Daughter Detox ~ Recovering from an Unloving Mother

That is interesting Iam64. I wonder if my bond with my sister would be as good if we had been sent to boarding school. I doubt it.

I also wonder, how is the bond with these men you know with their families? Did the experience cause long term issues with family closeness?

Yes, long term issues with families. Interestingly, two remain very angry with their mothers. One mother was a doctor, the other a successful business woman. The men both express anger they were cared for by aupairs, then off to BS age 7.
Two married, both in unstable marriages, three unmarried and never had long term relationships.
They’re lovely, interesting and well educated men, with successful careers. They share that confident presentation I’m used to seeing in privately educated people.
Off topic but - it’s hard not to feel the number of privately, BS educated men in our government isn’t linked to the mess they’re making

That makes me sad. I know there were times I wished I was sent to boarding school, but in hindsight I am glad I didn't.

Perhaps girls are more resilient, or perhaps the girl's schools had a gentler regime.

Even in the royal family, Charles loathed boarding school, Anne says it was the best days of her life.

I suppose BS, like care homes, children homes etc., vary wildly in the quality of care, as well.

And, of course, many children in normal day/state schools hate school, and dread attending. For many reasons.

I was curious about the difference in the way the men and women I know experienced BS. I ve seen no research but, it’s clear boys in BS were often sexually abused by staff or older boys. Female sex offenders exist but often in tandem with a male.

The BS issue maybe taking this too far from the OP. None of the women I know have blamed their mothers for sending them to BS, although they all went because father’s work meant periods living out of England.
Mothers do seem more likely to be held responsible for family dynamics.

Iam64

The BS issue maybe taking this too far from the OP. None of the women I know have blamed their mothers for sending them to BS, although they all went because father’s work meant periods living out of England.
Mothers do seem more likely to be held responsible for family dynamics.

Yes I think it might be Iam64 which wasn't the intention. The connection was the ACES. But it isn't a given that boarding school meant "toxic mother" even whilst other similarities may be there so I hope thread is not derailed.

Iam64

I was curious about the difference in the way the men and women I know experienced BS. I ve seen no research but, it’s clear boys in BS were often sexually abused by staff or older boys. Female sex offenders exist but often in tandem with a male.

In the 1990s, when local authorities were finally allowed full legal access to investigate concerns and allegations involving private and boarding schools (it was difficult before that), certainly the boy's schools had more of a problem with physical and sexual abuse than the girl's schools appeared to.

Perhaps that is a factor,

That and corporal punishment

Here are a couple of articles about ACEs and how they impact mental and physical health.

mft.nhs.uk/rmch/services/camhs/young-people/adverse-childhood-experiences-aces-and-attachment/

developingchild.harvard.edu/resources/aces-and-toxic-stress-frequently-asked-questions/

People don't have to recognise an ACE to have been impacted negatively by it. Physical punishment would be one example.

Thanks VS. I will read those when I settle this evening.

psychcentral.com/pro/exhausted-woman/2016/07/7-steps-in-healing-from-a-narcissistic-parent#4

I would add something to this though:

Forgiveness is individual. If you cannot forgive there is nothing wrong with that, you might need to not forgive to stay away.

Forgiveness does not mean allowing an abusive person back into your life.

Forgiveness for you might mean forgiving yourself for putting up with bad treatment for so long.

and so we arrive at forgiveness. i know a lot of people stand by forgiveness, and are absolutely certain that it's the best thing since sliced bread. well so it may be, but i'm not utterly convinced, and i'm pretty d....d certain it isn't the right thing for everyone.
maybe we should take a proper look at what we mean by forgiveness. does anyone want to start the ball rolling?

the other thing we seem to be looking at is boarding schools. (i wonder if we need to look at the aces first?)

it may be that boarding school warrants a separate estrangement thread, but i'm not sure that we really want/need to separate out into too many offshoots. there are many many forms of childhood abuse, and aces, and my view is that we should probably stand shoulder to shoulder with our sisters.

Re boarding schools... for some, the boarding school experience and being sent there CAN be part of their estrangement 'story' from their mother/parents. Part of their mothers "toxicity" might be that decision to send them away.

However, for others the boarding school experience and the impact of that is not related to a "toxic mother", the decisions made by parents might be viewed as misguided or whatever but not toxic. The outcome of boarding school might well be childhood trauma resulting in adult issues, but estrangement may or may not be part of that.

