Statins please share your experience/knowledge

I've actually read the Aseem Malhotra's (the cardiologist) book. He actually has very little experience, but know how to make money. Very few other cardiologists have much respect for him. I read the book and it went straight in the bin when I'd finished. His stats (where they existed) were extremely suspect and it was obvious that he was cherry picking. His aim was (is) to promote his diet, which differs very little from a standard "healthy diet".

I wouldn't dispute that a healthier lifestyle at population level would result in fewer cardiac events. However, about 75% of over 60 year olds are overweight are obese; we don't eat enough fibre, but too eat too much processed food; we don't move around enough. If somebody were to wave a magic wand and get everybody moving and eating healthily and reducing stress, the need for medical intervention would be reduced, but that's not realistic. Even then, some people would die earlier than others for unknown reasons. It's all about risk and if people want to take that risk and follow dodgy writers, that's up to them.

growstuff

Skye17

fancyflowers

*11:16Farzanah

The Telegraph articles are behind a paywall. You are clutching at straws I’m afraid. There are plenty of positive articles in Telegraph for statins if you search, but bear in mind these articles are written by journalists.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4513492/

I wouldn't call this clutching at straws.

No, I wouldn’t either. Evidently there are different opinions among researchers.

//The role of blood cholesterol levels in coronary heart disease (CHD) and the true effect of cholesterol-lowering statin drugs are debatable. In particular, whether statins actually decrease cardiac mortality and increase life expectancy is controversial… We conclude that the expectation that CHD could be prevented or eliminated by simply reducing cholesterol appears unfounded.//

I resisted taking statins for years because I don't like putting drugs inside my body. I have never been overweight and had a reasonably healthy lifestyle. Like so many, I thought I was invincible. I was told my risk of having a cardiac event, but my risk of not having one was higher, so I refused statins.

That all changed in October 2017, when I had a heart attack. I was lucky because an ambulance got me to Papworth within a few minutes and I had a stent fitted, but I am under no illusions that if the heart attack had happened elsewhere, I could be dead.

I have taken statins (and a whole load of other drugs) since then. I've actually felt fitter than I have for years. I'm T2 diabetic and my Hba1c levels are monitored. There has been no increase since 2017, so I'll carry on taking the pills!

I'm not telling anyone not to take statins, growstuff. Obviously that is up to the individual, and I hope you will stay fit.

I'm just saying that medical opinions do differ on the risks and benefits of statins. They also differ on the relationship between cholesterol and arterial disease.

E g, Dr Sarah Myhill writes, 'a high cholesterol may be a symptom of arterial disease rather than the cause. It is only when LDL becomes oxidised into lipid peroxides as a result of poor antioxidant status that it may be directly damaging to arteries... There is no doubt some people do have genetically high levels of LDL cholesterol (the "bad" one) and do suffer excessively from arterial disease, but this should only occur where there is poor antioxidant status.'
drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Cholesterol_-_the_whys_and_wherefores

I actually agree with her about this:

"There is a general belief that a high fat diet results in high cholesterol, which results in arterial and heart disease. The evidence to support this theory is poor - the two largest culprits in arterial disease are refined carbohydrates (including sugars and fruit sugars) and high blood pressure from adrenalin - the stress hormone. The commonest cause of stress is rapidly falling levels of blood sugar, but any stress - lack of sleep, financial, emotional stress will also result in adrenalin."

Unfortunately, she then started mentioning antioxidants and pushing her agenda. She's a naturopath, so I'm afraid i Don't trust her objectivity. Not only that, but she's not a scientist and seems to have a hazy understanding of research and what actually happens in the body.

Well this thread is prescient! My lovely female GP rang me today. To chat about my recent bloods and to discuss how I am doing. “I know there’s a lot of stress at home”. My cholesterol has jumped from 5.5 to 7.8. But then she said “look I could throw pills at you but how about you try addressing diet/exercise first and we will retest you in 6 months?” Sounds sensible to me, I didn’t feel panicked as it wasn’t 2 months and just hope tweaking my choices shows an improvement. I’m 70 btw.

