Assisted dying bill passed.

I have got mixed feelings about this issue as I know many people have.

Although I can absolutely see how dreadfully cruel it is for some terminally ill folk to have no way out at the present, I fear very much that, despite assurances to the contrary, it could be abused and extended to for instance, depressed people.

This bill only applies to people given a period of 6 months left to their lives. They also have to be capable of requesting the drug. What I don't understand is why so many people are conflating other issues, such as people who are disabled and/or incapable of making the decision.

Mollygo Because your Mother wishes for something else does not make this a licence to kill.

A young woman who has had cancer for 10 years was interviewed this morning and she is in favour of it. To look at her you would not know that she was ill. She is waiting for her next scan to check whether the meds have stopped working.

I am supportive. Have watched too many loved ones enduring, and I mean, enduring long drawn out impossible pain before the end. For those who say palliative care is the way , sorry, but no matter how "good" that may be it never alleviates the agony .
Horrendous to watch people you love so very much in such pain.

I’m with your late husband on this Kalu. My own darling man has Stage IV cancer and it is incurable. We are of course devastated but he is ‘well for now’. He too has an extremely high pain threshold and end of life care with inadequate palliative pain relief plays on his mind.

We sent a man to the moon more than 50 years ago and yet reassuring pain relief seems beyond the medics because of arbitrary constraints. Beyond tragic. No-one should have to suffer like that in this day and age. It’s cruel.

Kalu, what happened with your DH is why, on balance, I am in favour of the start of a change to the legislation. I appreciate we all have our own views on this emotive subject though.

Whitewavemark2

I’m of the mind that I’m pleased people are being given the choice, but I feel very strongly that care and in particular palliative care should be top class before I would consider choice to be absolutely in a proper balance.

Upgrading Palliative care would be much more expensive than just requiring a vote to kill people off.
Based on my Mother’s wish not to die, but being placed on a pathway anyway I see this as a licence to kill.

It is not The Assisted Dying Bill, it is The Terminal Ill (Adults) End of Life Bill, which is not the same thing. I'm pleased it passed, I think many people will feel reassured that should the process of dying become too difficult for them, they have a way out. In practice I think many people will sign up fearful of the process of dying but not choose to take their own life, this has been the case in Canada and other countries. Certainly if I had a terminal diagnosis that I knew came with the potential to cause a distressing and painful death, I would consider it.

Kalu I agree wholeheartedly with you, beautifully explained. I had a similar experience with my DH.
There will be many more discussions, parliamentary committees and votes etc. before it becomes legal.
Deepest condolences to you, they are never forgotten. Life is never the same.

I just don't know. I can't decide one way or the other but, bottom line, I suppose I'm a bit worried that this has passed. There's still a way to go though and tight changes can be made. Oh dear. 🤔

I am pleased this got through. I watched both my lovely parents die in excruciating pain despite doses of morphine. Their deaths were certainly not peaceful or dignified. I don’t want to put my children through the same helplessness as I experienced in not being able to help or comfort them.

If they are making the rules the same as in Oregon USA then doctors can elect to not participate so doctors who do participate might be scarce.

Smileless2012

I'm pleased it's got through this initial stage. It was pretty close; 330 votes to 275.

I didn't think the result was that close - not as neck-and-neck as the media had been predicting, at least.

Absolutely disgusting decision. Look to Canada for the terrible problems it has caused there. And I speak as one who has 2 close relations with stage 4 cancer.

DH had a very high threshold for drugs. No amount of morphine, fentanyl, diazepam mix killed his pain. On the contrary, such a mix resulted in nightmarish hallucinations to terrify him but still in agony.

His personal desperate view of the world and not being religious, didn’t believe in any god.

I’m so relieved to hear this. I haven’t been listening to the debate. Much as I approve of it I don’t want to think about it too much. I do wonder, as someone that worked in the NHS, which doctors will be ok with working in this area and how hospices will deal with it. I never understand why hospices are charities when they play such an important role. I know this is a bit morbid but the only reason why I haven’t signed up for Pure cremation is the worry that I might one day have to take myself off to Dignitas. As with making a will, power of attorney etc, the passing of this bill means that I don’t have to overthink it. I just hope all the necessary safeguards will be put in place.

