Makerfield. I wonder how it’s going!

I would like to stay up and watch the count but I think I'll have to call it a day.

I dont think I can stay up until the predicted at the very earliest 3am...

10pm
The polls are closed now.
We await the results.

MayBee70

From what I’ve read on Facebook Makerfield has been a pretty unpleasant place to be today.

Indeed!

From what I’ve read on Facebook Makerfield has been a pretty unpleasant place to be today.

I am not as knowledgeable as MaizieD but I do know that if you (government’s) spend on infrastructure it creates employment which keeps money in circulation.
Expecting big corporations to build infrastructure whilst creating jobs, it also creates extremely rich people who exert influence over governments

(Sorry for simplistic explanation, I am nodding whilst GS (11yr) educates me on the World Cup)

MaizieD

Casdon

We don’t all share your view though MaizieD, as I’m sure you know.

So what is your explanation for poverty and extreme wealth side by side in the same country? Privatised utilities dishing out their profits to shareholders yet expecting consumers to foot the bill for infrastructure improvement? Wages still at the same level in real terms that they were nearly 2 decades ago? Any services still run by the state having funding cut to the bone?

I'm genuinely curious. Do people think that a nation's economy runs by some god given natural laws and that there are no alternatives?

You tend to present your preferred model as though everybody else, including all previous governments, is wrong, when it’s actually just a model MaizieD That’s fine, but you have to accept that others don’t think the system is fundamentally broken - or think that there’s more to running a country than purely the economic model. I don’t want to fall out about it, just don’t assume we are all dumb because we see things differently.

ronib

There’s no point in worrying about Farage becoming PM in 3 years or so …. IMO

I completely agree

MaizieD I'm not as knowledgeable about political policy as you - I've just had to google 'neoliberalism'. However, surely privatised utilities (which I object to) were brought in by old Maggie and her Tory cronies? How would you solve the problem? Genuine question.

He has just rolled out Hugh Grant to support him, buying the consent of a vulnerable woman is not acceptable in my world. The misogyny of the middle class is somehow seen as different.

Iam64

I hope Andy wins. I wish the Labour Party wasn’t in this mess, we need strong, reliable government not back biting and chaos.

Andy B will be an asset at Westminster. Rob the sexist not very bright plumber - would not be an asset anywhere

Completely agree. Can’t understand how Reform’s vetting has produced so many terrible candidates. Trying to explain his comments as ‘banter’ is not acceptable in my world.
Burnham has the experience, passion, and ideas to really sort things out.

Otr are they just happy with the way things are now?

Casdon

We don’t all share your view though MaizieD, as I’m sure you know.

So what is your explanation for poverty and extreme wealth side by side in the same country? Privatised utilities dishing out their profits to shareholders yet expecting consumers to foot the bill for infrastructure improvement? Wages still at the same level in real terms that they were nearly 2 decades ago? Any services still run by the state having funding cut to the bone?

I'm genuinely curious. Do people think that a nation's economy runs by some god given natural laws and that there are no alternatives?

We don’t all share your view though MaizieD, as I’m sure you know.

David Milburn and Yvette Cooper are neoliberal economy to the core, heavens, Cooper ids even married to an ex neoliberal Chancellor. . I'm not too sure that Burnham isn't neo lib, but he has made some promising noises. Neo liberal economics is what has put the country into the state it is in now and is keeping it there. The UK doesn't need even more of it.

MollyNew

Wyllow3

Oh , I grieve Yvette not getting a chance, Iam. Different course to history, hey?

I have often wondered how different history would have been if David Miliband had won instead of Ed. David seemed to have all the right qualities to be an excellent leader at the time.

I agree. I was really hoping he would come back to politics before the last election. I really like Yvette Cooper too, she’s a doer, with a steel backbone.

Wyllow3

Oh , I grieve Yvette not getting a chance, Iam. Different course to history, hey?

I have often wondered how different history would have been if David Miliband had won instead of Ed. David seemed to have all the right qualities to be an excellent leader at the time.

Yes indeed Wyllow. We went to three hustings during that campaign, both agreeed Yvette streets ahead of the others. I didn’t feel Andy was ready for leadership, didn’t trust Corbyn or feel he could win an election. I’d voted Foot. Loved him but realised post election the country would never vote a pm they saw as to left. My hopes for Starmer have been diminished by Keir, not by anybody else.. it’s hard to reconcile his good management of the party pre winnning the election with the mess more recently

Ah well

LemonJam

Fallingstar

MayBee70

If Burnham was a responsible politician he wouldn’t renege on his promise to the people of Manchester. He’s using the people of Makerfield and letting down the people in Manchester. I’m ashamed to be a Labour supporter at this moment in time; these shenanigans are as bad as the previous government with its musical chairs approach to its party leadership. And at a time when the government should be showing a united front against the threat from Russia.

