Frail elderly neighbour

Hoo boy-so it could be a lot worse then?
Spoke to neighbour's nephew last night; we're both optimistic she'll be kept in hospital over the weekend and then, hopefully, more care can be put in place next week.

Some years ago myself and several other neighbours were absolutely slated in the local paper because our elderly neighbour had slipped on water from a burst pipe and frozen to death.
What the paper didn't say, was, what a nasty piece of work she was.
One day it was raining cats and dogs. She was walking down the road (slowly) without a brolly. I rush out with mine and put it over her head. She HIT me with her walking stick, and told me to eff off.

Similar situation with an elderly lady who lived around the corner from us. I wasn't involved in any way but her neighbours on both sides (one a District Nurse) offered help and tried to get the authorities involved. This lady was mobile, just, but living in squalor in one room of a substantial semi which was falling to pieces around her.

She too had only a nephew who lived an hour away and visited periodically. She refused all help and often wouldn't open the door to the nephew or concerns red neighbours.

Last summer she must have wandered into the garden at some time and fallen. She lay there for several days, it was estimated, before being found - dead. Now neighbours etc feeling guilty, but what can you do?

It's a problem that is going to get worse as we all live longer.
When my mother was in hospital (aged about 90), I was protesting that she was not capable of going back to her own home. My OH and I had been helping her but were at the end of our tether.
Social Services sent someone to assess her. If she could make a cup of tea and a piece of toast, then she was fit to live on her own. She couldn't and looked at me to help her. I didn't because that wasn't the right thing to do. So the assessor helped her and then said she was ok to go home.
We eventually got her into a pleasant residential home (selling her house to pay the fees) but social services were a nightmare.
Something needs to be put in place to help people cope with this type of situation even if it is partly run by volunteers who have experience. When you are a carer, you can't see the wood for the trees and the stress makes it more difficult to cope.

Oh sugarpuffairy how sad- you don't know any family she has then?
It's like leaving toddlers unattended isn't it? It's a big problem and seems not to be addressed until there's a crisis.
I think you judge a society by the way it treats it weakest members, the young, the elderly, the sick, and I think we fail miserably
Hope you manage to alert the services and she's found.
Good for you looking out for her-well done

Newquay -what a carry on. Hospitals will discharge if they find out there is a relative or helpful neighbour. I know this to happen many times before it stops. I went through so many failed discharges being carer to my parents.
I have a flat in a building where the neighbours are all good old fashioned types of varying ages. There is an elderly neighbour who has been brought home many times by Police after wandering off. She is adamant that her flat is not her home despite being there for 65+ years. Ambulances have been called but do nothing. I met her trying to lock her door and go out. She was very well dressed and with make up and jewellery. She spoke to me but never mentioned my name although she seemed to know who I was. She spoke about my children asking why they were not with me. My children are over 30 with lots of children. She said she was tired of people saying that this is her flat and she needed to go to her other house where she is. She is her mother who died many years ago, over 20 years ago at least. It all upset me so much that I contacted SS and told them it was all very distressing and I was worried for the lady. I will be phoning next week to see if they will tell me anything. I have not seen the lady the last time I went to the flat and the house was in darkness during a night time call.
I hope this old lady is safe.

Thank you but, Sadly, kindness doesn't do anything to help
I find it hard to believe that she was sent home to an empty house when she was unable to walk. She said a Sister told her to try harder to walk!
An OT said today that she hoped a care package would be in place BEFORE she came home-we'll see.
It must said though she thinks she can manage so she will say anything to get home. Truly she needs a nursing home and 24 hour care.

What a kind person you are, Newquay, we should all have/be neighbours like you.

