Drunk tanks

Maybe the brewers and distillers should fund these “bins”? And those who get sent there could do X hours community service in cleaning them up.

Just wanted to add that things are not always what they seem.

It's apparently quite cheap to buy drugs to spike drinks and the victims are completely unaware of what's happened, but they will not be in control of themselves in a similar way to someone who is very drunk. Spiking drinks is so common that drinkers are advised never to leave their drinks unattended.

Public drunkenness is as old as time, we just see more of it because the media enables us to see it. I hope realise photographers walk the streets looking for a photo of drunken behaviour?

Actually where I live it's an offence to drink in public in the city centre. There's a clear perimeter that's easily identifiable where no public drinking is allowed (I'm not saying here what that perimeter is). So things are being done to tackle antisocial behaviour.

I support the drunk tanks initiative because it keeps the people out of A&E and makes sure they get the right medical help.

There's some very judgemental posters on here.

That’s a good point about drinks being spiked, Jalima. Sometimes the world seems to be a.very scary place.

Sorry Maggie I didn't realise Jalima had already mentioned spiking drinks.

If these twats can afford to buy alcohol they can afford big fines not just some slap on the wrist. A&E is full of them on weekends in particular, staff get abused and real patients don't get a decent service. No one can pretend that needing security staff in hospitals or that not having an ambulance available because they've been diverted to a drunk is acceptable. Everyone blames everything else for the state of the NHS except the drunks and addicts. So fine people direct from their wages or benefits what it actually costs to run these drunk tanks and put them everywhere they are needed until people realise. It's no good putting the price of alcohol up or restricting purchases, they will still find a way of buying and over consuming it and price hikes will just effect the innocent drinkers just like uninsured drivers effect those of us who pay. I don't know about everybody else but I'm sick to death seeing that someone got a £30 fine for doing something that would have cost ££££ to put right. Introduce alcohol awareness into schools as part of PSE and show the kids videos of the antisocial behaviour.

Sorry Maggie I didn't realise Jalima had already mentioned spiking drinks.

She hadn't, Wilma, it was you I was supposed to be answering. Sorry, a senior moment (or someone had spiked my .

Put an extra few pence on every supermarket bottle of alcohol , every alcoholic pub drink.

I guess the trouble is that if going to a drunk tank incurred a cost, then they would kick up a fuss about going there and turn up at A&E instead - assuming they have enough functioning brain left to make that decision.

That's why the idea of a drunk tank in the car park at A&E is a good idea, with a medic at the hospital door to send them there.
A diabetic having a hypo would then not accidentally be sent to a drunk tank.

sallydapp I agree that alcohol awareness should be taught in schools, but rather than showing examples of anti-social behaviour show pictures of people in hospital with alcohol poisoning, people throwing up and soiling themselves - I think that would have more of an impact on young people.

50 years ago there were exhibitions of pickled lungs going round libraries, etc., to show the effect that smoking had.
Very few people gave up smoking because of that.
It was more the extra tax on cigarettes that made people cut down, then stop.
It will be interesting to see if the minimum pricing tax in Scotland has any effect. Supposed to be coming in May 1st, 2018.

Put an extra few pence on every supermarket bottle of alcohol , every alcoholic pub drink.
Is that fair on people who drink responsibly? The tax on alcohol is high anyway - amongst the highest, if not the highest, in Europe.
Yet do other countries have these problems?

That is why the whole drinking culture of younger people needs investigation. For instance - why do freshers at universities drink so much - as a kind of initiation ceremony?
Why do so many young people go out and get paralytic with drink at weekends - and how can they afford it anyway?

If you drink responsibly, a few extra pence on a bottle will be immaterial.
According to the Scottish minimum pricing laws to be introduced next year;

"Given the link between consumption and harm and evidence that affordability is one of the drivers of increased consumption, addressing price is an important element of any long-term strategy.

Alcohol is now 60 per cent more affordable in the UK than it was in 1980. It is possible in Scotland today to exceed the new lower risk guidelines for alcohol (14 units per week) for less than £2.50. This is an unacceptable position and we have a responsibility to address this problem.

There is strong international evidence that tackling price - as part of a package of measures, including education and diversion - can help reduce alcohol consumption and related harm."

Do you want harm reduction, or don't you?
You can't have one law for those you think drink responsibly and another for those who don't!

Raising the cost of alcohol will not change a thing, those that want the alcohol and can't afford it will just steal it.
Being a nanny to people too drunk to take care of themselves is not the answer either, they will dismiss the risks in the knowledge that they will be cared for. Do other countries provide this service or are they left in the gutter to face the consequences ?

But - should it be necessary seeing that we already pay one of the highest rates of tax on alcohol (if not the highest rate) in Europe - or is that the world?
And why penalise the many to pay for the out of control behaviour of a few?