I agree. Despite wanting Burnham to win so that Reform don’t get the seat the fact is that there should never have been a by-election, the whole think is rigged and Burnham has shown his true colours as a man prepared to stoop to any lengths to displace a man elected by the people just two years ago. Am wondering how long he has been holding a knife ready to do the dirty on Starmer.
Streeting is no better. Or Healy for resigning instead of hammering out his grievances with Starmer, obviously he is looking for a good position with Burnham.
The whole thing stinks to high heaven.
And as the Tories found out, this revolving door politics doesn’t help the country but helps careerist politicians to help themselves.

On the other hand Burnham, if he becomes MP and then if he becomes PM- may be the positive change the LP and the country needs.

He made his MP bid only after Labour's dire local election results. If he achieves the positive change needed for the party and the country that will be a good thing.

This by election is not rigged. Makerfield residents will make their own secret ballot decision.

Starmer was ruthless to get to where he is as PM. Twas ever thus for all PMs - needing to take their opportunities where they see fit and ruthlessly compete for the top job. Politics has always been a ruthless game at the top.

No. He’s been sniping from the sidelines ever since the election. From memory I’m sure he was criticising the PM when there were some riots, taking part in the doctors strike ( although that might have been pre election; so much has happened I have lost track…oh but need to point out the recent dispute with the doctors has been resolved but, as usual it doesn’t make the headlines). He was just waiting for an opportunity to overthrow the PM. How can the election not be rigged when the sitting MP has stood down for no reason other than to get Burnham back into parliament? An unnecessary by election and mayor election that is going to cost the taxpayer a lot of money. Imo it stinks and I’m furious about it.

MollyNew

I hope Burnham wins. The Reform candidate comes across as thick as two short planks. I wouldn't want him as my MP, whatever party he stood for.

I'm probably putting my head above the parapet here but I like Keir Starmer, he reminds me of Gordon Brown. Both sincere, socially minded public servant types with some good ideas who go into politics for all the right reasons but are/were not able to connect with the public for some reason. We need decent people in public life but the media demands "personalities" and therefore we get self serving egomaniacs like Boris Johnson, Liz Truss, Farage etc popping up, causing endless noise and deceiving people into thinking they have the answers to all our problems.

Hear, hear MollyNew.

I’m not a fan of Burnham, and I really dislike the way a ‘path to Westminster’ has been cleared for him. However, I hope he wins the Makerfield by-election.

I am happy with KS and I want him to remain as PM.

What I wish is that all Labour MPs would remember they’re on the same side, and would work together for the good of the country. In-fighting does them no favours and turns the electorate against them.

I’d like to see AB and KS present a united front against fascism … for the good of the UK.

PLEASE!!!

Oh , I grieve Yvette not getting a chance, Iam. Different course to history, hey?

I voted Starmer in the last leadership campaign. I’m disappointed he’s proved to be so poor at communicating with and managing his back benchers. He’s good on the international stage but is unpopular in the country, no getting away from that.
I voted Yvette Cooper rather than Andy when Corbyn won. I’ve often thought if Andy and Yvette had agreed one of them should pull out, the other would have won and we wouldn’t have had Corbyn, a disastrous leader.

Since then. Andy has imo matured, gained confidence and experience. He’s a great mayor here in Manchester. He’s also visible and supportive to our excellency young Labour mp but equally willing to work cross party. I understand MayBee’s concerns and I support Starmer in many ways but we must face reality.

If he wins the by election, Andy will be an asset in Westminster

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

Oh and please can someone sack Rachel Reeves 🤞🏻

Perhaps she'd then join the tory party, which is where I'm sure she belongs...

Why do you think Reeves belongs with the Tories? Should Kemi Badenoch ever be PM she intends reintroducing the 2 cap benefit which seems to be Reeves pride and joy. Can't see the two of them getting on.

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

Oh and please can someone sack Rachel Reeves 🤞🏻

Perhaps she'd then join the tory party, which is where I'm sure she belongs...

Yes

GrannyGravy13

Oh and please can someone sack Rachel Reeves 🤞🏻

Perhaps she'd then join the tory party, which is where I'm sure she belongs...