Labelling Children

There are none so blind as those that will not see. I feel sorry for them.

Speaking as someone who has "a label", sometimes it's helpful for people to know what extra support you need and sometimes you find yourself struggling, not just wth the condition, but with the expectation of limitation that the label brings. And, no I'm not going to say what my label is, because on this site it's simply not relevant.
I would prefer for the support needed to be the emphasis because any "difference" can vary widely from individual to individual, as indeed can their own attitude towards it.

All I can say Quizqeen is thank God you are no longer teaching.If you can't differentiate between children with real problems and those who are normally well behaved but are naughty now and then ( most children) then it's a poor do.
The defiance disorder that you laughed at is well known and my own DGS has autism as well as that ( quite common) and also ADHD.The defiance is to everything.....not just to the odd thing as would be normal, so much so that if you say black they say white.Children like this will not comply with any instruction or order, and you find ways of suggesting things, and hopefully they will do as you want, but more often than not they won't.To say it is wearing is the understatement of the year.This is not normal child behaviour.His parents and ourselves were strict but soon found this didn't work.
Much reading on the subject showed that picking your battles, and rewarding often and suggestion worked slightly better.Autism often comes with a raft of other
behaviours.In the past, children were put into institutions where parents couldn't cope,
And if they went to 'normal' schools, their lives were a misery of loneliness and misunderstanding sometimes leading to exclusion.
Even experts don't agree on what is best, and normalisation was much championed a while back, but our own experience is that this is akin to ignoring their problems and leads to them being bullied.
A good caring school for autism is the best for them, and DGS is now lucky enough to be at one.

I cringe when I think back to my attitude when I started teaching in the early 1980s. I thought children who didn't do well were just lazy or deliberately naughty.

Over the years, it was certainly true that more youngsters had labels and there was a better understanding of certain conditions, although I don't think it was necessarily because there were more of them. Psychologists became better at diagnosing and special schools were closed, so more children with SEN were thrown into mainstream schools, without training for teachers or resources.

Labels can be helpful in identifying special needs. However, it's frustrating when learning plans are unrealistic and no resources are provided. It was very common to know what problems an individual child had, but not be able to do much, because there were 30+ other children in the class, many of whom also had individual needs.

It doesn't help when some parents think that a teacher can focus just on their child and abdicate responsibility for the others. It works best when parents, teachers and specialists work together. This isn't easy in a secondary school, because so many people are involved.

roses, Jane et al there's no point in trying to explain to some people. Perhaps as a very young, unexperienced teacher I might have shared some of their views.

Shame on me.

My years not just trying to 'shovel' knowledge into young heads taught me that every child is different, every child deserves a chance. Yes, there is poor parenting in some instances (not a cause of ASD, etc) but then when it's genuinely a case of poor parenting all the more reason for the classroom to be the place of safety and warmth, and offer an environment condusive to learning and making up for the inadequacies of home, rather than looking down on children who are disadvantaged.

DD x-posts. We both moved on from that

roses, I expect you know that many of the new wave of 'free' schools are for autistic children. With a bit of luck, the building can be designed with quiet areas and specialist staff are employed.

Some children with high functioning autism cope very well in main stream schools, but I agree with you that a specialist environment is best for many.

The worst thing for me about this thread is the lack of knowledge on some parts of how difficult it is to get support. Having 5-6 children in class (or last year more than 50% of the class who had an IEP does not mean that you get extra bodies sufficient to support those children, whose needs are not all the same and sometimes behavioural and often complex.
Listen to the news about cuts in budget - it isn't just now, successive governments have made it harder and harder to qualify for support and I wonder if the proliferation of 'named' problems is a result of this because it gives you a firm starting point to try and get what used to be called a 'statement'.
You do your best to provide education which takes account of the differing needs (and sometimes, having a label does make it easier to do that) whilst at the same time trying to make sure that children and parents understand that their problems means that they may find things more difficult but that we are doing our best to enable them to achieve despite this. I have only come across a few parents who see a label as a reason for a child not having to bother.
Instead of complaining here, spend some time campaigning for funding for appropriate support for all those who need it. The impact on a class of having even only one, or often more very disruptive, sometimes violent children who take up teacher/TA time because of lack of support even though that has been applied for but not granted can affect the progress of ALL the children.
Picture arriving home to prepare the evening meal and finding, before you start, you have to calm a violent dispute between children, the resulting mayhem caused by the fight, the distress of the children not involved but frightened by the noise and the mess the dog has left on the floor because it managed to eat the contents of the bin and it made it sick!
That's what it feels like when you enter a class wanting to teach, with children with behavioural difficulties. Incidentally I'm typing this with my fingers strapped together thanks to the 6year old diagnosed with Oppositional Defiant Disorder who suddenly slammed the door as I reached out to open it further. He knew I was there but he just said "I was cross".

Yes, I know Anya but I hope that people who haven't come across autism in their lives, and are not decrying labels, may read our comments and mull it over, and even those who's first thought was that labels are bad may also do so, and maybe read a bit on the subject.The least they can do is to keep an open mind.

Blinko. Yes I've read that book "the curious incident etc" which is on my list of favourites. Brilliant!*

Yes dd there is a brand new school for autism opened in our area.After a long wait a place was found at an excellent one a bit further away though, and he had been there a year when they offered him a place at the new one....spoilt for choice suddenly!
He is happy where he is, so will stay there until he leaves school.
adaunas You have my sympathy, having children with special needs ( and so many) makes teaching difficult, even with the help of TA's.5-6 children in one class is far too many.