On that basis, there is I suppose a place for boarding school to be discussed on this thread re the common theme of potential ACES but maybe also a separate BS thread re impacts that do not include estrangement. BS threads tend to get derailed though as they bring out a need to "justify" ones experiences maybe. I don't know really.

Have to go out now but I'm pondering on all this!

Forgiveness means different things to people. In a psychological sense, it's about overcoming negative emotions like resentment and a desire for revenge so in this context it's not about forgiving someone for something they have done, it's about freeing oneself of these negative emotions.

Forgiveness in relation to forgiving someone for what they have done is in my experience much harder, especially if that person hasn't sought forgiveness.

Several years ago I heard an Archbishop (can't remember his name) talking about forgiveness and he said that to be forgiven
you need the three R's; remorse, repentance and restitution. So unless it is asked for, the act of forgiveness may help the one doing the forgiving to free themselves from negative emotions, but makes no difference to the person who has done them wrong.

I agree with what you say about separating abuse into too many offshoots as childhood abuse takes many forms. The majority of parents I'm sure, who take the decision to send their child to boarding school believe it's in the best interests of their child, so it's not done as an act of abuse.

Didn't see your post until I'd posted mine Madgran. You make an important point about BS's in relation to toxic parents. I say parents because when both mum and dad are involved in the decision, if there was any toxicity it wouldn't just be the mother, it would be the father as well.

I don't agree that if there were a thread about BS's, this could be derailed by some sharing their positive experiences and if anyone did so, that should be construed as "justifying ones experience".

There will be those whose experience of BS was positive, who simply want to share that experience and have no need or desire to justify it.

smileless i suppose it would depend on the purpose of the thread. if it were to discuss boarding school experiences in general, then of course it would be fine for someone who felt theirs was positive to post. however, if the purpose was to discuss the negative impact of bs, then for someone to insist it was a wonderful thing it could very well be seen as negating someone else's experience. if someone wants to start a thread on the positive aspects of bs and how much they enjoyed it, i hope they won't choose the estrangement forum for it.

smileless were you at boarding school? the reason i ask is to know whether you speak from personal experience.

People can have different experiences in any scenario.

How would one experience negate another?

They would just be different.?

I posted a few days ago that I had no personal experience riete but my 3 cousins, 2 girls and 1 boy went to BS and it was both enjoyable and positive.

My husband attended BS for 4 years and his older brother for 7 and speak fondly of their time there. It wasn't wonderful all of the time of course, but then I don't think anyone could honestly say they enjoyed every moment of the time spent at school, BS or not.

How would one experience negate another? it wouldn't would it DL. The personal experience of an EAC doesn't negate the personal experience of an EP and vice versa. They are different experiences and one doesn't nullify the other.

Another point worthy of consideration is that for an EAC, their BS experience may have nothing to do with their decision to estrange.

Someone could have been thankful for the time spent away from their abusive home life.

You are correct riete this thread is primarily about healing from a difficult childhood so in context, arguing that boarding school is wonderful is not a very kind thing to do when others have joined to say it made them unhappy and contributed to ACEs

No one's unhappy experience of BS has been invalidated simply because others have spoken of positive experiences. Sympathy has been expressed to those who have shared their unhappy memories.

It isn't 'kind' to suggest that all parents who sent their children to boarding school were abusive and/or toxic and in this context, to single out mothers when in many cases the decision would have been taken by both parents.

Boarding school is not positive where it contributed to ACEs as Madgran has said

Conversely that doesn't invalidate anyone who enjoyed the experience or had a good relationship with parents.

However the context of this thread is supporting and healing those who did have ACEs

Smileless I don't agree that if there were a thread about BS's, this could be derailed by some sharing their positive experiences and if anyone did so, that should be construed as "justifying ones experience".

There will be those whose experience of BS was positive, who simply want to share that experience and have no need or desire to justify it.

Hi Smileless I think I didn't express myself very well, I should have commented when I had more time! I didn't mean it could be derailed by people talking about their positive experiences atall, sorry for giving that impression. I meant that, in my experience, there are sometimes those who feel that they have to "prove" that anyone's negative experience must be something "lesser" in them, they "must" be at fault if they had a negative experience. Come to think of it that's a bit like the invalid suggestion that EPs "must" have done something isn't it.

Ofcourse noone has to justify their positive or even their negative experience of boarding or anything else.