The Irish question

Do any other countries have a border with the EU?
What systems do they use to manage their borders?
Why are their systems not appropriate for the Irish border?

This is not an issue unique to the UK.

Why is saying the EU want a united nation, a new country, Project Fear Maisie? It's never been a secret that that's been the aim from the outset. Even Churchill wanted it (only fewer nations). One currency, one defence force, no borders, legislation and taxation from Brussels with individual government or assemblies as we have in the UK at present.

You are all getting so over excited and emotional about the Irish border question, as if you yourselves are required to come up with the answers.

I really do object to other people reprimanding me, on an open forum, for the level of excitement or emotion that I use in regard to a particularly difficult part of leaving the EU. I do not want to leave; I did not want to leave. I am entitled to be as emotional as I choose about something I do not believe to be a good thing.

ps in ref. to this topic - the Irish question and its complications was one of the things never mentioned.

Maizie - a good post (rant). My thoughts and feelings too.
What most people don't realise is that before we joined the EU there was a long debate in Parliament, more than a week, where both parties acknowledged that by joining, the UK. would lose some of her sovereignity. The general population were informed of it all.
In the years following, we signed various treaties and trade deals entangling ourselves even more in obligations and financial duties to the EU.
All this was completely ignored in the introduction to the 2015 referendum.
Why?

Did you see Duncan being made mincemeat of today- he clearly has NOT got a clue and used the word 'we hope' about 5 times in a few minutes

Don't the people in government represent what we want or are we not in a democracy? I thought the whole point of leaving the EU was to have control over what happens not allow a group of people to do whatever they like regardless of how we feel/what we believe?

Yes, somebody has to Tegan2 but it won’t be anybody on GN, it will be those in government who do, it isn’t going to be on the back burner to sort itself out.The government has to negotiate this with Eire and NI and the EU, it’s tricky no doubt about it, but it will be arranged.

Well, someone has to come up with an answer; the government clearly don't have one . Buy, hey, it'll all sort itself out won't it...

You are all getting so over excited and emotional about the Irish border question, as if you yourselves are required to come up with the answers.

Yes maizieD so it was a rant from you then.

maryeliza

But I do think poor lemon has problems with English word meanings from time to time. A 'rant' is usually emotional and light on fact...

True!

Never any danger of a rant from you lemon

What a rant from you MaizieD

We are nothing like Catalonia nfK so don’t trouble yourself on that score.

This is one of the political threads where I lurk rather than posting a lot, because the unpleasantness can be so off-putting. For example, nigglynellie's description of Scotland and NI as 'baggage' - and presumably Wales too. Scotland voted 62% for Remain, nn, and some of us see the Little Englander Brexiteers as 'baggage'. This 'baggage' is slowing our economy and making us part of a laughing-stock to other countries. I am very sorry for our English Remainer friends, who don't have even the possibility of a breakaway, such as we have, although GGMk2 is not alone in wondering about the North of England...

As usual, no Brexiteer has come up with a list of advantages we are going to get from this shambolic Brexit, should it happen. I'm living in hope that it doesn't.

You've heard it too Maizie! I have mentioned before that I 'watch' another forum which is all older people and the men in particular, when you read the vocabulary they use, are fighting a war they were too young to be involved in.

That is partly where the xenophobia comes from. Equally the idea that this country is always, in all ways better than any other, (except where there are immigrants) and can do more and better than any other country, as long as we don't give people benefits unless they prove themselves worthy and are preferably starving at the time (just as people did during and before the war apparently).

BUT ... I have just seen a post from one of the grumpy old Brexiteer's saying we need to understand what this is going to do to our children's children. A bit late but perhaps some thinking is beginning to be done.

Other people I read do that for me too Smithy. How sad though that we are in this position and see this upheaval for our country, our children and out grandchildren based, basically, on lies and an ignorance of our democratic process.

I don't think I want to be part of that new nation ...

We might as well give in now and realise that we’re heading towards being a small part of a new nation

That is Leavers' 'Project Fear', too.

Particularly those who still haven't managed to get over WW1 & WW11.

'So, yes we do want the negotiators to stop making things difficult and start being just a bit constructive'. No; I think they're just struggling to make our negotiators [I use that term loosely] understand what our obligations are and how complex the issue is for everyone.

Oh dear, looks like we’re stuck then. We might as well give in now and realise that we’re heading towards being a small part of a new nation, a bit like Catalonia. I suppose I’m just not of the right mind set to be ready for that and I fear I never will be.

GGmk2 - you and Maisie express so well all the things I feel and fear about leaving the EU.

I think this article illustrates the point I'm trying to make; that understanding of the complexities of Brexit is extremely poor.

www.irishtimes.com/opinion/kathy-sheridan-why-is-british-public-so-ignorant-on-brexit-1.3308465?mode=amp

'lofully'
Fat fingers and a tablet 'touch' keyboard. And that was after editing