I think this could be stopped

I can’t quote any details but I just heard briefly on tv news that a game in Ipswich had been stopped because of racism from the crowdsSo whatever team it was Good on that manager and I hope more follows
As part of a wide black family/community I have never come across anyone famous or not who has not had racial abuse at some time in their life Nonnieso it might be hard work finding someone to speak out on that

I fail to think MaryEliza .

I was shocked when I read that yesterday gilly . What message indeed. Who on earth was on the panel that made that decision?

marye what makes you think I need to 'try to understand'? I do understand. As a victim of racism I know what it feels like. Have you ever been a victim of racism?

If you choose to interpret what I say according to some sort of agenda please do so privately and not make me out to be something I'm not on here. I gave a balanced view and it entirely appropriate to say that I know BAME people who do not feel abused and never have. Any assumption that they are all abused is completely wrong.

There is evidence of racism in all walks of life but it is time that those BAME people who have achieved success and never experienced racism are acknowledged too. No one ever produces figures about them with the result that some assume their success is about positive discrimination which is insulting to someone who has worked hard and deserves what they have achieved.

"perhaps you should try to understand it be being more aware of" those who have achieved and not been abused. "That should be part of trying to be a good member of society. "

This very week WPC Katie Barratt (23) has won her job back plus £15k in "back pay" after being sacked by Northumbria police following a vile racist rant in and Indian takeaway.

Northumbria police fought the appeal in order to block her return claiming that "her comments could seriously damage the forces reputation" but were overruled.

What kind of message does this send?

Nonnie did you read Danny Gabbidon’s article?

This is a problem which comes up regularly. It was prevalent in football in the 1980s when Show racism the Red Card was introduced. It is a problem with society not just with football and only education and a culture of non-acceptance will build a society where this doesn't happen.

Many years ago, when I was working in a FE college, staff were sent on a 'racism awareness' course. The definition of racism we came away with was: 'Racism = Power + Prejudice. In the years since then, I have found this to be largely true.

Nonnie Perhaps you should try and understand it by being more aware of the everyday racism in our society - not just football. It’s not hard to understand at least to some extent problems that exist in society that we have not personally experienced. That should be part of trying to be a good member of society. Also the second point you made just dismisses claims of racism in employment as a bandwagon based on you dil’s experiences. There’s is a great deal of real evidence about racism in employment which is not just based on anecdotes! Of course not all BAME experience racial discrimination but many do and your post dismissed their realities especially by using the word ‘bandwagon’.

Dora Did you read the whole post or just pick out part of it to misrepresent what I said? Just read it for what it is "If we can accept everyone why do some find it hard? " What is so difficult to understand? How can you 'extrapolate' from that that I say it doesn't happen and that I have 'limited experience' when you know nothing about my experience. All you know is that I currently live in a middle class area, that tells you nothing at all about my experience. I thought this was a thread about racism not a thread about misinterpreting what poster say.

maryeliza no. Why not read the words I wrote, that will show you what I am saying.

“I live in a middle class area..” so you extrapolate from your limited experience that racial abuse does not happen. “ I find it hard to understand...” exactly the point that Danny Gabbidon is making.

What exactly are you saying Nonnie? That racial abuse doesn’t happen ? That people were lying about the monkey noises?

We live in a middle class area and I have never seen or heard any racial abuse and everyone seems to chat to everyone on the bus whatever they look like so it is hard for me to understand why this is an issue. If we can accept everyone why do some find it hard? Yes, I may be living in a bubble.

I have a BAME dil and she has never experienced racism however, during a recent radio interview when she was briefed beforehand they threw in some questions about race which were not in the brief. I was very proud of her answers when she said that her success had nothing to do with her ethnic origin and refused to join in the particular bandwagon they were talking about.

An interesting article on today’s Guardian, by Danny Gabbidon, ex-Wales cap:

www.theguardian.com/football/2019/mar/26/racism-montenegro-abuse-england

It’s easy to say “racism works both ways” but it doesn’t: as a white person I have never experienced racial abuse, while most of my BAME friends have. It’s difficult for me to understand what it must be like.

I believe Montenegro have been charged with racism following the recent Euro 2020 qualifier match. England won 5-1 but the match was spoilt by horrible racist chanting. Of course the Montenegro coach “didn’t hear anything” but even officials and the England manager said they did. Apparently the game was thought to be “high risk” before kick off and a racism monitoring team were in the ground. They now face a possible”partial stadium closure” oh dear, that must really hurt and a second offence will result in a future game being played behind closed doors. Where is the sport in this? It’s pathetic.
What would I do about it ? Exactly what Kick It Out has suggested .....Ban such teams from taking part in ALL international football until they get their house in order.

What is it about football with racism and violence? I've never heard of this relating to any other sport.

Is a second leg to be played at Wembley? If so, I hope Montenegran fans are banned from our shores.

I was listening to Radio4 earlier today.
Apparently there is a mechanism for reacting when this sort of abuse happens.
The referee could have stopped the game, he chose not to. The manager can request that the game can be stopped, Mr. Southgate didn’t.
I think that this would be very hard for those fans that have spent their hard earned money and put in effort to get to the match. BUT, it has to be stopped.
If it isn’t it can only get worse.
I think that there can be a ban on the ground that the match is being played in. Not sure about that though- I was driving!

Having married out of my race I lived through a lot of abuse by association in the 60s and 70 s I have NEVER ever been abused for being white In no way am I doubting posters who have experienced this but I m just saying it’s never happened to me or mine
I just feel that it needs something drastic to be done to stop it and yes the supporters would be furious but hopefully they would be furious at the right people if no one is brave enough to stand up to it it will never end and now more than ever it needs to stop we live in the worst racial tension I have known since the old days

Lily x posts

Perhaps someone could give a link as to the last time white players were abused at a football match by black people from the crowd. Whilst they are searching for this link they could look up the Kick it Out campaign and see the many and varied examples of racism in football that happen. RL’s post used a classic and well known technique that people who think that the subject under discussion is a bit of a joke use to distract from a serious discussion. If she wants a discussion about racism, she could start her own thread. As for the OP, GS has mused as to whether he should have taken his players off. Certainly UEFA should stop issuing fines and instead punish in other ways that did far more than hit the very deep pockets of the nations teams. Me I’d vote for stopping the game and awarding the match to the team whose players were being abused

Have many black players turned to the crowd and singled somebody out and shouted " White Moron" Is this a regular thing?

And sponsors ...

Bottom line, someone has to sacrifice something for the situation to change, ticket holders, players, owners, perhaps all three - Ticket holders who attend the game support the racism- Players who don't walk off the field support the racism- Owners who allow it support the racism-