ISIS girl

Child soldier? Absolute nonsense. She was born and raised in a safe peaceful country and choose to join a cult whose main aim is to bring hatred death and destruction to her own country.

I think the Kurdish people showed remarkably restraint for allowing the capturing of these isis monsters and not killing them. And I agree why should they be left with her.

I meant dispassionately (in previous post) It's late. I'm tired.

How many more Brits who went to join Isil now say they want to come home . I have just seen the one they call “Jihadi Jack” say he wants to come “home” for a fair trial in this country. “I miss my mum” he says,(“and pasties and Dr Who” apparently) and I can’t help thinking he should have thought of that first . This is no trivial matter to be dismissed lightly.

I think in theory a lot of us would like to agree with you Gonegirl
It’s just that trust in our judiciary is low.
We all know that the CPS will be unable to find enough evidence to prosecute. So SB won’t be charged with anything.
And the taxpayers will have to fund her a lifestyle for the next god knows how many years.
It sticks in the craw, of most people, knowing this.

My trust in the process of law in this country remains at an acceptable level, it isn’t low. Our judges are chosen on merit, there are serious efforts going into increasing the number of bem and women, as well as people who didn’t go through the private school system.
I don’t dismiss concerns about this young woman but I can’t share the simplistic, angry response of someisters.
Of course her baby should be brought up within his family. The law says unless he’d be at risk of significant harm, that’s what should happen. Adoption is a last resort, I’m not criticising adoption, it’s a life safer for many children.

She is not a child soldier. She never fought or belonged to a military force or, to my knowledge underwent any military training.

She was groomed into an extremist religious movement and within that movement's perverted belief her place was as a wife to one of the soldiers, which, uncomfortable as I am to admit it, must have appeared very 'romantic' to a girl of that age.

Look how many other girls of that age have been seduced into inappropriate liaisons, teacher - pupil, the number of girls this age groomed online and running away from home to liaisons with sexual predators, remember the under age groupies that surrounded boy bands in the 1960s. At 15 girls, in particular find the seducing quality of 'romance', very attractive.

She is certainly NOT a prostitute. She is a young girl who, embraced an extreme version of the religion she was brought up in. She went to a country/territory that did not have the age consent rules we have and, within her religion, married someone chosen for her.

I see the ‘white’ young man known as Jihadi Jack who fought with ISIS isn’s being stripped of his British citizenship. Watched him being interviewed on TV last night, all big eyes and wide smiles,

He certainly knew how to play to the camera and how to work the system. Said he wasn’t sure if his Canadian citizenship had ‘expired’ and yes, he already had joint citizenship,

Why should he be treated differently?

My sentiments entirely Anja a very “clever” and articulate young man - but still claiming he thought the Bataclan bombing in Paris was justified I noticed. And all that stuff about missing his mum....
Cynical, moi?
Actually more pessimistic than merely cynical.

His ‘performance’ (and it was exactly that) Maw made me realise just how dull and inarticulate this ‘ISIS girl’ really is.

She has not had the opportunity to progress her thinking beyond that of the 15-year old she was when she left the U.K. and judging by her general mein I suspect she was never a particularly clever child anyway.

If the girl cannot be refused entry back into this country the same for the man.

I thought Jack Letts looked spaced out. Before anybody jumps on me, that was just an observation.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but nobody on this site has lived in Syria or in a refugee camp or been brainwashed or witnessed war.We simply don't know and the media are playing us.

If what you are trying to say Annie is that there out to be some consistency then I agree there needs to be a strategic approach to this not a random ‘he’s in, she’s out’ one.

But that does have to include reference to what part these young people actually played in the Caliphate. Those who signed up as ‘fighters’ I can surely be assumed did just that and actively fought and probably killed.

Those who signed up as ‘brides’ may not have the support of the public but it’s highly unlikely that they took up arms. But their role still needs investigating.

