Oracy in state schools

Joseann

I think Starmer might have missed the point a bit, that it is small class sizes that gives children the opportunity to express themselves confidentally and as individuals. With the best will and teaching in the world, once you get over 20 or so pupils, surely there just isn't the time and conditions to do this individually and effectively?
The result is there will be many who struggle or who miss the opportunity.

I would say that you can, with effective planning and differentiation. A well-briefed TA is very helpful as well.
(Have observed it many times).
My children and grandchildren were all in state schools with large classes.
Going back even further my independent school had small classes and some of the teaching was utterly dire.

I'm not sure we need a ton more graduate teachers with a prescribed agends at pre school level. More teaching assistants might be a better bet.

I think Starmer might have missed the point a bit, that it is small class sizes that gives children the opportunity to express themselves confidentally and as individuals. With the best will and teaching in the world, once you get over 20 or so pupils, surely there just isn't the time and conditions to do this individually and effectively?
The result is there will be many who struggle or who miss the opportunity.

Whitewavemark2

Oh I am surprised, perhaps you will give me a list of them when you are back🙂

John Bowlby and the 1950s spring to mind....
Have always thought that was more about keeping women in their place.

Yes my GC were also in nursery from a very young age. Both bonded very closely to both parents and us🙂. One just finishing his electrical engineering degree and considering his future the other still undecided as to what he wants to do.

ronib

Ww2 I think the mother child bond is paramount and sending babies to nursery when weeks old and introducing oracy is not going to pan out well in the long run. How about enabling parents to be with their children in the early years?

My children were in nursery from the age of two. One is a senior comms professional and the other is a language teacher.
My grandchildren were in full-time nursery from four months. Both highly successful academically and excellent presentation and communication skills.
Doesn't seem to have done them any harm....
😂

Oh I am surprised, perhaps you will give me a list of them when you are back🙂

Ww2 yes there’s a load of books on the subject but have to go out to help with my granddaughter now.

ronib

Ww2 I think the mother child bond is paramount and sending babies to nursery when weeks old and introducing oracy is not going to pan out well in the long run. How about enabling parents to be with their children in the early years?

Is that an opinion or one based on evidence?

Ww2 I think the mother child bond is paramount and sending babies to nursery when weeks old and introducing oracy is not going to pan out well in the long run. How about enabling parents to be with their children in the early years?

In my school in Glasgow, oracy was always a major focus.
Primary 7 pupils from every primary school in East Renfrewshire, were invited annually to speak at the Provost's debate in the council chambers.
The Provost chaired the debate, with topics chosen by the pupils themselves.

As for no drinks, all our children had water bottles on their desk, provided by the school. Water is essential for brain power.

ronib

Ww2 some problems will be ironed out then only to be replaced by other issues? For example poor family bonds and relationships.

Sorry, I don’t understand you?

Ww2 some problems will be ironed out then only to be replaced by other issues? For example poor family bonds and relationships.

Lollin my 6 year old expressed frustration at not being allowed to have a drink when he was thirsty. I was surprised by his response. School routine can seem quite draconian to the more creative children.

Lollin

Yes ronib I have heard the very real frustrations of teachers on just the basics like behaviour and speech in their young pupils. One of the problems is getting some families onboard otherwise things like communication are discouraged. It’s not a simple area to fix.

That is why Labour are concentrating on early years and sure start.

Babies go to nursery now at a very young age (-weeks or months) and it will be part of this curriculum as well, so that by the time children arrive at primary school a lot if these problems will be ironed out.

Yes ronib I have heard the very real frustrations of teachers on just the basics like behaviour and speech in their young pupils. One of the problems is getting some families onboard otherwise things like communication are discouraged. It’s not a simple area to fix.

I remember the emphasis on talking and listening when I was training in the 1960s, and ever after. Many, not all, children are articulate and able to express themselves clearly, but listening skills are lacking and need as much attention.

ronib

Oracy is surely embedded in the mother baby relationship from the day of birth?
Seems to me that schools actively dissuade verbal communication as listening to the teacher takes precedence?

My under five year old grandchildren are well advanced in verbal communication but my eldest 7 year old is finding some aspects of learning extremely tedious! I think it’s the whole learning package which needs to engage and sometimes doesn’t.

No it is far more than that.

Oracy is surely embedded in the mother baby relationship from the day of birth?
Seems to me that schools actively dissuade verbal communication as listening to the teacher takes precedence?

My under five year old grandchildren are well advanced in verbal communication but my eldest 7 year old is finding some aspects of learning extremely tedious! I think it’s the whole learning package which needs to engage and sometimes doesn’t.

Mamie

Speech and listening are skills that need to be developed from the very beginning so I hope there will also be a return to something similar to SureStart and a focus on pre-school.

With regard to early years- Labour are hoping to mend the damage caused by the Tory government and looking to recruit graduate teachers in order to prepare the children better for school.

I remember it being part of the National Curriculum when I taught upper juniors in the 1990s.

Speech and listening are skills that need to be developed from the very beginning so I hope there will also be a return to something similar to SureStart and a focus on pre-school.

I'm very supportive of any move in schools which aims to improve oral communication. I believe that the simple yet vital art of conversation has suffered badly in recent years, largely because of the predominance of social media and internet-based communication. We're social beings, and speech is central to establishing meaningful contacts and to making society work and prosper.

I am also pleased to see that he is talking about recruitment and retention which need to be the absolute priorities for school improvement.

I didn’t know that, but it seems that hopefully more importance will be put on this skill. It is part of Labours plan to open up opportunity for state school chikdren and remove various barriers along with the old fashioned attitude towards academic and vocational qualifications.

Positive ideas.