Once again I called round to see neighbour and found an ambulance there-again. There was a house full, 2/3 ambulance staff, several OT. All lovely and pleasant but no practical help. They had tried but there are no extra carers available nor any respite beds. Of course, it's now Friday
One of the OTs said she would ring ahead to the team of nurses at the hospital in the hope that she must wouldn't be bounced back home. Said OT said she needs at least 2 carers 4 times a day-yup!
She said she takes herself to the toilet (oh no she doesn't!) and gets herself to bed (oh no she doesn't!).
To try to speed things up a bit I summarised and said so you'll explain that she's immobile then? Let's get her moving. It was pitiful seeing the pain she was in being transferred from armchair to wheelchair with 2 folks helping her.
Outside, having promised I'll look after house, I got her to look me in the eye and asked her to promise me she would accept either staying in hospital or respite care. Tight lipped!
I'll probably get another call tomorrow asking me to just pop round. I've told her I can't help her to the toilet in any event-bad back.
And so it goes on. . . .
Sorry to go but I know many of you have travelled this road and understand

Thanks for your support. I haven't had chance to go round yet today, been working til now and have to go to town soon for some urgent errands so will call round 5-6pm tonight. She gave me the key safe number so I can get in.
I SO hope they couldn't have discharged her from hospital yesterday when the OT discovered she could barely walk.
So sad, we're all only trying to help her. . . . .

If your neighbour is unable to walk unaided chances are social services will step in and not allow her to return home without adequate care in place. Even then they may deem she is a danger to herself and insist she goes into care which is what happened to my mum. She had been walking round with the aid of the furniture for several months (my dad was still at home then but with early dementia). She fell and was taken into hospital where they had her assessed and wouldn't let her home despite me only living a few doors away. I had to find her a care home which thankfully was only a few minutes car ride away and they were very good to her - sadly after only a couple of weeks she no longer remembered where she'd lived and quickly deteriorated. She was totally deaf and I think that made it worse as she couldn't communicate with us but she remained in there for 3 years until she passed away at 92 by which time she was totally bedridden, incontinent and didn't know me. The same thing happened to my dad after that although we did manage to keep him at home for 2 years after mum went into care - he also fell and went into hospital - by the time they had assessed him 6 weeks later he had stopped eating and lost 3 stone in weight. We got him into Mum's home in the next room but he passed away a couple of months later aged 89. I hope they manage to sort your neighbour out with care - it's so sad.

Newquay It is very difficult to try to give help or sound advice to someone who does not want to hear any sound advice or or to acknowledge that they are becoming unable to manage by themselves. Good luck with this.

I saw a tv programme recently about the elderly being scammed through postal advertisements etc. It might have been fake Britain or don't get done get Dom. where there were law enforcers investigating these things now. They support individuals to identify their scammers and get real results in shutting them down. It was a great programme which identified loads of vulnerable folks who have been caught up in scamming and the help recieved. All of these people had capacity but that doesn't give scammers the right to steal their money.

Unfortunately it's quite common for elderly people who badly need help to refuse to have carers coming in. And unless they have been officially deemed to lack capacity, there is little anyone can do. But it's very hard on anyone who just has to stand by, helping as they can, or are able to, and wait for the almost inevitable crisis. My OH had an old aunt who wouldn't have any of the care we arranged - everyone was 'too loud' or 'too common' (!) etc. and they were all sent packing. Another factor was that although she had plenty of money she was terribly tight and just didn't want to pay.

But she needed help so badly and we lived a 2 hour drive away. She was relying a lot on elderly neighbours, many of whom were themselves pretty decrepit - the poor things would phone me wailing, 'We can't cope any more!' In the end OH managed to get her into a care home, but boy, it was a monumental struggle, and she only gave in when she was no longer even able to get herself to the loo. OH who has infinite patience finally spent an entire day with her, when she was refusing all day to go to the care home place he'd arranged. She just kept saying, 'what am I going to do?' and he would say, 'you know what you've got to do.' At about 9 pm, and up to here, he said, 'Sorry, but I've got to go now,' and only then did she give in.

It's rather different, but we have an elderly neighbour who we found out by chance was spending an absolute fortune on a lottery scam - convinced that this £1m 'win' was going to appear if she just kept shelling out for 'tax'. She didn't have dementia - just terribly naive and trusting when someone purporting to work for a high street bank phoned to tell her she had 'won' this prize. Friends kept telling me I 'must' do something, I 'must' tell the police, but in reality there was nothing we could do - she simply would not believe it was a scam, would not let us report it and begged us not to tell anyone, and the law takes the view that if they have capacity people are free to waste their money as they wish.
In the end her children managed to divert her post and get a phone that only allows trusted callers, but the woman in question still had a husband who understood the problem and was able to cooperate. But by then we were told that about £100k had gone in 'tax' to these evil scamsters.

