Sajid Javid tells US: We won't block death penalty for Isil 'Beatles'

My brain, the rational part that I like to think is the real me, totally disagrees with the death penalty for all the reasons stated on this thread BUT there is another part of me which says ‘if you can dish it out then you should take what’s coming to you’ or ‘those who live by the sword ....’

I think their crimes were so dreadful, so inhuman, and as these scumbags were brought up in this country then the irrational part agrees with the Queen of Hearts. I’d not just sentence them to death, I’d order their heads be hacked off with a blunt blade. That was good enough for their victims.

The death penalty is ABSOLUTELY the right decision, and I would like to see it reinstated for other vile criminals too.

Just think about the alternative for these: they are put in prison and even if it is supposedly for life, you can bet that some idiotic bleeding hearts liberal do-gooder would campaign for their release.

Until we (hopefully after Brexit) are freed from the awful Human Rights legislation, that could easily happen.

Make sure these men have no access to lap tops or telephones
That should be an absolute fundamental of the loss of liberty - but unfortunately it is not.

I agree with your post Iam64 but I do wonder how far we should go in opposing the justice system in other countries?

I oppose the death penalty under any circumstances. I understand why some believe it to be appropriate in cases like these but I can't agree that an eye for an eye is ever the right course of action.
Lock them up, life should mean until these men die. Prisons should not be cruel and inhuman places. What impact would that have on staff working in prisons? Make sure these men have no access to lap tops or telephones. If their loved ones want to maintain contact, let that be by the exchange of carefully monitors hand written letters and by visits which are supervised at all times.
Don't allow these men to seduce other prisoners into their disgusting ideology.

I don't agree with the death penalty in any circumstances. It is murder by the state .

I agree that some people are so dangerous that they should remain in prison for life. I do not think that it is necessary or right that prisons are hopeless and unbearably cruel places. I believe that a life spent in prison is punishment enough and society itself is demeaned if it stoops to ill treatment. What purpose does retribution serve?

put

I understand that Javid had a say because the UK had said it would not cooperate in the men's trials unless an assurance was given that they would not be out to death. As I understand it the men could not be taken to the US from where they are being held by US-backed Kurdish forces in Syria without the UK's agreement because UK has evidence which it would not give without the no death penalty assurance.

Perhaps Javid has decided that as it is not a civil matter but in effect a war matter that that makes a difference.

It says something about our justice system when we have to send these murdering lowlife to another country to get justice for their innocent victims.

It also gives their families ...who aren't killers or criminals ,the chance to have some contact with them
If this was a child of mine I would disown them paddyann and want no further contact with them.

I would feel utter shame.

I am not sure. I do not always agree with the ideas that some other countries have regarding 'justice' such as stoning women to death because they have allegedly committed adultery - but I do feel that the USA has got things right as regards life imprisonment meaning life and not a short sentence as it is here in this country. Imprisonment and throw away the key for certain crimes.

However, this may deter others from having the same ideas, in particular silly teenage girls who go out to Syria to join jihadists only to lose their own lives there.

Would we want the USA to interfere with our justice system? I think the answer is no, so I think that perhaps Sajid Javid has got it right. Rather they are sent there to face justice than sent to a UK prison for 8 or so years, only to be let out and commit crimes of terror on our soil.

Surely a punitive life sentence degrades the prison officers and solitary confinement is against human rights. So they could be heros in jail or require constant protection for life. Punishment is composed of several elements, deterrence being one. Retribution is another. In this case I think the death sentence is the best answer.

As they are no longer British citizens, it is not for us to decide. America can try them, judge them, and punish them.

Winterwhite
is the decision his to make on his own
That's his job!! What's the point in having a job title, taking the money and then when the big decisions have to be taken looking round for someone to share the responsibility with?

And to me too Blinko.

I am no supporter of the death penalty but in this case there is incontrovertible evidence to prove that they "committed the worst crimes since WW2" (according to Radio 4 this morning). Because of their pride in what they did, they filmed it all. Hard to dispute it now, isn't it?
Whatever happens to them, whether it's life in solitary confinement or the death penalty; I hope they suffer as much as their victims did.

Chewbacca, it seems to me they are simply playing the system.

I'm stunned that they're complaing that because their British citizenship was revoked, that they now stand little chance of getting a fair trial. Didn't seem to bother them that James Foley, David Haines and Alan Henning didn't get a fair trial before they beheaded them.

Don’t support this. A backward step. I too am surprised at Sajid Javid. Is the decision his to take on his own?

Sajid weighs in and don't disagree with him. Shouldn't he be questioning whether we can have a referendum on reintroduction of the death penalty in UK?

As we've stripped them of British citizenships, can we still stipulate what happens to them?

theres no way we should be supporting the death penalty ,we got rid of it for many valid reasons.IF these men are guilty then imprison them and throw away the key .Thats far worse punishment than a quick death in my opinion.It also gives their families ...who aren't killers or criminals ,the chance to have some contact with them .If its what they want .Otherwise you're punishing innocent people as well as the perpetrator of the crime .

I heard part of the interview with James Foley's mother on Radio 4 this morning, just at the point when she said she wanted justice, not vengeance. She did not want them to be executed, because their deaths would only provoke more violence and confer martyrdom on them, but she did want them to be locked up until they died.

She also said in response to Martha Kearney's question, that she did not think the US would take kindly to the UK or anyone else interfering in their trial because of objections to the possible outcomes.
An unbelievably courageous woman.

^baggs*true on all your statements.did you know some true lifers actually petition to be executed?do not know if any have succeeded.seems like there have been a few.
under the premise that life without parole was cruel and unusual punishment.
unfortunatelly most of the so called rehabbed ones do it for other reasons,extras- like more time outside,put in population rather than a "lockdown' or segregated unit.for access to more things including victims, drugs etc.
annie we don't hang them but there have been innocents executed.this onus should be on the cops and courts though.bad investigations and poor defense lawyers.the prisons have no dog in that fight.

i don't agree with all this instituion advocates but without them things would be worse.
www.aclu.org/other/death-penalty-questions-and-answers

American prisons can be brutal. Seeing as they'd probably welcome death, looking forward to their eternal paradise, I'd rather they were locked up for the rest of their sorry lives.

And I agree, KatyK. It makes me so angry to hear them referred to as the Beatles.

Proper life imprisonment. In solitary confinement. Forgotten. There’s a lot to be said for the oubliette.

I don’t agree with the death penalty. Partly in case the decision is wrong and partly because if it’s right it’s too easy, too quick, and as in this case, they’ll become martyrs and die happy.

Yes Baggs , there have been reports of prisoners in American prisons asking for their lives to be brought to an end.