Can you forgive and forget?

When you forgive you have to trust that you are not being a fool, but that God will work through your forgiveness. That's my viewpoint for what its worth.

MOnica that is a very broad question. We are all different but I don't suppose there is that much difference in our feelings when we are annoyed or angry over something which we cannot mend. Ditto when everything is resolved or we forgive and move on. Some feel more strongly than others of course and sometimes things can get out of hand with very sad consequences.
ReadyMeals is quite right in giving one of the meanings of forgiveness and if you do some research you will find a fair few others. See www.gty.org for sound biblical teaching on forgiveness. Basically it is the handing over to the Lord and leaving Him to deal with it all which engenders the peace and calm of knowing that He is able to do far more than we ever could - in His time and not ours. None of us is perfect so we are all, without exception, subject to His perfect judgement. What a mercy we have a Saviour!

Apparently the biblical meaning just means to spare the person from punishment or penalty of any sort. Originally it was nothing to do with whether you're still angry or resentful - forgiveness is to simply not demand retribution. It's only relatively recently that a psychological definition has come to the forefront, presumably made popular by today's counselling and wellbeing fadists.

"what Mother wouldn't stand up for her Son"
I thought that chicken just said ^child' DewatDawn, but I could be wrong and I think I assumed it was her DD. Perhaps not.

Will someone please explain to me what forgiveness is. How do you feel when you are in the unforgiving state and what feelings come with forgiveness? This is something that has always puzzled me.

I can understand being deeply hurt and upset and there are people I hold in contempt as a result of their behaviour to others, but I do not and never have hated them, which seems to be part of the pre-forgiveness state.

You can never forget that something has happened, and if the person who offended you continues that kind of behaviour, you may never think well of them or trust them again. For other people it is clear that the offending behaviour was a one off glitch and, with time feelings fade and everything gets back to normal.

Jalima1108 - Do some posters think that chicken should apologise to the people who are being childish and not speaking to her?

I would never apologise for something that I did not do and would never suggest that anyone else do it either.

However, we don't really know what happened other than Chicken "standing up" for her Son. That could mean she calmly had a quiet word or she could have screamed in someones face (I'm not suggesting she did but we just don't know)

Maybe it was felt that she'd involved herself in something that she shouldn't have - Chicken has said "what Mother wouldn't stand up for her Son"? So for instance - if my Son was going through a bad patch with his wife and I felt she was treating him badly, I wouldn't involve myself by "standing up" for him because it's not my business. (again, I am not suggesting this is in any way the case)

Chicken will know herself whether there is anything she needs to apologise for, even if she is completely right in her argument.

Chicken, reading your post was like déjà vu for me. I feel for you and know exactly how you feel. I stood up for my granddaughter when her mother made an awful threat to her. I challenged my daughter-in-law about it and have not been spoken to since. She has denied me contact with my granddaughter and her siblings and my son seems to be taking her side too. I have not seen my precious grandchildren for months and have just been sent to Coventry. So glad I'm not alone. Doesn't make it any better though when I sit alone looking at their photos and crying every minute of the day. Take care - always here for a chat.

so sorry for you, i have done a lot of forgiveing because it brings you down when you trail it around with you, so for your sake forgive but you dont have to forget, i find if you dont want to speke to the person write them a letter dont post it tear it up after but getting it out helps healing, take care thinking of you. xx

DH always says "There are three sides to everything, yours, mine and the truth" - and very irritatingly true it is too!

However, I should add that sending someone to Coventry like that is bullying.

Jalima sometimes you just have to accept that others will never admit they were wrong and often having painted themselves into a corner they need a hand to get out of said corner!
Synonymous I think it depends on whether the behaviour is a one-off incident, or a continual pattern of deliberately nasty behaviour to undermine and bully an individual.

In this case it does sound like a one-off incident.

Surely, Jalima, you have to take into account all the circumstances and the fact that chicken is living in such close quarters is a factor which makes it difficult for the situation to continue as it is upsetting her so much.
Yes, I agree, that's why I suggested she could say 'let bygones be bygones' then neither 'side' would be losing face as such.