Thanks for this. I saw a couple of ads in a local paper which I will point out to nephew next time he rings. Poor chap, he's got a bad cough on antibiotics but still off to work so will ring me when he can.
Not sure if he has control of aunty's money.
I just hope she's either been kept in hospital last night or shipped off for respite-if a place can be found of course.

The electric kind are much better for someone frail who wants to operate it themself, (although it runs the risk of your lady keeping it down when you are not there).
Maybe her nephew could involve her in discussion of what to get, while making sure she understands why she needs something to keep her legs up.

Would a nursing chair and footstool do the job? They're very large and comfy with high backs and you can pick them up for under £100 on sales sites. Just a thought.

Thanks Aggie. There was one in the local paper but, needless to say, by the time I got through it had gone!
Will suggest to nephew we try eBay, as you suggest, or put a wanted ad in the local paper.
Another neighbour died recently aged 94 (looks like you're going to be stuck with us for some time!) but again I wasn't quick enough to try to buy it for her.

Try Ebay for a second hand chair , or ask around , we bought one then a neighbour told us we could have had his Mums as she was unable to use it . Actually you just need one that the leg support comes up , they are cheaper , non electric

Yes I agree entirely. Isn't it frustrating? It's like having a toddler/teenager you can't sort out and, sadly, will not improve with time
Have just phoned local recliner shop to ask if she could try one but you have to just buy one and they measure you up first. They cost just under a £1000 so will mention it to nephew next time we speak.
I asked nephew about her comments on money being a problem. He laughed and said that arose because she was getting folks to erect new fences, paint gate etc (which didn't really need doing) and he said that money would be better spent on her care! You have to laugh don't you? Or cry!

Hard when you want to help but I think anyone in their 90s has a right to do as they like. All you can do is offer as you are doing and just be kind to her. If respite care didn't show her what she needs I don't think anything will. for you.

Well. . . . Things move on at a pace!
Thank you all for your replies. I do understand what you all say and appreciate you taking the time.
At 3am this morning she rang 999 and was taken to hospital. I called round on way home from work to find she wasn't there so rang her poor long suffering nephew.
He said he had a call this morning from the hospital to say, as she didn't need nursing care (!), they were discharging her. Social services then rang to say they had offered her more carers but she said unless they came at a particular exact hour she didn't want them. Occupational therapist asked nephew could she walk from chair to toilet/bed. He said no so we're hoping they go to see that for themselves and she'll be taken for respite care again.
He and I are "singing from the same hymn sheet" at least as regards a reclining chair. She is in no fit state to go to a shop sadly.
I may suggest to nephew he gets one in on a trial basis. . . . .
Oh yes, she rang nephew at 9pm last night to come to close the curtains properly. He lives the other side of town and roadworks take ages to get through. I have told him at that time he's to ring me and if I can do it I will.
I rang her at 9.30 asking if I could help get her into bed but was turned down.
Ho hum!
We must all promise not to be like this in our dotage! What do you think? DH has promised me he will behave himself-that will be a first! Lol!

It's lovely that she has you looking out for her but if she's unwilling to have help I wouldn't push it. At that age she is unlikely to accept change and has both her son and carers who are doing what they can. She might just appreciate you visiting and chatting more than you trying to do things for her - often it's just someone popping in a couple of times a day for a visit that helps most.

Sadly you can not always help. During a snowy winter I rang an elderly neighbour and asked if she required anything, I was happy to do some shopping. I got a flea in my ear and told she was perfectly capable of organising her life and her freezer was fully stocked. Good for her, but a "thank you for your concern" wouldn't have gone amiss.

Could the nephew tell her that he wants her to have a reclining chair and take her to a shop to try some out?
Maybe if she tries them she could come round to the idea.