong government, which overturns the damage the Tories have done, but my vote doesn't count. Therefore, it doesn't really matter what I think.

If there's going to be a Labour government (or even a left coalition), I won't have anything to do with it. It will be up to the voters in constituencies where Labour stands a chance. I look at the situation as a hands off, third party observer.

London is different from most of the rest of the country, but the Labour heartlands have been in the former industrial North. I keep seeing interviews and reports that these people feel alienated by Labour and are turning to Ukip. Arron Banks has repeatedly said that these constituencies are on his hitlist. If people who have voted Labour in the past are not happy, it's a concern to me.

Labour needs to gain just over 100 seats in the next election. If you look at the places they need to win, these are generally 'middle England' towns - ordinary people with ordinary jobs, etc, but crucially they distrust Labour. Many of them are the 'squeezed middle' who fear that extra spending will come out of their pockets, unless Labour is serious about cracking down on tax loopholes and raising taxes for the wealthiest. I don't believe that's as easy as waving a magic wand.

I do agree with most of Corbyn's policies. I don't have much time for the man himself. I wonder what he would have thought of Gordon Brown's 'bigoted woman' - I suspect he would have agreed and he can't afford to dismiss people whose views don't coincide with his own principles. I firmly believe that the Labour Party needs to win and it needs to represent the views of voters, rather than expecting voters to agree with its views. Corbyn needs to get a grip on some of his supporters, because they're doing a great deal of damage on social media with their naive and over-enthusiastic support.

I getting completely confused here.

I thought mandates were composed of policies and that was,what people voted for.
So Daphne I think that the ordinary punter can only get their opinions from the media and we know that is 78% hostile to Corbyn and largely hostile to any labour bod.
Policies however are absolutely essential because without them it all makes no sense.

What I am interested in is whether Corbyn developing policies are anathema to you and why or is it the person you object to?
I think many of us can agree that he is not the most charismatic of leaders, but given that so often people have verbalise that they dislike the cult of personality etc etc and that policies are what matters, then if the Plp got behind him andsupported the policies big time it would all flow from there and personality would be a minor factor.

Not all his policies. And I do not want a Militant as party leader

I think you'll find most labour MPs do want his policies, roses.
In fact when the debates were on the sentence most often spoken by Owen Smith was, "I agree with Jeremy."

Even Annie agrees with his policies.

Seems that is because they are all blairites , the fact he left the house in 2007 is conveniently forgotten , there have been two elections since then

Never mind Joe Soap from Accrington...... Most Labour MP's don't want Corbyn and his policies either, and they are hardly ill-educated or ill-informed on politics.

Policies matter greatly to me but I have to trust the person who promises to deliver them, I do not trust Corbyn

There was a programme with interviews from Accrington earlier this evening. Those people interviewed didn't really know much about policies, but criticised Corbyn as a person. I don't know if that's typical, but I suspect it might be. Whitewave, policies might be important to you and me, but I suspect many people don't know much about them. They want the basic things - healthcare, decent schools, affordable housing, jobs and they resent people they see as not making an effort (thank Tory propaganda and the media for that one) and they're not keen on immigrants. Nobody mentioned defence or foreign policy. It wasn't mentioned, but it's obvious from comments on other sites that people don't understand the difference between a household and a national budget.

Sadly, I don't think the policies do matter to many people. They seem more concerned by having confidence in a leader. I think that's why Thatcher and Blair lasted as long as they did.

whitewave, I cannot support Corbyn, I don't trust him so how can I believe which of his policies are truely his policies ,

trisher if you are interested in what anyone on what you class as the right thinks I suggest you ask them

That is what I am really really interested in knowing, because policies are the bedrock of ant political party.

Can anyone from the Labour Party who would prefer a different leader to Corbyn please explain the differences in the policies each side would support?

This in my view is the most important issue, so I so hope someone can compare and contrast the two.

Why when I ask about policies do you fall back on calling Corbyn names Anniebach I am really interested to know what the right wing of the Labour party want to do. Surely if you knocked on my door canvassing you would have a reply ready.

Oh, good to know you and durhamjen haven't fallen out, Annie. It's sometimes hard to tell...

DJ and I have not fallen out, our posts show how the Labour party is truely divided.

the far left and left of centre at their best - or worse ?

IF...???

If dj and Anniebach fall out, there is no hope for the Labour Party.

by asking if I would canvas for any particular party you are realy asking me how I will vote, not the correct way to garner votes, a cavasser asks for support not asks - who are you voting for. Being polite may have become alien to some

I was asking Annie if she would go out and knock on doors for the Labour party, knowing he was still the leader. Of course he would still be leader of the opposition. I don't think paarties change in between elections.

"Corbyn will still be leader" true, but will still be leader of the opposition.

I am a European, Annie. I am not telling Welsh people they can't talk about other parts of the UK or the EU.

Who is a little Englander?
You are getting pathetic now, Annie.

What are you going to do if there is a snap election next year? Corbyn will still be leader.

Are you a closet Labour member, obie?
You seem to know a lot about the party.

English Corbyn supporter new rule

Strange new rules. You are allowed to talk of England, but I am not allowed to talk of Wales.
Some of my family live there. They would be most upset if I wasn't allowed to talk to them about politics.