It's quite a few posts up but when Ninathenana said to me " how do you know I haven't got a child with special needs" I was not referring to you or your children or grandchildren in my post Nina or else I would have used your name

Autism is noit a DISability, it's a different ability!

Well said Hilda!Acceptance is the only requirement.

If only Greenfinch.
Do you know of adults with Autism/ASD that are in long term jobs?
Because I dont.
And if you know, and others know how to get them into the jobs market, and they are able to stay there and be happy, please do tell.

I do know one pupil who went to uni, did well, went on to do a part time job, and coped well for a bit.
But that is it amongst the adults I know with autism or ASD.

The other end of the scale, I know a young woman in her 20s, has done college to some degree or other, volunteering, part time jobs etc etc, who really is basically unable to cope with jobs and life in general. And often talks about suicide. Sadly I dont think it will be long.
Oh and has had an autism support worker who has given up on her too.

So if anyone has some bright ideas, or any ideas at all, I am all ears[I was going to start a thread about it soon] but now dont have to as people with knowledge about this sort of thing are mostly on here already.

One of my friends a lady nearly 50 has recently been diagnosed and yay labeled as being on the autistic spectrum She is delighted that at last she has an explanation for a lot of her thoughts fears and actions she is so relieved after all these years

Ankers, I have a friend who is definitely on the Autistic spectrum, but who held down a job in computer development for nearly 40 years. Indeed he once saved a project through his obsessive need to record data in a notebook, when the computer data was wiped. He was aware his colleagues thought him odd but was quite happy if allowed to do things in his own way. But then he didn't have a label back then, just the ability to do the job that was required.

Well said hildajenniJ!!
So many kids fell through the net and we're stigmatised in 'remedial' classes when I was at school through lack of understanding and diagnostic tests.
Is it not easier to know how to help a child with additional needs if you already know & understand what those needs are?
Because you as a teacher 'think' the pupil is lazy and not in need of a diagnosis does not make you right.... just I'll informed and IMHO in need of some training! !!!!

Ill not I'll! !!

Chris Packham

Satoshi Tajiri

Tim Burton (my GS's hero)

My youngest GS has recently been diagnosed as autistic. This has only been because we paid for him to be assessed privately. He is 9 years old, and until about a year ago had been coping quite well at school. He is a chatty inquisitive little boy, very interested in science, cares deeply about animals - so much in fact that he has voluntarily become vegetarian. However last year saw a distinct deterioration in his behaviour at school: meltdowns, running away, school refusal. Until in the end the head was talking about exclusion. Maybe the explanation will become clear to those of you who know anything about austism: he was in a year which had shared teaching.
What became clear from the analysis we had done was that he finds inconsistency very difficult. He needs structure and to know what is expected. Otherwise he builds up stress which eventually explodes in some way. Maybe I can illustrate it best by saying that if he is given a project - say on pyramids - to do, he will quite happily work hard on it and do a good job. However, if he is given 10 choices and asked to do one of them, it is almost impossible for him to make that choice.
Luckily, this year he has a teacher who is much more up-to-date, and is coping really well with him. He has a quiet area he can go to if he feels things are building up, and he loves going to school again. Secondary school is a worry, but we shall have to see how things go.
One last point. My DH says he understands how he feels, because he can remember having the same problem with choice when he was at school. He can remember being told to write a story which was very vaguely put, and doing a whole book of sums instead! He became a very well-respected scientist - and there lies another story, because many of the high-level scientists and mathematicians that we have know have themselves often shown clear signs of autism. Ever watched Big Bang Theory? If so, just think of Sheldon!

Quizqueen
you make some very good points, whilst working
with various 'labeled'children there were often social or personal issues which played a big part in affecting a child's ability to concentrate or fulfill their full potential, some children have to cope with problems we as adults would struggle with! many had been moved into a new family situations, often with no room,space of their own & expected to fit in with previously unknown people, arrangements etc , sometimes happening more than once , little wonder their behaviour learning & concentration is affected

quizqueen well said. I once had a child in my care who was a delight(for me) he had been held back which had more to do with the staff than him. He didnt want or need a sing song response to everything he done, if he was out of line or really great he got the same response, a silly baby voice from a adult.
I will call the child "T" for the purpose of this post. At the start of our friendship T and i had a chat, we spoke about what upset us in class and what made us happy, What made us laugh and what made us cross. We agreed the rules drew up the list and we both signed it and shook hands.He took a few days to understand the rules were not drawn in the sand they were set in cement. By the end of that term he was a different boy, he was reading,writing, listening but the most wonderful thing of all was the other children were no longer afraid of him and allowed him to join in their play (now that did make me cry)
T had a whole team of specialists supporting both himself and his Mother. Every day at the end of school you could see T starting to get upset and his behaviour would change when he could hear his mother waiting in the playground, he would hide and when i found him he would cling to me and refuse to go with his Mother. Many times i would open the front door of my house and find him hiding in the bushes.I would phone his Mother and she wouldnt even know he had gone . To get to my house he had to cross 2 major roads and travel half a mile. We could support and help T but we couldnt change his Mother and she was where his problems lay
Not every child with a label has a learning difficulty some just have parents who's interests lie elsewhere

Brilliant Grannypiper,
sadly more & more wonderful children are having to cope with lifestyles & behaviours which we as adults would struggle with. Obviously there are many children with genuine conditions & learning difficulties who have loving supportive parents, but sadly there are so many who do not !

Glad there are at least a few people who are able to be in long term work.

[It doesnt look like Tim Burton has been formally diagnosed. Only by his wife, though that doesnt mean she is wrong]