Perhaps chicken may have to come to terms with the fact that they will never apologise and if they are to continue to live in the same property that could be the best way forward.
Perhaps if chicken says 'I'm sorry that you were upset by what I said' could be sufficient - leaving unspoken the thought that they were in the wrong for their behaviour.

P.S. that post was by Acciaccatura at 11.04 on 25/4 on page 2 and it certainly can change the mindset.

Jalima sometimes you just have to accept that others will never admit they were wrong and often having painted themselves into a corner they need a hand to get out of said corner! It is not always about culpability but more about how to help people to function well, put things behind them and move on with life in the best way possible. Nothing worthwhile is ever easy, sadly.

The comment (above I think) about using the word 'indefensible' instead of 'unforgiveable' is very helpful.

I'm afraid I do hold grudges and there are certain things I will never forget nor forgive. If that makes me a bad person, so be it - I'm not religious, so I have no concerns on that score. Having said that, I don't dwell on them...unless something happens to remind me of them.

Surely, Jalima, you have to take into account all the circumstances and the fact that chicken is living in such close quarters is a factor which makes it difficult for the situation to continue as it is upsetting her so much. If an apology through clenched teeth makes life pleasant again, it may be worth going through the motions. As I said in my earlier post, I would apologise for the fact we'd rowed and unpleasant things were said. I'd be quite vague in detail of what my apology covered but I'd want to broker a better atmosphere. I wouldn't even bother to ask them for an apology, they'd probably not want to as they sound nasty enough to keep things going and they probably wouldn't mean it if they did.

Do some posters think that chicken should apologise to the people who are being childish and not speaking to her? She could make the first move perhaps and could suggest letting bygones be bygones (which would be very magnanimous under the circumstances) but it could always become an underlying cause of tension unless the ones who have sent her 'to Coventry' apologise or at least acknowledge that their behaviour is wrong.

What's that Chinese proverb? - "If you sit by the river long enough you will see your enemies floating past." I always find that comforting.

jimbabcock good post from you too.

Acciaccatura excellent post! (at 11.04 on 25/4 )

My Mum used to say "life's too short to bear a grudge". As I fast approach 70, I realise how true this is.

IMO as humans we will not forget that which hurts us. As Christians we hopefully have learned to forgive.

Yet none of us is perfect as humans or Christians.

We are on our own journey and need to pray for help to get through.

Additionally, the TRUTH is the most important. I am an old guy, so maybe it is easier for me, but I believe getting the reputation of trying to always say what is honest and true may provide more short term pain, but in the long run is right.

Never hate. Always welcome the prodigal son back. Pray for those who oppose you. And when they do not get it, give them the space for them to come to their senses.

Sometimes others are in a place where they are not open to God's grace or us. That is their problem. Do not make it yours.

We must not be arrogant, but we must stay centered on the TRUTH, love and respect. When we do these ultimately we will be morally and spiritually safe. We cannot do better.

Chicken I feel for you, Bikergran. I will never ever forgive the things my SIL has done to his children and to us as a family. None of us now have any contact with the children. He has cut all of our family off from them.

No I cant forgive or forget the things my son in law has said/done...

I have been through something similar and ran it around and around in my head for ages - it's exhausting, all consuming and very unhealthy. It must be awful for you living in the same house as them, I don't know that I could.

I think when people say "forget" they mean don't dwell on it as I don't know that you can just forget something like this they way you can forget what you had for dinner last Tuesday. Maybe it's remembering without emotion?

I have pretty much forgiven the person in my feud situation, although we are no longer in contact. It wasn't easy to do at first and sometimes I did have to forgive her all over again.

Could you approach them one at a time? Someone up thread mentioned there is usually one person who is the "ring leader" so to speak, I'd start there and just see how it goes. It's worth trying, you don't have to resolve the issue, just agree to disagree and move on. The longer these things go on the harder it is to fix them.