Mind you ‘reducing stress’ isn’t really an option, sadly. That’s a concern of and in itself - healthwise for my heart - in more ways than one.
😢

This is the British Heart Foundation's opinion of the study behind the Telegraph article:

www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/heart-matters-magazine/news/behind-the-headlines/cholesterol-and-statins

It points out that two of the writers are not impartial, including Aseem Malhotra.

I've been taking Atorvastatin 40mg for at least 15 years and can honestly say that I haven't noticed any side-effects. I have Hashimoto's disease (causing an underactive thyroid) and high cholestorol is one of the resulting complications. It also can exacerbate depression, which I have suffered from in the past and have taken medication for, but luckily I am not having to take anti-depressants at the moment.

I am happy to take the advice of my GP, whom I trust, and reduce the risks of stroke/heart problems, but if I had noticed any side-effects from taking my current statin then I would ask if there were alternatives I could try.

Sorry to ask for a recap, Nanna and Skye, but I don’t understand the connection between statins and Co Q 10. Are you saying that if we’re on statins we shouldn’t take a C Q 10
supplement?

growstuff

I actually agree with her about this:

"There is a general belief that a high fat diet results in high cholesterol, which results in arterial and heart disease. The evidence to support this theory is poor - the two largest culprits in arterial disease are refined carbohydrates (including sugars and fruit sugars) and high blood pressure from adrenalin - the stress hormone. The commonest cause of stress is rapidly falling levels of blood sugar, but any stress - lack of sleep, financial, emotional stress will also result in adrenalin."

Unfortunately, she then started mentioning antioxidants and pushing her agenda. She's a naturopath, so I'm afraid i Don't trust her objectivity. Not only that, but she's not a scientist and seems to have a hazy understanding of research and what actually happens in the body.

Dr Myhill has a first class honours degree in medicine and has worked as a GP. Her website is there to provide free information to the public and is not pushing an agenda.

She has coauthored three papers in peer-reviewed medical journals, so I don’t think her understanding of research is too hazy. She has also written seven books, one of which won an award from the British Medical Association.

winterwhite

Sorry to ask for a recap, Nanna and Skye, but I don’t understand the connection between statins and Co Q 10. Are you saying that if we’re on statins we shouldn’t take a C Q 10
supplement?

Hi winterwhite. No, I didn’t mean that - I don’t know if that’s OK or not. I was quoting Dr Myhill, who says that statins stop an important process in the body, which involves coenzyme Q10, from working properly. This means that mitochondria (energy-producing structures in cells) don’t work at normal speed, but slowly. This affects many body systems.

Dr Myhill quotes this paper, which states that:

//The statin medications routinely result in lower coenzyme Q10 levels in the serum. Some studies have also shown reduction of coenzyme Q10 in muscle tissue. Such enzyme Q10 deficiency maybe one mechanism for statin induced myopathies [muscle diseases].//
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3096178/

In other words, statins cause low levels of coenzyme Q10 in the blood and in muscles, and this may cause muscle disorders.

I’d ask your GP about whether you can take coenzyme Q10 with statins.

Urmstongran

Well this thread is prescient! My lovely female GP rang me today. To chat about my recent bloods and to discuss how I am doing. “I know there’s a lot of stress at home”. My cholesterol has jumped from 5.5 to 7.8. But then she said “look I could throw pills at you but how about you try addressing diet/exercise first and we will retest you in 6 months?” Sounds sensible to me, I didn’t feel panicked as it wasn’t 2 months and just hope tweaking my choices shows an improvement. I’m 70 btw.

Sounds sensible to me too. I do hope your cholesterol will come down (and the stress eventually).

Statins seem to be the ‘go-to’ drug that many GP’s seem quite keen to prescribe and they say, once on them, you’re on them indefinitely - an easy cash cow. Often prescribed for high cholesterol and linked to BP - this was suggested to me but I refused them and decided to lower my cholesterol myself through adjusting my diet and hence lowering my BP. Same with my husband. All too often doctors prescribe without looking at the root cause and often if we take control of our diet/exercise routine, we can make changes without the reliance on drugs.

