To expect children have enough to eat?

My youngest GS (like his uncle as a child) loves cucumbers and will also raid the fruit bowl when nobody's looking. He and his brother are not fussy eaters and will more or less eat what's put in front of them. When the older one started school, his mum was surprised to hear that even in the reception class the majority of children took packed lunches and she didn't think this appropriate for a child of only just four. She compromised by giving him sandwiches on Fridays but the rest of the week he had school dinners.

gillybob I have a GD just like your's she will raid the fridge for tomatoes and grapes and DD cannot keep up with her some days,she goes to the fridge and not a tomato in sight.Both of my youngest DGCs are skinny minnies not an ounce of fat on them but they are the healthiest of children and they are very rarely unwell all down to the fruit and veg that they eat.Always on the kitchen table is a vast amount of fruit and DD does not find it expensive to provide this as she says it would cost more per week to supply crisps and sweets and convienience foods.

My grandchildren would rather have 2 plates of veg than a pudding any day.

You are right LullyDully many of the children in my granddaughters reception class will not suffer the fruit delivered by " the fruit man". They are usually offered either a small apple, banana, orange or some cherry tomatoes. My GD claps her hands if its cherry tomatoes as none of her friends will eat them so she has an extra large portion. Yummy.

Isn't a frying pan a flat surface and couldn't a small amount of cooking fat be used? It really sounds as if problems are being invented rather than cured! The pudding thing is ridiculous too.

Dresden, I agree with the first two paragraphs of your post. Some parents do get affronted by any suggestion that they might not be giving their children a healthy diet - remember the mothers passing burgers through the school railings when the Jamie Oliver school meals drive was going on?

You'll hear parents say that their children 'won't eat' things like salad or vegetables, but it's usually because they've not been introduced into their diet from an early age. Cold chips, though? I can't imagine who would really enjoy those...

No you are right, some people can not and will not put their children first. Not only the poor are guilty.

When fruit was first given to KS1 cuildren many would turn their noses up at it. We found they got used to it generally.

deeda you use a flat heating surface with a minimal amount of fat on it I guess. As opposed to a frying pan with a big puddle of oil in the bottom..

I think that it is very sad that children don't get proper meals every day, and really it is the parents' responsibilty basically. If they genuinely can't afford to feed their children there are free school meals and also charities that help by providing food for desperate families.

I feel that it is a problem in society. Years ago people felt they had to keep up a certain standard in terms of looking after their families, or the neighbours would judge them. Now it is not considered acceptable to criticise anyone's life choices and if someone has the temerity to do that, they get very short shrift.

I used to have a friend whose children were privately educated but got a very unsuitable diet at home, with meals, if any, at weird times.She would often buy a ready cooked chicken and let them eat it in the back of the car on the way home from school. Other times they seemed to live on a diet of crisps, so it 's not just a question of lack of money.

Do tell JessM how do you griddle an egg? I can't think of any way that would be edible

In spite of both his parents working full time my GS has always had a big breakfast - his best mealo of the day really- and my daughter has always found time to bake cheese scones or cheese straws or similar for his lunch box.

Jess M

May I ask which Education Authority do you reside within?.

You don't have to answer if the question is too personal.

I am just interested as you say many primary schools in your borough don't have kitchens and the free school meals children have a sandwich. Presumably all the pupils have sandwiches or cold lunches.

Sorry..why exactly is it a school's responsibility to teach children to cook and have a balanced diet? Rhetorical question..I know the answer!

In the schools where I was head we did what we could via lessons /breakfast club, adult ed etc but really parents are responsible for this.

I think my understanding of meals and their preparation came from my mum and grandmothers. I did do some home economics..apple crumble, baked apple and shepherds pie as I recall..bit limited but cheap!

Under the Oliver inspired school food police rules a fried egg bap is not considered appropriate breakfast. it has to be griddled.
Many primary schools in our borough do not have kitchens and the FSM kids get a sandwich.
The physical amount of food you get in a cooked "school dinner" these days is quite small. A slice of pizza and some salad is a snack for a teenager not a meal. They are still obliged to serve a "dessert" as part of a school meal, so some of the meagre expenditure goes on that.
When I was a teacher the really hungry boys used to wait til the last serving so they could get seconds or even thirds. Don't get that opportunity these days.

terris, . Nice story. That teacher needed to learn a thing or two.

