Modern attitudes

Reminds me of the story a while back where 'begger' (charlatan) was exposed as not only having a roof over his head but was making a very comfortable living out of begging. So maybe it was him and he'd dined well the evening before! If you're cold and starving you'd eat anything surely. Or even scrape the tuna out if you'd die for your cause!

Vegetarianism isn't a pseudo religion, so no beliefs to be suspended. Just because you are homeless doesn't mean you have to give up your principles or your ability to make choices. The person buying the meal was very kind; the homeless person does not have an obligation to accept that kindness. This does not negate the kind act, nor mean that the homeless person is ungrateful. And the story should not put anyone off buying meals for people sitting in doorways - they are all individuals who will react to generosity in different ways.

He's as much entitled o his code of ethics as anyone else! Why should being on your uppers mean you have to abandon your honestly held beliefs?

When I buy food for someone homeless, I always ask first if there is anything they can't eat. For instance I am allergic to fish so if, God forbid, I was ever in that situation I also would have to turn down the sandwich. Surely by asking first you would be giving him some dignity in being able to choose what he eats.

It's even possible that some of the kindest and most socially aware people are sleeping on our streets.

A lovely Christian friend of mine was about to buy hot sausage rolls for her and her husband one lunchtime when she spotted a man sitting on the street. He looked like someone in need and she was reminded that Jesus said whenever you 'feed the hungry' (paraphrased, but you get the drift) you are feeding me. So she bought an extra sausage roll and offered it to the man. He very politely refused on the grounds that he doesn't eat pork. My friend's response was to smile to herself - and as she recounted the story to me later she said, 'of course he doesn't eat pork - he's Jesus'!

As to the man mentioned in the OP - when you have very little materially it becomes very important to hold on to your sense of who you are and being vegetarian is clearly a major part of this man's identity.

At Christmas I cooked a halal meal (chicken) for our Muslim guests, a traditional Turkey and trimmings meal for our Malaysian guest, but the homeless man I was cooking for loves birds and said he'd rather not have a Christmas dinner if it was going to be a bird. I made him roast beef!

jingl that's so true. There are are sorts of people living on the streets, from a huge variety of different backgrounds. Many of those I've met have been very generous with what little they have. One man busks and buys himself what he needs from his day's takings (usually not very much and often just about enough for a hot drink) and then puts the remainder of his money (usually pennies, but on a good day maybe a pound or two) in a charity collection box. When I pointed out that if he saved that money it would be better for him he told me there are others in need who may be worse off so he wants to help them. His actions may not be sensible, but I do admire his kindliness and thought for others.

Because the man is homeless why should he be expected to surrender his belief that eating animal flesh is wrong? God knows how little self respect ad pride he has left why rob him of more

Maybe the man wasn't ravenous and thought the muffin and hot drink was sufficient, and the tuna roll could be given to someone who wasn't a vegetarian. It could be that he was ravenous but still held on to his beliefs.

I think we all know that many everyday average folk become homeless, no doubt long-term vegetarians, Muslims, etc among them.

Thank you for the responses. They are more or less what I expected–I've no problem with that, btw–but I can't help feeling that a hundred years ago such a story would probably not have cropped up. I mean the part about refusing a particular kind of food on principle, not the part about people being kind.

And that's why I titled the thread "Modern Attitudes". I think our approach (in developed countries at least) to food has changed a great deal because of its relative abundance nowadays and the amount of choice we always have.

I used the term pseudo-religious with some misgivings. I understand people's objection to the term but I decided that it was suitable because, as far as I'm aware, until fairly recently, rules about what could or could not eat by certain groups of people were only laid down by religions. I think most food rules are still religious in origin though that is also changing in the modern world.

The man in the OP is course a product of the time in which he lives - he knows that if he turns the tuna down he won't literally starve to death, assuming he's living in this country. So I suppose you're right about it being a 'modern attitude'. But that doesn't make him any less sincere.

As an aside, a Muslim scholar once told me that they can eat pork if the alternative is starvation. Of course as with any religion their written words are subject to interpretation.

Which religion practices vegetarianism ?

"Vegetarianism is strongly linked with a number of religions that originated in ancient India (Jainism, Hinduism and Buddhism). In Jainism, vegetarianism is mandatory for everyone; in Hinduism and Mahayana Buddhism, it is advocated by some influential scriptures and religious authorities."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarianism_and_religion

Jains are vegetarians - they even don't eat certain 'living' plants.

They are the only ones that I know of.

The Hindu diet is mainly vegetarian, but it's probably because they don't eat cows. They can eat chickens but there's not enough to go round.
We don't eat meat away from home, and when we've visited India there has always been a delicious selection of veggie dishes on offer.
They eat fish, but like chicken there's not much about, so they've really worked on developing a veggie diet.

Back to the OP - I always give beggars a couple of euros then they can spend it as they want. My Mum once had a beggar at her door and she gave him 10p and said "Don't spend it all on beer!"

When I said that I think most rules about food came from religions until recently, I was not just talking about vegetarianism. It has been during my life time that the RC Church abolished the rule about not eating meat on Fridays (I guess they didn't count fish as meat but it is, being animal flesh). I think many Jews still won't eat pig products, Muslims want halal meat, etc. All these are food rules springing from religious traditions. It makes sense because food is so central to people's lives and, like rules about sex, it was a way of exerting control over people's lives for whatever reason.

Re the situation in the OP, I think the reason I feel uncomfortable about it is because if I were ever in such a situation (there but for fortune) my main concern would be to show gratitude to the kind person who was giving me the food. My feeling of wanting to show gratitude would over-ride any objections to the particular food that was being offered. I'm not saying others should feel like this, only that I do.

It is now fifty years this year since I became a vegetarian, I could not knowingly eat meat. It just would not go down, I would be physically sick. If I ever ended up lost in the desert with nothing to eat but meat I would have to starve.

Well, he could have taken it and then thrown it away when the giver had gone, but that would mean being complicit in the eating animals/fish trade. No. You shouldn't expect that of him.

It wouldn't mean complicity. The purchase had already been made.

Anyway, I've decided (and said!) that it's what I would do in that situation, not what others should do.

FAYE you take words like starve into your mouth and say such a thing. If you were starving you would eat anything. Starving people eat grass and snails and insects and drink poisoned water and give it to their babies. Never talk about starving unless you have really been there!

But the man could well have shown gratitude Bags which you say would have been your first concern.

Gratitude for the bun & drink and declining the tuna roll. Nothing ungrateful there - he was being offered something that he didn't need or want.

Should a blind man allow himself to be taken across the road by someone who mistakenly thought he needed the other side, in order to show gratitude?

You're right, riverwalk, and the story did say that he appreciated the bun and hot drink.