My family has a history of heart attacks. I have been taking statins 20mg for about 30 years. My cholesterol reading was 9.5 my sister 8.9, so clearly genetic. Up to the time of writing I haven't had any side effects, I am 83 years of age. My Pa, cousin and uncle dropped dead very young, i.e.60, 57, 52.

My GP insisted I required statins for high cholesterol. I was dubious not wishing to take medication when my diet was good an no real explanation given for my high cholesterol. I took them for a month. My skin erupted in huge red pus filled lumps. A year later it is still healing. It is a recorded side effect. I refuse to take them

I also take them, 20mg, and had pains in my legs, particularly at night. I now take them in the morning, also take a low dose magnesium supplement in the evening, and this has improved. I did have "marginal" blood sugar so it will be interesting to see what has happened to this in my next blood test.
My husband has heart failure and has been taking massive doses of everything for eight years. He's had regular blood tests for all sorts of problems and apparently there are no problems.
Unless the PG picks up problems with me taking statins I'm happy to go on doing it.

I am 71 they told me I had to take statins, and I said no, just lining the pharmaceutical company pockets, so I cut out butter, changed milk to skimmed, no biscuits cakes or pastries, and down to red meat once a week, so just cut out what causes cholesterol. I’ve had my blood done and cholesterol has gone down, so I’m happy. But you do what you think is best for you.

Robin202

Statins seem to be the ‘go-to’ drug that many GP’s seem quite keen to prescribe and they say, once on them, you’re on them indefinitely - an easy cash cow. Often prescribed for high cholesterol and linked to BP - this was suggested to me but I refused them and decided to lower my cholesterol myself through adjusting my diet and hence lowering my BP. Same with my husband. All too often doctors prescribe without looking at the root cause and often if we take control of our diet/exercise routine, we can make changes without the reliance on drugs.

I've always understood that high cholesterol is often genetic and not linked to diet. A friend was married to a nutritionist who was unable to bring down his cholesterol using diet alone, though statins worked well. Apparently many people in his family had the same problem.

I stopped taking them after experiencing chronic muscle pain in my hip. Since coming off them the pain has gone but I do have concern that they have weakened my muscles. I've read others have experienced the same and this is a known side effect.

See:
www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/PIIS2213-8587(24)00040-8/fulltext?dgcid=raven_jbs_aip_email

summarised as the slight increase in risk of being tipped into diabetes diagnosis (if you are near to upper the glycaemic boundary), but the larger reduction in risk of cardiovascular problems means that most people could benefit from taking statins.

So balancing your basic body metabolism with you lifestyle choices is your decision.

BigBertha1 I was prescribed Atorvastatin. Reading the leaflet inside the packet, in the section, I think it's 'Warnings and Precautions' or vice versa, it says if you are over 70 years old speak to your doctor before taking them. I've recommended, over and over, the book Too Many Pills by Dr James Le Fanu, a practising GP. It's an interesting read.

I'm due a blood test in a couple of weeks so I will, indeed, speak to my GP about the efficacy of statins for over 70s. I'm 72.

Nanna58

It might help to research Statins and CoEnzymeQ10
My husband had dreadful cramp until someone pointed him in this direction
Could be a help

I'm on a statin but after reaading that statins can affect your body's production of CoEnzymeQ10 I take a high dose CoEnzymeQ10 every day. I haven't experienced any discernable ill effects of taking statins but some people do. The natural production of CoEnzymeQ10 also reduces with age so taing a supplement should be beneficial.

My GP started me on statins some time ago. I tried them for a while, but my hair started falling out. As I don't have thick hair anyway I stopped taking them. I haven't noticed any difference in my health.

I had a terrible time with statins. 7 months of severe tummy upsets so bad they decided I needed colonoscopy. I looked through my meds and all potential side effects. Stopped the statins. No.more problems. Did not need a colonoscopy. They are not for me. I now have an alternative. They dole them out to older people as a precaution ratger than as a necessity ignoring side effects.