Gary Lineker's tweet

If Linneker has been involved in selling arms to Saudi Arabia I dont approve of that either, but that probably is libel

This from the UN on the subject of freedom of speech:

"The need to preserve freedom of expression from censorship by States or private corporations’ is often invoked to counter efforts to regulate hateful expression, in particular online.

Freedom of opinion and expression are, indeed, cornerstones of human rights and pillars of free and democratic societies. These freedoms support other fundamental rights, such as to peaceful assembly, to participate in public affairs, and to freedom of religion. It is undeniable that digital media, including social media, have bolstered the right to seek, receive and impart information and ideas. Therefore, legislative efforts to regulate free expression unsurprisingly raise concerns that attempts to curb hate speech may silence dissent and opposition."

This from the current UN General Secretary -

“Addressing hate speech does not mean limiting or prohibiting freedom of speech. It means keeping hate speech from escalating into something more dangerous, particularly incitement to discrimination, hostility and violence, which is prohibited under international law.”

Seems pretty clear to me.

I honestly thought he'd gone to itv

Sorry but no it's not clear. Who gets to decide what is hate speech. Who do you give that power to. It's a massively complex subject.

Is this why so many BBC alumnus go to Global?

Shelagh Fogarty; Eddie Mayer; Andrew Marr?
Ditto Emily Maitliss ( The News Agents pos cast)

Alumni, Fanny 😀

growstuff

Does anybody know about the protocols for a Nikah ceremony? My daughter and soon-to-be son-in-law are holding one in a few weeks. I guess it would be rude to tell my future son-in-law that he and his family are blighting our lives.

DD and I went to one several years ago.

Had a lovely time, It’s different from a Hen Do as the groom and his male relatives were there.

Delicious food and lots of Bollywood Dancing the wedding party females all had their hands and lower arms painted with the most intricate henna designs.

I hope you enjoy it.

MawtheMerrier

Alumni, Fanny 😀

Hilarious. Cheers

Sorry Maw, that was incredibly grumpy of me.
I’ve had a shite day

Galaxy

Who gets to decide the incitement to hatred bit then? Can I decide that?
Taking money off a country that stones gay people to death is in my view incitement to hatred.

This is the point I was trying to make earlier, although as I understand it, Qatar executes by firing squad or hanging, both of which are in my opinion, cruel and degrading punishments.

I support Lineker's right to say exactly what he thinks. I support totally and wholeheartedly free speech for everyone. The BBC may not agree with me re Lineker but that’s between him and them, and I would understand their point of view if they feel he has not stuck to the terms of his contract.

However, I do not support Lineker’s position and silence re taking money from a regime that executes its citizens, although apparently it’s rather quicker to execute citizens from other countries, and then sounding as if he is virtue signalling re the migrants in small boats. It sounds two faced to me! A life in Qatar is just as valuable as the life of a migrant travelling to the UK, but silence is definitely golden when the Qatari regime is paying him over a million for a couple of weeks work.

I don't think he should have taken money from Quatar contract or if he did should have given it away.

However I fail to see how the tweet currently under discussion has anything to do with "virtue signalling." Are those above here agreeing with him "virtue signalling?" The refugee organisations "virtue signalling?"

He is stating a strongly felt POV on a different topic.

GrannyGravy13

growstuff

Does anybody know about the protocols for a Nikah ceremony? My daughter and soon-to-be son-in-law are holding one in a few weeks. I guess it would be rude to tell my future son-in-law that he and his family are blighting our lives.

DD and I went to one several years ago.

Had a lovely time, It’s different from a Hen Do as the groom and his male relatives were there.

Delicious food and lots of Bollywood Dancing the wedding party females all had their hands and lower arms painted with the most intricate henna designs.

I hope you enjoy it.

Hopefully the groom will be there! My understanding is that it's a blessing for the couple. It will be in a mosque.

He is comparing the government to nazis I strongly feel that if he wants to use that comparison maybe the brave thing to do first is to use that term about a country who executes gay people. I am afraid it is linked and is a lovely demonstration of cowardice really. Crikey how hard is it to call the Tories nazis, a three year old could do it. Less easy is saying that in a place such as Qatar. I think the Tories policy is loathsome by the way. I think Linnekers behaviour was loathsome too. I defend his right to say what he likes, I am not sure I expect the BBC to be the first defender of free speech without a societal commitment to it.