Obviously this is a contentious issue that is open to a great degree of subjectivity about what is healthy and what is not. I do remember when my youngest was in Year 2 and was/is - like all my children - a 'skinny tin ribs' with a ravenous appetite and energy levels that knows no bounds. Anyway, she eats a healthy, varied diet with little 'junk' food and one day I gave her a Cornish pasty in her lunch box. Not a cheap, mushy one but a 'proper' pasty from a Cornish baker's. She came home and told me that her teacher had said that in future she was to bring a 'proper' lunch and that a pasty wasn't sufficient! We did laugh - I can't imagine a Cornish miner complaining that a pasty wasn't sufficient food! She carried on taking pasties....

Sorry my grammar is all over the place today

I've seen some awful packed lunches. Try telling a parent that two bars of chocolate, a packet of crisps and a fizzy drink doesn't constitute a proper lunch then brace yourself for the abuse.

But even worse is the parent who sends nothing assuming that we wouldn't leave a child to starve.

There's a wonderful charity that provides free breakfasts in schools, for children who otherwise wouldn't (for a great many reasons) eat before lessons begin. Some friends and I are on a sponsored 'healthy eating' plan to raise money for this (and another charity called Mary's Meals).
www.justgiving.com/ourdailybread-magicbreakfast

Not being a parent myself I may be sticking my head above the parapet here but just how long does it take to pour some milk over a bowl of cereal?

I came from what could be described as a deprived background but always had breakfast before leaving for school (the dreaded porridge!) and my mother worked full time in a factory meaning she had to leave home early in order to get the bus to work (no car). She would make the porridge before leaving and my brother and I would heat it up once we were out of bed

I agree with you Jenner it is sad. Mind you I often wonder what planning goes into the school meals at my grandchildrens school. Both of my GD's love good food. they are not great meat eaters (although not veggies as such) they love vegetables, rice etc. Sometimes when I see what is on the menu or more often than not what is left when my eldest eventually makes it into the dinner hall at 1pm I am quite frankly shocked !

The schools get extra money for every child on free dinners as it is a rough marker to poverty within a family.

When I taught we had several children who had a 'sneeky' breakfast because of their inadequate parents. Hunger affects behaviour and it is long time to lunch if haven't eaten since the previous lunch!!

I think it's a sad reflection on a 1st world country that this debate should even raise it's head. As someone who cooked school meals for over 20 years and was responsible for planning, purchasing and preparing nutritious meals for over 400 children everyday, they were always enjoyed by the children and deemed very good value. Everything was made from scratch, fresh vegetable, fish, meat was always served. I like to think that my contribution made up for the shortcomings of parents who didn't or couldn't cook. Very few children brought packed lunches and our lunches were far ahead of the times (aka Jamie Oliver).
Since then I have travelled overseas extensively and met parents who cook fresh vegetables and rice each morning so that their child would have a nutritous meal each day, they were poor but knew the importance of giving their children nutritious food. I'll stick my neck out and say that a parent who sends their child to school with crisps and biscuits for lunch is just plain lazy.

Are you saying the number on any school dinners JessM or just free?

I cannot see how a child having a (paid) school dinner equals deprivation quite the contrary I would say.

Number on school dinners is used as an indicator of poverty/deprivation. Hence the extra money per head if a child is registered for FSM.
It is not always lack of money - it is lack of having your act together as a parent for whatever reason. Little boys given £5.oo in the morning and spending it all on superacridacidgobstoppers was my biggest shocker when visiting before school.

I think breakfast clubs are a really good idea for younger children especially if both their parents are working.

I am also not sure we should necessarily be looking to schools to impart basic information like "Give your child a meal" Certsinly not blaming them for the shortcomings of selfish parents who do not appear to have a clue. But school Home Ec. never taught me anything of future use - nor, except by example did my sainted mother. OK who is to teach young people then? Well I suppose it does come down to some sort of Home Ec. (and I DO NOT mean "home technology) or parentcraft/basic survival /nutrition etc education. But what an indictment of society.