Can a woman have a penis?

VioletSky

glorianny and Wyllow

I truly believe women are powerful and will say again that we should be building each other up and not tearing each other down and I'm all for any branch of feminism (doesn't have to be intersectional) that loves and supports all women

Except for abusive women and all the harm they cause

They deserve nothing from any of us

Oh I definitely support women and girls.

Doodledog

Glorianny

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

You're saying that as though others have said differently.
We haven't.

If someone wants to have sex with a woman, (like my friend did), and finds herself in a bar with a man in a dress, why should she be called a TERF for rejecting the idea?

Deception is wrong in any form.

Presenting (pretending) as a women in order to woe and have sex with a lesbian is morally wrong in every shape and form.

I would strongly object to being called a TERF

glorianny and Wyllow

I truly believe women are powerful and will say again that we should be building each other up and not tearing each other down and I'm all for any branch of feminism (doesn't have to be intersectional) that loves and supports all women

Except for abusive women and all the harm they cause

They deserve nothing from any of us

Glorianny

DiamondLily

Glorianny

Ilovecheese

Who says they have to ask nicely as if they are supplicants? They are adults who can articulate what they need better than anyone else. We no longer say "does he take sugar" to find out what a disabled person might need, we ask them to tell us, because they know best.

That's because disabled people handcuffed themselves to trains, or glued themselves to pavements, demonstrated and disrupted everyday life. Which many of us supported. God help them if they tried it now.
Transpeople who try are roundly condemned for it.
So are the Extinction Rebellion people.

Wooah...I'm part of that disabled community. Yes, some did the more radical stuff, that's true. But the rest of us just quietly campaigned for certain things - disabled loos, lifts in railway stations, accessible transport, accessible shops etc.

None of that impacted on the able bodied. Nothing. In fact, a lot of this helped the able bodied.

So, please don't compare that to this trans stuff - nothing similar.

Sorry you feel insulted DiamondLily but the vilification of anyone who now takes radical actions to pursue a cause upsets me. You are quite entitled to think that your writing and campaigning changed things, most of the people I know who took part in the demonstrations would disagree with you.
The feminists I knew at the time supported them. Some of us had children who have disabilities and we wanted a better world for them.
There were many able bodied people at the time who opposed this. There are still people who fail to understand or recognise the social model of disability.
And many of those people do think that catering for the disabled impacts on them. That's why it is still so difficult for disabled people to get proper financial support. That's why they have to be cross examined and tested and are still refused help.
Demonstrating for something you believed in has always been part of obtaining rights for minority groups. It is now difficult, if not impossible, to do.

Well, you know what you think you know. As someone disabled I know what I know.

For many people, accessible transport, lifts etc. helped them - even young parents/older people cheered at lifts etc

I know what it's like for disabled people - I've spent over 20 years helping them get what they're entitled to.

I spent over 2 years in a wheelchair.

I've walked (or not) the walk. Have you?

If not, please don't tell me how it is,

Glorianny

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

Agreed.

Consensual.

Glorianny

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

Agree

lemsip

VioletSky You say;

( Yet many on this thread who answered "no" are happy to use the words "trans women" and are forthright in saying that, they accept trans women are valid.')

well I said NO and am not as you say 'happy to use the word trans women' !!

if you are not born with a penis anything added is makeshift, imitation ect ect. so there!

I obviously wasn't appealing to your better nature then

Glorianny

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

Finally we agree on something 👍

Glorianny

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

You're saying that as though others have said differently.
We haven't.

If someone wants to have sex with a woman, (like my friend did), and finds herself in a bar with a man in a dress, why should she be called a TERF for rejecting the idea?

VioletSky You say;

( Yet many on this thread who answered "no" are happy to use the words "trans women" and are forthright in saying that, they accept trans women are valid.')

well I said NO and am not as you say 'happy to use the word trans women' !!

if you are not born with a penis anything added is makeshift, imitation ect ect. so there!

I'm with Mrs Patrick Campbell on this
My dear, I don't care what they do, so long as they don't do it in the street and frighten the horses
Sex should always be consensual. End of.

DiamondLily

Glorianny

Ilovecheese

Who says they have to ask nicely as if they are supplicants? They are adults who can articulate what they need better than anyone else. We no longer say "does he take sugar" to find out what a disabled person might need, we ask them to tell us, because they know best.

That's because disabled people handcuffed themselves to trains, or glued themselves to pavements, demonstrated and disrupted everyday life. Which many of us supported. God help them if they tried it now.
Transpeople who try are roundly condemned for it.
So are the Extinction Rebellion people.

Wooah...I'm part of that disabled community. Yes, some did the more radical stuff, that's true. But the rest of us just quietly campaigned for certain things - disabled loos, lifts in railway stations, accessible transport, accessible shops etc.

None of that impacted on the able bodied. Nothing. In fact, a lot of this helped the able bodied.

So, please don't compare that to this trans stuff - nothing similar.