I'm glad that the bill has passed the first vote.

I'm pleased it's got through this initial stage. It was pretty close; 330 votes to 275.

Whitewavemark2

I’m not convinced of your argument twinnytwin because the ability to take one’s life is finally decided by the courts and the doctors will not be to euthanasia people, the fatal drug will be self administered.

Where is this drug stored before it is taken?
How soon would it be given to the patient and where would they store it, presuming they do have control over when it is taken?
Does it have to be issued by a doctor? What if this doctor isn't there at the time of request?
What is someone else gets hold of it ie family member, and uses it themselves or on someone else?
I suspect these are the sort of things that have been taken into account- have they?

What a Pandora's box we have opened...

Kalu

MissInterpreted

There's a long way to go yet before it become law. I just wish we could have a similar law here in Scotland.

À step in the right direction.

Me too wishing we could have it in Scotland MissInterpretated

DH had a letter published in The Herald explaining that his experience of end of life care left so much to be desired and further, being in his shoes you would understand why a law for assisted dying would be a blessed relief not only for him but his family having to witness his deterioration in constant agony.

The weeks before DH died in late August this year, he was begging for more pain relief. Sadly the highest doses of legal pain relief no longer touched the excruciating pain he was enduring. He was begging our GP for help, she was in tears explaining to DH that her and I would face being arrested should we assist in following out his wish.

I had a similar experience when my Father died 40 years ago. My sister who was a nurse explained to me that the doctors could not overdose a patient because there's always be someone who would report them.

Vets do not want to euthanase healthy animals but accept that sick dogs and cats can be put to sleep. They will recommend that the pet goes to a shelter until a new home is found. One of my pet dogs was a case. He was 6 and the vet refused and he was taken to a shelter where I found him.

It's an awful decision which will impact the most vulnerable.
I always thought it would be the gender nonsense that made me leave the labour party but apparently not, it is this decision which has been the final straw. And yes I know it was a free vote.

I'm sorry your husband had to go through that experience, Kalu.

It was a point I had made when I argued for the bill to be passed - there are some diseases where pain relief just doesn't work. And no amount of exceptional palliative care would change that.

Cast iron fail safe ? Not in human nature

I’m not convinced of your argument twinnytwin because the ability to take one’s life is finally decided by the courts and the doctors will not be to euthanasia people, the fatal drug will be self administered.

I'm not sure how I feel now it has passed. I watched a lot of he debate and was impressed with speakers from both sides.

I asked my MP to vote against it but haven't had time to check yet. I don't supposeshe would have taken notice of me anyway.

It isn't a massive vote in favour. There are lots of checks to be made before it even gets to another vote. However, I feel a sense of inevitability that we are moving into a society which puts solittle value on human life.

So, yes playing God I think so, but it seems people believe these days they are their own Gods so it is difficult to stand against this desperate view of the world.

We need compassion yes, but we also need care.

I keep thinking of Dylan Thomas' poem; 'Do not go gentle into that good night,
old age should burn and rave at close of day
rage, rage against the dying of the light...'

I for one will not go gentle either... for anyone's convenience. I hope to go very noisily indeed!

MissInterpreted

There's a long way to go yet before it become law. I just wish we could have a similar law here in Scotland.

À step in the right direction.

Me too wishing we could have it in Scotland MissInterpretated

DH had a letter published in The Herald explaining that his experience of end of life care left so much to be desired and further, being in his shoes you would understand why a law for assisted dying would be a blessed relief not only for him but his family having to witness his deterioration in constant agony.

The weeks before DH died in late August this year, he was begging for more pain relief. Sadly the highest doses of legal pain relief no longer touched the excruciating pain he was enduring. He was begging our GP for help, she was in tears explaining to DH that her and I would face being arrested should we assist in following out his wish.