Middle Class Problems

My DIL is doing great moomin thanks for asking. I drove her round to the school for a parents meeting the other day and she beat me to the door on crutches. She is really fit so won't be held back in any way. Personality wise she is back to her miserable herself so that is a good sign (or not?)

I couldn't "speak proper" to save me life.

Yes vegasmags it is all in the name isn't it? I mean who the heck would want just tomatoes when you can have tomatoes on the vine for twice the price?

absent I must confess I have at least five toast racks, if only I knew where they were .

anno we inherited nans fish knives and although we don't use them they are precious as she was such a lovely lady. I often come across them in charity shops and the first line of John Betjemans poem Phone for the fish knives Norman from (How To Get On In Society) always pops into my head.

Flickety My Welsh grandparents were definitely working class they kept their coal in the bath for goodness sake. What else were baths for

Gilly - I think it's just broccoli with the stalks on. But of course, we have to have a posher name than that when we are paying through the nose for it

My parents definitely viewed themselves as "middle class" and believed I would only "make something of myself" if I spoke without any regional accent, they even paid for elocution lessons.

I ended up living in two separate worlds, one at home speaking "proper" and one at school with a Yorkshire twang

Btw gillybob how is your DiL? On the mend I hope.

As a group, the aristocratic/upper classes have complicated "rules" that are designed to exclude other people and make them feel inferior. For themselves, they have the confidence to abide by the rules when it suits them or, when it doesn't, to do as they please. (Having said that, I'm sure there are kind and thoughtful "upper class" individuals who do not fit into this generality).

A friend of mine from the 80's (sadly now dead) was awarded an honour for services to the NHS, and attended a function at Buckingham Palace. He was at the same table as Princess Margaret and was appalled at her general rudeness and in particular at the way she smoked throughout the meal.

Silly rules like: say "how do you do?" rather than "pleased to meet you", are a means by which those that aspire to be described as "middle class" try to demonstrate their eligibility.

My definition of a "well bred" person is someone, from whatever social or educational background, who is kind and courteous and who would not knowingly make someone else feel uncomfortable.

I have often wondered why purple sprouting broccoli vegasmags?

Why not just purple broccoli? Can you even get non sprouting broccoli?

My DH doesn't have my silly sense of humour at all and sometimes looks a bit bemused when my daughter and I cry with laughing about something that he just doesn't "get". Sadly sometimes this only serves to make it even more funny.

I have just taken delivery of my fortnightly organic veg box. Dommage, no samphire but thank heavens there is purple sprouting broccoli!

My ex mother-in-law admitted, even boasted, of having no sense of humour. My ex husband liked slapstick and failed to 'get' any of the irony on Monty Python, or even TWTWTW. One more reason to leave him.

I think there has been a long tradition of well-educated people making sneering remarks about the working classes, so it is good to see that the middle classes can now turn the table on themselves.

We are triplets harri and Galen

My father, very definitely upper middle, wouldn't have any truck with things like fish knives and forks but Mum, from a working class family who did well, would agonise for ages about which table cloth gave the better impression. I have two table cloths, mostly used to cover the water mark on the table, and both of them are such a pain to iron that I will move heaven and earth not to use either. And, when they are on the table, they require strategically placed mats to hide the stains

harrigran are we sisters? Your mother sounds just like mine!

I should say that I think there is a difference between poking fun and being cruel. I'm never cruel!

gillybob I can definitely laugh at myself. Because I lived in Surbiton, friends used to call me 'Margo' I enjoyed the joke and played it for what it was worth. 'Such fun'.

I agree janthea fortunately all most of us on Gransnet do have a sense of humour. I think it's important to be able to laugh at yourself before you laugh at anyone else.

My mother was Hyacinth Bucket. She did not have pottery or a mug in the house, loose leaf tea was served in china cups and cake plates always had doilies. Everyday meals were served from tureens at the table and the fish knives and forks were always used. I inherited the fish knives and forks and promptly put them in the attic, afraid I might spoil the bone handles. I don't suppose she classed herself as anything she was just carrying on the lifestyle she got used to when living and working in large houses.

I could never be called PC. I'm happy to poke fun at anyone - provided they have a sense of humour. Otherwise there's no point and they just get huffy and upset.

Hell I don't know Bags why do some people have to over complicate things ? Having a bit of a Geordie accent neither have I, but there again I wouldn't count myself as middle class anyway.

What about middle class people who speak with a northern accent? Never said clarse in my life!

I find the easiest way to tell the classes apart is asking someone to tell you what class the believe they fit into.

A working class person will say (very proudly) "Definitely working class"

A middle class person will say "Oh, Middle Clarse"

An upper class person will say "Darling how rude of you to arsk"

FlicketyB The middle classes do get terribly pretentious sometimes and it doesn't do them any harm to be deflated occasionally.

Greatnan Fish knives were classed as non-U by Nancy Mitford because they were a relatively recent invention and so wouldn't have featured in sets of family silver tableware handed down the generations. So they are middle class or even lower middle class, but definitely not upper.

annodomini I was given a set of six fish knives and forks as a wedding present. As they are the same design as a set of general tableware, they do come in handy sometimes when I have guests and am serving a more lavish meal than family supper. However, they are stainless steel so I don't suppose Nancy Mitford would have approved of any of it.

Why do people worry so much about being PC? About being "approved of" by certain others?

The point is, we are laughing at ourselves. We are laughing at funny things. No need to get all uptight about any of it.

Who cares? The boundaries, as this thread shows, are not clear anyway. Anyone who likes can accuse me of being "classist". I'll still laugh at silliness wherever it comes from.

Would we be accused of being 'classist' if we took the piss out of working class people?

I know that, but I am amazed that the subject is of interest enough to even do that - and why is it always the middle class people feel the need to take the piss out of, never the working class. Would a piss taking thread on that be as popular?

I'd love to tell my sister that, Greatnan! She's the only person I know of our generation who uses fish knives and forks. I used to have some somewhere - wonder what I did with them...