Indeed Lily it is easy from the comfort of our homes to feel we * know* what is happening and to be judge & jury on the bits of information we are fed.
There are of course undisputed facts: the atrocities & bombings which any right minded person abhors and is made angry by.
We must hold on to our humanity and not respond in the callous and brutal way Isis & their mercenaries have towards "foes". They must face the full weight of our laws. That is the difference between a civilised society and a caliphate.

PECS I agree with your post

It would not surprise me to find out that Shamina Begum is suffering from PTSD.

I live near Oxford, and Jack Letts has been in the local papers ever since he first disappeared. He has always struck me as being what Lenin described as a 'Useful Idiot' (a derogatory term for a person perceived as a propagandist for a cause whose goals they are not fully aware of, and who is used cynically by the leaders of the cause).

He has always come over as a not very clever young man, who wants to strike attitudes and attract attention, by doing all the things people tell him not to do. If someone said to him 'Do not jump off a high cliff' He would go straight out and do it, without considering the potential risks.

I suspect if he is claiming, now, to be a fighter, he may well not have been. I think ISIS would have realised he was such a liability he wasn't even useful as cannon fodder.

M0nica Some real information about child soldiers.
Child soldiers are children (individuals under the age of 18) who are used for any military purpose. Some are in their late teens, while others may be as young as four. They are not only boys – many are girls.
Some child soldiers are used for fighting – to kill and commit other acts of violence. Others are used as cooks, porters, messengers, informants or spies, or in any other way their commanders want. Child soldiers are also used for sexual purposes.
However she was recruited, she was recruited and she was only 15. Had there been in this country a vigorous and comprehensive organisation which offered help combating the propaganda she was fed or some way of stopping her leaving the country there might have been a different outcome.

Jack Letts is 24, not a child. I’m sure he loves to give the impression of a gullible idiot.

I’d like some actual FACTS about this blagger.

trisher when you say the UK allowed her to leave for Syria that is not strictly true. She and her two friends left the UK for Turkey then were presumably aided by ISIS to go over the border to Syria.
They could have been just going on holiday.

However, I agree that more alarm bells should have rung and more been done because there were suspicions about their possible radicalisation.

She should be allowed back here to face the consequences of her actions and because she was born a UK citizen - this is not her second nationality.

I thought that young man was an absolute screwball !

How would SB obtain a British Passport in Syria ?

She can't at the moment which is I think what the government are relying on to keep her there. There is no consulate or embassy. In other places she could walk into a such a British institution and ask for an emergency passport and for help to be repatriated. The legal battle which follows the removal of her citizenship could take years. Of course there may be interested parties who will be willing to assist her to reach a British office elsewhere. Anyway it's a disgusting reflection on British society that someone can be illegally deprived of citizenship and left somewhere where resources are strictly limited when she could be returned and those resources used by someone else. It seems not only are we now unwilling to take refugees we are also unwilling to take British citizens.

Erm, trisher----she shouldn't have been there in the first place ; You quoted :

" a disgusting reflection on British society that someone can be illegally deprived of citizenship and left somewhere where resources are strictly limited ".

So what do you propose ? A market stall in the middle of knowhere dishing out British passports to those who feel fit to return after studying terrorism ?

EV if there was an intention to bring her back I am sure there are processes which could be set in place to move her to a place from which she could be repatriated.

Even the Muslim community in Bethnal Green don't want her back either. members of the runaway schoolgirl’s local community have warned not to “trust her”, claiming that she
could radicalise others. Moulana Abdul Malik, an iman at the Baitul Aman mosque near
where Ms Begum grew up, said he supported the Home Secretary.
Mr Malik told The Times: “It might not really be in her heart. People who are brainwashed
may not have changed their habits - those who go to extremism will not change.
We think the decision taken by the Home Office was correct.
I’m worried if Shamima Begum does return, she might influence other people. It would be dangerous for other young people.

Nobody wants her.