Sorry you feel insulted DiamondLily but the vilification of anyone who now takes radical actions to pursue a cause upsets me. You are quite entitled to think that your writing and campaigning changed things, most of the people I know who took part in the demonstrations would disagree with you.
The feminists I knew at the time supported them. Some of us had children who have disabilities and we wanted a better world for them.
There were many able bodied people at the time who opposed this. There are still people who fail to understand or recognise the social model of disability.
And many of those people do think that catering for the disabled impacts on them. That's why it is still so difficult for disabled people to get proper financial support. That's why they have to be cross examined and tested and are still refused help.
Demonstrating for something you believed in has always been part of obtaining rights for minority groups. It is now difficult, if not impossible, to do.

Doodledog

VioletSky

Dildos come in all shapes but many are penis shaped

Many lesbians like penetration

A dildo, even penis shaped is not man

A trans women being able to get sexual gratification while satisfying a partner who is attracted to her is great

And also none of your business 😉

As I said, if two people are happy with that setup, then good luck to them.

The problem arises when one party wants to have sex with a woman (dildo or not - that's up to her too) and the other wants to penetrate her with a penis.

I would have thought that was obvious. Or was it an attempt to twist what was being said. You (wrongly) accuse others of doing what you do yourself all the time.

What sex toys any consenting couple use, however they identify should be private

It should also be truthful, unlike the female identifying as a man who after dating another female for many months raped her with a strap on dildo and was consequently found guilty of sexual assault by the courts.

NanaDana

Can a woman have a penis? Yes, any time she wants one, but it pays to be choosy... Ooops... Am I going to get my first "deleted by Gransnet?"

Well, I hope your post is not deleted. It's to the point.

I surely pray I'm always only with my own husband and not some random stranger, dressed as a woman, choosing to attack.

VioletSky

Dildos come in all shapes but many are penis shaped

Many lesbians like penetration

A dildo, even penis shaped is not man

A trans women being able to get sexual gratification while satisfying a partner who is attracted to her is great

And also none of your business 😉

As I said, if two people are happy with that setup, then good luck to them.

The problem arises when one party wants to have sex with a woman (dildo or not - that's up to her too) and the other wants to penetrate her with a penis.

I would have thought that was obvious. Or was it an attempt to twist what was being said. You (wrongly) accuse others of doing what you do yourself all the time.

VioletSky

diodledog you quoted me and still twisted what I said

I'll add you to the naughty list

No more presence

Well that might make some sort of sense if you tell me what I said that 'twisted' your post.

NanaDana as is often said when referring to jokes the old ones are the best 🤣🤣🤣

I wonder how men (who actually are born and still identify as men, that is) feel about women who identify as male going into their toilets, changing rooms etc. I've never seen any concerns expressed about that.

Can a woman have a penis? Yes, any time she wants one, but it pays to be choosy... Ooops... Am I going to get my first "deleted by Gransnet?"

VioletSky

Dildos come in all shapes but many are penis shaped

Many lesbians like penetration

A dildo, even penis shaped is not man

A trans women being able to get sexual gratification while satisfying a partner who is attracted to her is great

And also none of your business 😉

You brought dildo’s into the debate, VioletSky

diodledog you quoted me and still twisted what I said

I'll add you to the naughty list

No more presence

Doodledog

VioletSky

Glorianny has hit the nail square

Trans women are a minority

Should we not give to cancer research if we haven't had cancer?

Should we not donate to the homeless if we haven't been homeless?

That would be showing your privilege, saying any group is beneath your help because you have not experienced it and should look after themselves

Also it's anti feminist

It is not anti-feminist to not see intact men as women. It is very entitled for intact men to assume that this should be the case.

As for all the other preachy nonsense - yes, of course people can give to charities without having experienced the need for them. That goes without saying in my world.

What does not go without saying is that it is up to women to find ways for men to be allowed into our spaces. What makes people think that when we say that we don't want them there we not only don't mean it, but we should have to find ways to make it happen? Anyone with a modicum of respect for women would see that that is insulting. It's a very patriarchal way of thinking - 'the little woman doesn't know her own mind - how can she when she is saying no to men?'

I agree Doodledog I would go further and say that it is misogyny at work

Dildos come in all shapes but many are penis shaped

Many lesbians like penetration

A dildo, even penis shaped is not man

A trans women being able to get sexual gratification while satisfying a partner who is attracted to her is great

And also none of your business 😉

Yeah I always get those two mixed up. The times I have accidentally popped a penis into my bedroom drawer.

VioletSky

Glorianny has hit the nail square

Trans women are a minority

Should we not give to cancer research if we haven't had cancer?

Should we not donate to the homeless if we haven't been homeless?

That would be showing your privilege, saying any group is beneath your help because you have not experienced it and should look after themselves

Also it's anti feminist

It is not anti-feminist to not see intact men as women. It is very entitled for intact men to assume that this should be the case.

As for all the other preachy nonsense - yes, of course people can give to charities without having experienced the need for them. That goes without saying in my world.

What does not go without saying is that it is up to women to find ways for men to be allowed into our spaces. What makes people think that when we say that we don't want them there we not only don't mean it, but we should have to find ways to make it happen? Anyone with a modicum of respect for women would see that that is insulting. It's a very patriarchal way of thinking - 'the little woman doesn't know her own mind - how can she when she is saying no to men?'