The Big Issue

Me too Nightowl and then you know the money is being used properly.I swapped iver to this methid some years ago.

I don't think this is an urban myth Jess nor do I think it is anti-immigrant propaganda. Like Riverwalk I gained some knowledge of this through a work situation that I can't go into detail about, but suffice it to say there were criminal charges (not directly connected to the BI) and what I found out led me to believe that this was the tip of a very unpleasant iceberg. I sincerely hope that the BI organisation has taken steps to deal with it, but it was sufficient to put me off ever buying it again, that and the fact that it is no longer necessary to be homeless to become a seller. I don't really understand the point of it now that's the case, and prefer to support charities that address homelessness.

Luckygirl I don't know the ins and outs of the system - all I do know is that they spoke of organised families/gangs who take over an area; sellers having to hand over the money to a boss etc. It operated like a business.

It is/was probably technically legal but not in the spirit of the origins of the Big Issue.

I don't want to malign the BI and if anyone can set me straight I'd be more than happy to accept that it no longer goes on.

Help me here Riverwalk - "^All spoke of the Romanian gangs and how they operated^." How do they operate? What is it that they do that is exploiting the BI system and how do they do it?

Jess because you have no knowledge of something doesn't mean it's an Urban Myth.

I knew and chatted to three BI sellers over the years, all genuinely homeless and selling the mag as a stop-gap. I also know people who work with the homeless in various capacities All spoke of the Romanian gangs and how they operated.

And where did anyone say that all Big Issue sellers are the same.

I'm not one to spout anti-immigrant propaganda and resent your inference.

It could be that BI has taken steps to deal with the situation - I don't know. I no longer buy it as prefer to support Crisis instead.

Criminals in all walks of life I guess but we should not assume all Big Issue sellers are the same.

But obviously the Roma Gang myth is something cooked up as anti-immigrant propaganda.

That is appalling Stansgran - I am really sad to think that this happened.

I stopped buying when a local vendor was befriended by a blind lady who regularly bought from her . The blind lady a couple of years ago had built up what she thought was a close relationship with the vendor that she felt when she had come out without any money that she could go to the ATM with her to get some cash. The vendor ended up in prison for pocketing the cash saying it hadn't come out of the machine the first time. That vendor is back now . I've seen her in in other ne cities as well. I feel hatred for her.

The seller who used to stand outside our local Waitrose has thankfully moved on.

He would step out in front of you, usually as you were going in or out of the shop and as anyone who has arthritic knees knows, it's jolly painful having to stop dead or try and step sideways.

I would often stand inside the doors waiting for him to accost somebody then walk out without making eye contact.

There must have been complaints because he's no longer there.

I think that Big Issue sellers are considered 'self employed' so are able to access some benefits. I guess any gang masters may exploit this legal route to benefits, e.g. helping /forcing Roma people to become BI sellers and then guiding them to benefits and taking a 'share' from them.

If there was a will to stop this, and there may be I do not know, the Home Office could make this system trickier for gang masters to exploit.

A Roma guy offered me a BI yesterday in the 'big' town near me but I told him I already had a copy from the lady in my town. He smiled and said .OK thanks, happy New Year! No hassling or nastiness at street level for me.

“ROMA GANGS ARE STOPPING BRITISH VENDORS GETTING MAGAZINES”
We’ve plenty of magazines and plenty of pitches to go around, this has simply never happened. It’s a big world and we welcome all vendors equally no matter where they’re from."

This from the "Setting the Record Straight" section of the Big Issue website.

I am happy to continue to buy a Big Issue (even though I am not mad about the mag) as I do think it helps people to get of the ground. I do not mind if they happen to be Roma - I know a bit about them from working on a national mag for Gypsies and Travellers. There are rogues amongst their number just as there are in the rest of all societies - but I have met many decent folk from their communities. But I am not happy when a vendor tries to avoid giving the right change - this goes against the Big Issue code of conduct and discredits the whole concept.

I have never bought one. Not out of meaness. I have seen a few sellers who I suspect might be doing this as part of a small family business.

I would rather give to the "Vicars relief fund" at St Martins in the Fields, who do a great deal of work with the homeless all around the country.

I think you are right JessM - the idea that Big Issue would allow this to happen is beyond belief, even if I could understand what the process might be.

Sounds like a few urban myths flying around.
There is a regular with a big white beard on our high street. He whistles tunefully, greets people cheerily and last time i saw him was decked out in a tie-dye ensemble to brighten up the gloom. I usually give him a fiver.
At times in the past I've given the cost of the mag, and told them to keep the mag, cos I don't really think I'll read it.

Body Shop used to have something to do with it

Looking at the website, it would seem that registered vendors do buy the mags with their own money at £1.25 each, then sell them on for £2.50. They are given some free to get the off the ground initially. How can these gang leaders become registered vendors? Going into a regional office and buying up huge quantities does not seem possible. The organisation would not give them out in that way.

Are you saying that the gang leaders gather up vendors, get them to register and get the mags; then take the mags back and redistribute them in some way to their advantage?

I cannot see how this works at all. I am sure there are dishonest people out there who would exploit the system to their own ends, but I am puzzled by the process.

I am sure that many vendors out there are E European, far more than to begin with, as many immigrants are strapped for cash. But does this mean that they are part of a gang system?

How does it work?

Is there no governing body for such things as the Big Issue, though? Sorry if I'm being dense/naive .

"Surely this is against the law, though" yeh, that'll scare them off. Maybe nobody has bothered to tell them this in the past 4 yrs that I know they have been doing it.

Surely this is against the law, though?

Luckygirl. I'm afraid your thinking that it's still the same set up as when John Bird had a damn good idea. The sellers don't shell out any money, they haven't got any. The Gang Masters register the sellers and then distribute the copies. It's not a charity anymore, it's business, and not a very nice one.

How can gang leaders buy them all up when the sellers have to be registered with Big Issue and buy the mags themselves from distribution points? I thought that the mags were only sold to registered sellers. I am a bit puzzled here?

I haven't bought one for ages either; can't stand the wheedling.

When it was the nice young man with his dreadlocks, blanket and dog I always bought one from him, but I haven't seen him for ages; it has been taken over by the Romanians.

Petra this fits in with what I see happening around here.There has been a Romanian woman selling the big issue in a local town for at least 15 years.
It's not supposed to be what they do for that length of time. she is always bundled up in gypsy type clothes and is a bit wheedling, I avoid her. I have bought the magazine in the past, from all kinds of people, but now avoid all the Eastern European ones.

The married couple who now clean our cars were Big Issue sellers. They told us how it all works.

Luckygirl. Romanian gang bosses took over the Big Issue years ago. They buy up huge amounts of the magazine and then tell the sellers exactly how to sell them.
Hundreds, maybe thousands of homeless people have been denied the chance to sell the magazine because they are all bought up by the Romanian Gand masters.
And don't forget that once you become a Big Issue seller you are given a National Insurance No. as you are considered self employed. They are not self employed, all that money goes to the gang masters and he/she pays them.
This isn't here say, this is straight from the horses mouth.