We need to look at Why?

And what is being sold for £2.50 that contains 14 units of alcohol? It's not the pint of real ale or the bottle of nice wine that is causing problems - it must be the cheap stuff then.

Do you want harm reduction, or don't you?
Twisting things again

Could you point me to anything I posted which says that I do not believe in harm reduction please?

There is more to this problem than price - if alcohol is cheaper abroad and they do not have the problem with their own populations, only with the British on holiday apparently, then there is something in the psyche of young British people that needs addressing.

You would make a really good politician - always twisting what other people say to make them sound negative!!

Tax on alcohol doesn't matter. It's the overall price.
All Scandinavian countries have much higher prices than UK. People tend to drink responsibly in Finland and Norway because they can't afford to buy more.
Therefore, if you want people to drink less it's obvious you have to put the prices up.
By the way, there is a petition on change.org to ask for no subsidised alcohol in the houses of parliament. Actually, I think it's to get rid of bars, as other people are not allowed to drink while at work.

Finland is expensive for everything, that is why British people who are sent by firms to work there get a premium paid on their salaries.
(It used to be +60%)

I don't think they should have bars in the H of C - even if they have to stay for a late sitting we want them to make decisions without being influenced by alcohol.
They got rid of Civil Services bars, didn't they? but not their own.

Okay, explain how you would sort out the problem without penalising those who 'drink responsibly'.

If you look at minimum price for alcohol you will find that expensive bottles of wine are already above the minimum price per unit of alcohol anyway. So you are worrying for nothing.

"Research into differing price policy options concluded that a minimum unit price is the most effective of a range of policy options. It has been recommended as a way of increasing the price of drinks such as own-brand spirits and white cider, which have high alcohol content but are usually very cheap.

Minimum unit pricing would simply set a floor price for a unit of alcohol, meaning it can't be sold for lower than that. The more alcohol a drink contains, the stronger it is and therefore the more expensive it will be.

Minimum unit pricing is not a tax; it is a targeted way of making sure alcohol is sold at a sensible price.
The effects of Minimum Unit Pricing

Minimum unit pricing will impact most on harmful drinkers - those who regularly drink more than the lower risk drinking guidelines. Those who drink within the lower risk guidelines will only be marginally affected simply because they only consume a small amount of alcohol and also because they do not tend to buy as much of the cheaper alcohol that would be most affected by a minimum unit price.

The small increase in the cost of alcohol to moderate drinkers has to be seen in the context of the total costs of alcohol misuse - estimates suggest around £900 per year for every adult in Scotland.

Almost all drinks bought in the pub are already sold well above any likely minimum price, so they wouldn't be affected. The minimum unit price of 50p per unit will mostly affect cheap white ciders and value spirits with high alcohol content which tend to be favoured by harmful drinkers."

From the link about Scottish pricing.

www.gov.scot/Topics/Health/Services/Alcohol/minimum-pricing

which, as I said, comes in on May 1st.

I have a bottle of New Zealand wine which costs £10 and has 9.4 units of alcohol. That's over double the unit price.
The organic bitter I buy costs about the same, £2 for 2.1 units.

Perhaps you should stop trying to twist what I say.

Finland pays a higher tax on alcohol than we do. You have twice said we pay the highest in Europe.

Okay, explain how you would sort out the problem without penalising those who 'drink responsibly'.
Sorry, Miss, if I knew the answer I would be advising the Government.

The minimum unit price of 50p per unit will mostly affect cheap white ciders and value spirits with high alcohol content which tend to be favoured by harmful drinkers."
The people drinking at weekends in city centres are probably drinking in pubs and clubs and not drinking cheap white ciders etc which are obtained from some shops - more favoured by those who may in fact be under age, getting someone to buy it for them then sitting drinking in parks etc.

The tax on alcohol is high anyway - amongst the highest, if not the highest, in Europe.
we already pay one of the highest rates of tax on alcohol (if not the highest rate) in Europe

amongst the highest^; ^one of the highest^; ^if not modifies the statement to mean that it may not be the highest, there could be higher.

Thank you for posting the absolute facts.

You have twice said we pay the highest in Europe.
no, I did not in fact.

'The minimum unit price of 50p per unit will mostly affect cheap white ciders and value spirits with high alcohol content which tend to be favoured by harmful drinkers."
The people drinking at weekends in city centres are probably drinking in pubs and clubs and not drinking cheap white ciders etc which are obtained from some shops - more favoured by those who may in fact be under age, getting someone to buy it for them then sitting drinking in parks etc.'

Perhaps you should have told the Scottish government, before they decided minimum unit pricing.

You still haven't explained what is wrong with minimum unit pricing.