He is comparing the government to nazis I strongly feel that if he wants to use that comparison maybe the brave thing to do first is to use that term about a country who executes gay people.

You seem to be saying that no-one is entitled to say anything adverse about our country unless they have condemned another country's regime first?

Or is this a bit of whataboutery? What about Qatar, it's far worse than the UK?

Lineker is absolutely correct. What we are hearing from our government is the language of fascism. Would you deny that, Galaxy?.

Are only the morally pure allowed to point it out?

Lineker was right. Some members of this government are using the language of Nazism - they're almost following the same script.

And some of the "people" are behaving in the same way the "Volk" did in 1930s Germany. The parallels are disturbing.

If a few minutes ago you took money to support a regime that carries out similar practices to the nazis then I think its perfectly reasonable to point that out. It's not whataboutery its pointing out hypocrisy. I wouldn't take advice from Johnson for example on telling the truth.
I have been really clear on my view of the policy, I am also really clear on my view of Linnekers behaviour.

Expecting the poorest and most vulnerable UK citizens to absorb a disproportionate number of the new arrivals (with the resultant pressures on local services, schools, GP surgeries, and hospitals) was always going to lead to certain deprived communities being less than enthusiastic about accomodating them. That doesn't necessary come from a place of bigotry.......more desperation.

It's also why many working class people see middle class enthusiasm for taking in refugees as consequence-free virtue signalling. It's easy to be altruistic if it comes at no personal cost.

Galaxy

He is comparing the government to nazis I strongly feel that if he wants to use that comparison maybe the brave thing to do first is to use that term about a country who executes gay people. I am afraid it is linked and is a lovely demonstration of cowardice really. Crikey how hard is it to call the Tories nazis, a three year old could do it. Less easy is saying that in a place such as Qatar. I think the Tories policy is loathsome by the way. I think Linnekers behaviour was loathsome too. I defend his right to say what he likes, I am not sure I expect the BBC to be the first defender of free speech without a societal commitment to it.

He didn’t call the Tories Nazis, he said language used by some Tory politicians was not dissimilar to language used in 1930s Germany.

And once again: he did - whilst in Qatar - condemn their record on human rights, both directly in his opening monologue and during a lengthy and detailed discussion that he hosted instead of the BBC showing the open ceremony.

It quite annoyed Qatar:

Qatar has been left unimpressed by a portion of the BBC’s coverage to date and let it be known this week through Hassan Al-Thawadi, secretary general of the Supreme Committee. Accusations of racism were levelled. A host nation treated unjustly, he said.

“The reality is, a lot of the coverage, the way the BBC covered the opening ceremony, the way Gary Lineker (the BBC’s lead presenter for football) took three minutes (to criticise Qatar), they never bothered to do that with any other tournament,” Al-Thawadi told talkSPORT, another British broadcaster.

Quote is from ThevAthletic, a football journal, but lots of other media covered it. Although the entire programme doesn’t seem to be available, the opening monologue referred to above is on YouTube

Galaxy

If a few minutes ago you took money to support a regime that carries out similar practices to the nazis then I think its perfectly reasonable to point that out. It's not whataboutery its pointing out hypocrisy. I wouldn't take advice from Johnson for example on telling the truth.
I have been really clear on my view of the policy, I am also really clear on my view of Linnekers behaviour.

I agree.

If Linneker has an agreement with the BBC about the sort of things he shouldn’t say, and has already broken this agreement once before, it’s up to them what they do now, a slap on the wrist, or told he’s a naughty boy or give him more time to type tweets by firing him.
Maybe he’s got so much dosh by now that he doesn’t care and will sign up with ITV.

growstuff

And some of the "people" are behaving in the same way the "Volk" did in 1930s Germany. The parallels are disturbing.

Oh for goodness sake. Unbelievable!

What group do you think he was referring to in 1930 s Germany Siope?

If Linneker has an agreement with the BBC about the sort of things he shouldn’t say, and has already broken this agreement once before, it’s up to them what they do now, a slap on the wrist, or told he’s a naughty boy or give him more time to type tweets by firing him

What he said in Qatar was on behalf of and sanctioned by the BBC, so I understand.

That’s some leap there growstuff are you wearing your 7-league boots again this evening?