Tia

I'm interested in the book grrrranny mentioned. The lower working classes are certainly demonised - by just about everybody else in society.

Every group needs it's scapegoats!

grrrranny it sounds as though another thread will be a good idea. Sorry to follow off topic.

So terrible about Tia. Poor child, and family. I hope the press are kind to them.

Not the brightest idea in the world to leave a 37 year old man alone with a 12 year old girl overnight

Two more arrests have been reported - a 46-year-old woman - presumably the grandmother and a 39-year-old man.

Tia looked a very pretty girl. Am I alone in thinking that the photo of her wearing make-up [and looking older than twelve] was unsettling? Perhaps I'm being old fashioned.

soop, I have a feeling that we are having to revise our ideas of what a twelve-year-old looks like.

The grandmother is said to have been held as a murder suspect. The man is apparently the next door neighbour.

Annobel

Our ideas on how Tia could have been kept safe are with hindsight.

Most of the men I know could be safely left with a girl of 12, even if she did wear makeup.

As for this family being dysfunctional, I wonder how many of us and our families would come out whiter than white if exposed to intense (and hostile) media scrutiny.

There is always an exception to the rule

I was discussing this case with my brother - he said it made him feel like locking his 3 grand-daughters in a room and standing guard with a shotgun! At the very least he was going to go and give them all a big hug.

This is a very sad case and in time when all the details are revealed no doubt there will be an enquiry into how this was allowed to happen which will result in a statement saying "lessons have been learned" and "we must never let this happen again"

Nope petallus my family wouldn't come out whiter than white and things that we have just accepted or live with as being ok would look decidedly dysfunctional.

A blow to the grandmother image as well if this latest arrest has substance.

Completely agree petallus and grrrranny - there are quite a few things we 'live with' in my family that would not look good under the media spotlight. Whatever has happened, Tia was just a child who deserved to be protected by those closest to her. It's no use speculating on exactly what has happened, it will all come out in time.

Well I don't agree at all. Are we supposed to feel guilty because some low life has been accused of murdering a twelve year old girl and we mustn't be too judgemental because we might be harbouring a few skeletons in our own cupboards? If you haven't committed a crime, anything that is exposed under media scrutiny soon becomes yesterday's news and I don't feel any sympathy for a family who should have been looking after the poor child.

Latest news suggests Tia's granny has been arrested and charged with murder while her lover has been charged with helping to conceal the crime.

Right on the nail , Merlotgran ,

No, the next door neighbour has been charged with assisting an offender - presumably he was the one who gave the false sighting of Tia walking to the bus stop. The grandmother and Stuart Hazell are both murder suspects.

I don't feel at all guilty merlotgran I just recognise that I don't have a perfect family and I haven't always done the right thing. Completely different from committing a crime or failing to protect a child in my care. All I would say is that we don't know exactly what has happened and we can't assume that the whole family is guilty at this stage. I hope I have compassion for the rest.

Such a terrible thing to have happened and why did the police take so long to find her body? Anyway, what comes to mind is the old saying "Innocent until proven guilty?" - think we should all remember that because at the end of the day until 12 "good men and true" (and women, of course!) come to a verdict we will not know who is guilty.

Is anyone else gobsmacked by this?
This goes beyond all laws of nature. Grandmothers do not hurt their grandchildren!
I am sorry if this sounds emotional, but I am shocked.

There's usually a lot of hysteria surrounding cases like this and rumours abound. We don't know for sure yet that the grandmother is guilty so I won't be gobsmacked until it is proven that she is.

We can't draw conclusions, and I hope the press won't be all over the grandmother to the extent that there won't be a fair trial.

I wouldn't have thought she was the instigator. Probably got dragged into it after the event. As people have said, we don't know and probably won't until the trial (which could be a long time away).

It is shocking glitabo but tragically, some mothers (and grandmothers) are unable to prioritise the welfare and protection of their children and grandchildren because they are so needy, vulnerable and/or damaged themselves.

Soop, I entirely agree about the make-up and the photo made me uneasy too. I thought the whole story of going off to buy new shoes did not have the to g ring of truth.
Perhaps we should revise our opinions of what 12 year-olds should look like. I used to see a lot of children in my work and it always made me feel uneasy when girls as young as 9 or 10 came in wearing eye make up, lipstick and clothes more appropriate for a 19 year old going out clubbing. Parents these days seem to want their children to grow up as fast as possible.
Having said that, is there any evidence that the early sexualisation of children has increased the incidence of these crimes? Sexual abuse and murder of children have always been present in our society, but before the advent of mass media, there was very little awareness.